Without being told first, can your ears tell whether an LP is digital or not?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by The Good Guy, Oct 1, 2014.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Robin L

    Robin L Musical Omnivore

    Location:
    Fresno, California
    I remember back around 1982, had one of my first systems with audiophile pretensions, a Dual [recent belt drive, not vintage idler wheel] with Grado cartridge, NAD 3020 amp, nice little 2-way mini-monitors, great imaging and recovery of ambience. The local record shop—Rhino Records, Claremont CA—had plenty of 1950's/early 1960's classical LPs in great shape for very little money—Living Stereo, Living Presence, Stereo Blue-Back Londons, shiny looking small label imports from the UK—and I was gorging on those. This was also the time when the word "Digital" first appeared on LPs and I could tell the difference instantly. The hall ambience on the digital recordings just sounded wrong, prematurely fading out and losing a lot of color and texture on the way to digital black. Modern LPs with Hi-Rez digital masters or intermasters can sound good but something like the recently reissued Beatles mono LPs or an original Grey label Capitol LP of Frank Sinatra sound extraordinary. Sorry to say but a couple of recent LP productions by Rosanne Cash and The Decemberists sound dead in comparison.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2014
    Slick Willie likes this.
  2. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    This always makes me remember another question / scenario:

    You go to a restaurant and ask for your favorite dish... let's imagine some pasta, Fettuccine Salmone (I love that!).

    You eat it. :)

    Can you tell, without being told first, whether the cook had washed his hands or not to prepare your meal?

    In any case... what would you prefer? Washed Hands or Dirty Hands?

    :D

    Not saying that the difference can be heard or not as a rule (in my experience, yes, it usually can), but isn't this much more of an authenticity issue than anything else? I myself like authentic stuff ;)

    As for sound quality, being told first or after is not something that really changes anything... in my experience, usually, 100% analog sounds better, more transparent, more vivid, and with less limitations to frequency extension and/or transient response... also decays and spatial queues sound more real usually.

    Can it be made with digital step and still sound great? Sure! They do it every day! :) Is it the absolute best, with higher potential for ultimate vinyl sound? No... and it's not authentic :p

    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2014
    LavidDange likes this.
  3. David Ellis

    David Ellis Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    The guys at my hifi dealer, Bradys, all with many years experince of equipment and even equipment design, believe that there is definitley a psychological aspect to this i.e. we hear what we want/expect to hear. I repeat, I'd love to do some blind listening tests with those that claim they can hear the difference. A lot of my classical LPs from the 80s sound awful but I don't put that down to them being digital just bad mastering.
     
    delmonaco likes this.
  4. BurgerKing

    BurgerKing Forum Resident

    That's an honest dealer. I think most guys working in high end showrooms go out of their way to sound like Stereophile writers.
     
    Dan C, dino77, Tommy SB and 1 other person like this.
  5. Sill Nyro

    Sill Nyro Forum Resident

    No unfortunately.
     
  6. BurgerKing

    BurgerKing Forum Resident

    I agree with you. But it's that "known" part that causes me to question my conclusions.
     
    David Ellis likes this.
  7. David Ellis

    David Ellis Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    Why unfortunately. It means you can enjoy without thinking this is digital it must sound awful:laugh:
     
    BurgerKing likes this.
  8. David Ellis

    David Ellis Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    I have to say I've not experienced that many but most of those I have tend to be passionate about music. And the guys at my dealer have quite heated discussions about the "musical" qualities of components which I enjoy immensely:winkgrin:
     
  9. SergioRZ

    SergioRZ Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Portugal
    The "known" part applies equally to almost everything else... by nature, Humans do not "see" what they don't know... everything is constructed based on perception, perception is made of the "known"... this applies to audio, video, literature, cold atom fusion, and just about everything else. Take this to the extreme and the latest theories say that we all live in a 3d holographic projection from the edge around the inside of some black hole, nothing is real... our senses are not even here... (yes, this was recently published recently in major scientific publications). Why open this can?

    There is only one way to go about this issue. Either you want it, or you don't. I've made my choice... I want it! I value the knowledge, I value authenticity. For me it's really important, because in the end, that makes all the difference... I like "washed, clean hands" :D

    As a secondary way to deal with it (what we can hear or not), I'm happy with my findings, but I'm not making it the center touchstone of my choice.
     
  10. Nielsoe

    Nielsoe Forum Resident

    Location:
    Aalborg, Denmark
    I like to think I can, but to be honest I never ever tested myself. My most recent vinyl buy is Wo Fat's The Conjuring. It sounds very much like an analog recording to me! Anyone knows?
     
  11. AlienRendel

    AlienRendel Senior Member

    Location:
    Chicago, il
    Not sure I can tell analog vs. digital, but I can usually tell a bad sounding record. I've heard vinyl sourced from 44.1/CD quality files and been able to figure out it was digital based upon the sound, but I have also heard well-done vinyl from high-res files and been perfectly happy with it.
     
    ShawnMcCann and LavidDange like this.
  12. Bruno Republic

    Bruno Republic Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Not usually, except in extreme cases like the record I got recently which had one track sourced from an MP3.
     
  13. Henry Love

    Henry Love Senior Member

    Location:
    Chicagoland
    I wouldn't say 100% of the time but most of the time.That's why I generally buy used.Shouldn't be a guessing game.
     
  14. curbach

    curbach Some guy on the internet

    Location:
    The ATX
    I don't know why you want to mix topics in this thread, but I'll chime in here to say I have found several cases where I prefer a re-cut to an original lp (speaking of "vintage" re-cuts like your Bowie example, not modern ones). I would still say as a general rule first pressings are better, but exceptions abound.

    As to the main topic (is it the main topic? I'm not sure :laugh:), I do not have extensive experience listening to digitally sourced lps so I cannot say.
     
  15. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    No. I can't tell. I can tell if the mastering is bad, though, and that's what's important to me.
     
  16. goombay

    goombay Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dixie
    yes i can tell if its recorded on the pro tools
     
  17. David Ellis

    David Ellis Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    So, Frank, when you're mastering is it digital or analogue or some of each? As you see I'm in the no camp although if I had a really high end system I might be able to differentiate but I doubt it.
     
  18. quadjoe

    quadjoe Senior Member

    If it's well mastered, I can't tell. For me, the mastering makes all the difference. I've bought several recent Lps and most, if not all, are digitally sourced. Some sound amazingly good (Coldplay Ghost Stories) while some sound dull and lifeless (Snow Patrol A Hundred Million Suns.) Now, I love getting new vinyl that's been remastered from the original master tapes, like Steve's very excellent remasters. The earliest digitally sourced Lp I own is ABBA The Visitors (1982), and I've always felt that was pretty well done, nice dynamic range and well balanced sound, but it isn't perfect. Oh yeah, don't waste your time looking for an analog source for that album, it was recorded straight to digital, it says so on the album jacket. Excellent songs, though. I highly recommend it for that reason alone.
     
    delmonaco and c-eling like this.
  19. Lownote30

    Lownote30 Bass Clef Addict

    Location:
    Nashville, TN, USA
    I master some of each. Digital can sound great if mastered properly and put to vinyl. Especially hi-rez digital (which I prefer to master from if it's going to be a digital source).
     
  20. Schoolmaster Bones

    Schoolmaster Bones Poe's Lawyer

    Location:
    ‎The Midwest
    This brings me back to Deadwood:

    Cy Tolliver: Cy Tolliver, Mr. Wolcott, how do you do? And, what do you drink?

    Francis Wolcott: Kentucky bourbon, if you've got it.

    Cy Tolliver: Pour Mr. Wolcott a bourbon, Jack, and tell him it's from Kentucky.
     
  21. The Good Guy

    The Good Guy Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    UK

    I put the Original pressing comment as a footnote but basically it boils down to the same thing. Can people really tell a difference or is just " part of the pose " to prove oneself is a purist audiophile.
     
  22. EdogawaRampo

    EdogawaRampo Senior Member

    Exactly. I just set the needle down on a digital sourced vinyl record and I wish to gawd it had been done analog. From 1991 and there is no air in the flutes, the voice, too, lacks life, there's kind of sterile deadness to it that's a real shame considering the flutes, acoustic guitars, etc. Oh well...I still like the music, but really this is a stripped down simulacrum of what it could have been. Like you said, clean, clear, detailed but all the air has been pressed out as if flattened between two sheets of glass.
     
    LavidDange, George Blair and Nielsoe like this.
  23. Anyone who says they can tell an analogue recording source from a digital one in the majority of cases is full of it. I know I can't and I've got plenty of both. I also have a significant collection and vast amounts of listening experience on a more than adequate or decent playback system. The gap between the two is getting narrower and narrower and I think that's excellent news. The MOV releases are all digitally sourced, but they are done with a great degree of quality control and excellent vinyl...I welcome them with open arms.
     
  24. Mike in OR

    Mike in OR Through Middle-earth...onto Heart of The Sunrise

    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Quite easily. Although, I do have a few digital LPs that are soooo gooood, you would be hard pressed to distinguish them as being mastered digitally.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2014
  25. kozy814

    kozy814 Forum Resident

    I would say yes, generally. The caveat here is that a badly mastered analog LP that is overly compressed might sound like what we all have come to consider as "digital-sounding". A well sourced/mastered digital LP can sound quite good. The distinction is that a well produced and mastered analog LP is spaceous in between instruments with a deep soundstage. Even the best digital LPs are flat with good separation.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine