Your ideas for a "real world" 10k -15 k system....or "if you had your time over what would you buy?"

Following on from a post I made in your favourite amplifier thread, I thought for abit of fun I would see what system everyone would put together for 10k - 15k, which I suggest is about the real world average spend for most audiophiles (although probably not in one lump). Again most of us don't have the luxury of dedicated listening rooms, or if we do, it is a spare bedroom or converted garage, not a purpose built shrine to the Audio Gods. Personally I live in a 2 bdrm apartment with our large open plan lounge / dining room. My speakers have to live close to walls and can't be very imposing. My wife hates hi fi but loves music. She really hates cables everywhere. Room treatments are out, so that means I have to have a limited range speaker or I will excite room nodes. I have neighbours (and a wife) so cannot listen at more than 70db on average, with peaks at 80db.


I think we all realise that as we go up the food chain the resolution increases, but so do the problems - you get past a certain point and you begin to hear what is wrong all the time, not what is right. I tend to focus my attention at a level beneath that point, as it's important for me to be able to enjoy eg Radio Swiss Classic streamed at 64 AAC as well as the better quality recordings I have. I reckon 10 - 15 k is fair game for such a system.

Now 10-15k is for the complete enchilada - cables the lot. I suppose to level the playing field we should stick to new. Oh and I'll assume a computer of some sort for digital server duties (which can include a NAS as in my case). And it be either digital or vinyl - its too hard to do both for that budget.

The only thing I would request is that it is a system or components you have owned, have heard or otherwise have a good idea about.



So I'll start:

Speakers: Easy for me - Proac D18's / LS3/5a or Spendor DS1's or Harbeth P3ers - all around 3k. AT a pinch the Harbeth 30.1's at 5k.

Amplifier - again easy for me - a Leben CS 600 - around $6k. Jadis Orchestra Reference a close second for 3.5k

Source Digital - The cost of good digital seems to be coming down all the time. To me most of the converters sound pretty similar (in the sense of they sound different but not obviously better or worse) outside of the uber converters (over 20k eg Emm Labs, Ypsilon, Goldmund ) which I find remarkable. This is very much down to personal taste.

I like everything from a Teac UD 301 ($550) or two box Valabs ($300) or Schiit Bifrost ($550) up to an Abbington Research DP 777 ($5k) as a front end. Depending on what I spent on speakers I'd be inclined to buy as well as I could on the dac front. I don't especially care for the Sabre implementations I have heard but again that is all down to personal flavour. One thing is certain, I tend to get used to what I have pretty quickly, and so don't miss what I don't have.

Source TT - again easy for me - a WTL Simplex, a Dyna XX2 cart & a Dyna P75 III in PE mode (all up about 5 k). Looks terrible sounds great. AR Green Links cables for the WTL - or other heavily shielded cables.

Cables - I'm not much of a cable guy, not because I don't believe, but because I find they produce the least profound changes at the system level that I play in. In 100k plus systems (of which I have heard quite a few - it is good to have audio nutter friends) you can instantly tell the effect of a change in power cable. Indeed even with my Magico S1's you could hear a change in any cable readily enough (long story short they were sold to buy some S3's but I retreated before they materialized).

That said I luurve Crystal Cable, and the Piccolo line is fairly accessible to most. Personally I use Graham Slee cables - cheap and good. I'm sure in the USA you will all have your favourite budget brands eg Anti Cables or Blue Jeans.

 

Hmmm... My system would be close to yours. Simplex turntable. Denon 103r cart. O/93 speakers. LM 518 amp. Eastern Electric phonostage. Puts me a couple hundred over 15k. No digital.

 

A pair of Sennheiser HD800's and a good tube amp to run them. The rest get a cheap integrated and a 6" 2-way for background music.

 

Source: Naim CD5si - around $2k

Amp: LFD integrated (can't recall model #) - around $4k

Speakers: DeVore O/93 - $8k

 

nice idea for a thread hope can get many opinions.

can we go used?

 

I am pretty happy with the small system I have put together in my office. It sounds like my criteria and the Op's are not far apart!
Rogue Cronus Magnum - $2300
System Audio Aura 10 - $1500
REL T3 - $650
VPI Scout - $2000
Nagaoka MP500 - $800
Phonomena II - $600
AppleTV - $100
Oppo BDP-105 -$1200
Cables - AudioQuest Golden Gate I/C, Type 4 Speaker - $500
Furman Power Conditioner - $400

I think that is right at $10k. Yes everyone loves to plug their own stuff, but I have really loved this little setup, even more than my bigger rig in the other room. I chose my Scout over a Gyrodec, which has always tempted me, because I have an extra wand and I do like the ability to swap carts easily. (and I came across a nice deal used.

 

NSMT PSM speakers — $4,300
Eastern Electric M88 – $1,800
(new tubes for above — $600)
Sota Saphire —$2,700
RB 303 — $600
AT F-7 — $250
Phonomena II+ — &750
Wireworld Oasis 7 ICs and Luna/Solstice bi-wire — $500+
Skylan stands — $400

That leaves some for a digital source of some sort.

 

This amount is where I end up soon and this is what I currently own:

Source: VPI Scout with Dyna 20x2L Dyna P75 II - $3,500
Amp: Audio Research VSI60 - $4,000
Spearkers: Vandersteen 1Cs with stands - $1,200

Upgrades coming early 2015...
Power Conditioning: Shunyata PS8/Defender/Venom HC/SR-Z1 Outlet - $1,500
Cables & Interconnects: Venon HC for Power Amp, & Audioquest Columbia - $800
Source - Digital: Schiit Bifrost - $550

That puts me around $11,500, I guess I'd upgrade the speakers to 2Cs and that would put me at $13,000. Then I'd upgrade the speaker cable and be around $13,500. Maybe the next upgrade would the the Dyna XX2 and that would top me out around $15,000. I'm not much of a hardware expert but synergy is my goal step-by-step. Wow, that's a lot of money....gone fast.

 

Here's what I would do for a 15k system:

Harbeth Super HL5 Plus speakers $6890
Hegel H160 integrated amp/dac $3500
Rega RP6 w/exact 2 cart $1990
Musical Surroundings Phonomena II phono preamp $600
Nordost Blue Heaven cables (1 pair of 2m speaker cables, a 1m USB, 1 pair of 1m interconnects and a 1.5m power cord) approximately $1800
my source would be my ipad or PC playing flac files from my server and streaming tidal

total: $14780

 

Five matched MC-30s. Five matched AR 3a speakers. Maybe something like a C-45 pre. And an Oppo 83. Seriously that's what I'd get.

 

He did say no used. I think used muddies this thread concept

 

Wow - great system ideas - I figured it was either digital or vinyl as it was pretty difficult to get within budget with both - but some of you guys have done so with ease. Actually with terrific dacs available like the Schiit Bifrost at $550, it's a little silly to limit the list.

I should say I haven't got any vinyl these days = the WTL + XX2 + P75 was a combo I owned about 4 years ago now. I remember it fondly.

I think we better stay new, used is a whole other ball game.

All are great - although I must confess to not being familiar with all the brands advocated. And the prices in the USA are a little different to ours in Australia (some higher, some lower)

This system ↓ appeals in particular to me, except I'd probably get 30.1's over SHL5's (having owned both I prefer the 30.1's), but that is personal choice. Hard to fault though.

Thanks to everyone for joining in the fun! Easy to get to 15k, huh?

And there is nothing wrong championing your own gear (I have!) if you like what you hear. The latter is the important criteria.

Thanks again

 

Man, the $15K price point can be tough if you want to do analog and digital AND were building a system you'd never want to upgrade AND aren't buying anything used. Honestly, I'd buy at least some of these components used if possible to try to get an analog front end.

Starting with digital since adding analog is just a lot more expensive, I'd go with something like this:

DeVore Orangutan 0/93's - $8K
Line Magnetic 210IA Integrated 300B tube amp - $5K
Line Magnetic 515 CD Player / DAC - $2,400
Cheap Cables and Interconnects probably from some place like BlueJeans - $500

Total = $15,900

I'd want to add a nice turntable obviously, but that also means adding a cartridge, arm and phono stage. I had problems with my VPI Scoutmaster 2 and ended up going much higher end when I upgraded. I just don't have enough experience to know what I'd go with if I was trying to get all of that for, say, another $5K.

 

Just my own opinion, but in this season of giving thanks, I think anyone who is able to think of a $10K to $15K system as "real world" should be quite grateful.
-Bob

 

Well it's only about a 2year cable bill

 

You pay 5k a year for cable?

 

No. It was a stab at humour and a comment on the cost of cable. Never mind. However in two years it almost one third of this budget. Thant include 100 mps of internet

 

If i have that budget, ill make it as simple as possible.

A pmc twenty.26 10k
A naim superuniti 5k
Bluejeans cables and ics.

A wonderful system and so simple.

 

Gosh - haven't heard any PMC's outside of their small speakers. They are relatively rare here. I love Naim gear - so punchy and alive. hard to beat and a great recommendation. Thanks.

Very true Bob, very true. I hope I haven't offended anyone by posting the topic - it is just abit of fun. I don't mean it to be a boast - not that I have anything to boast about anyway. It could have just as easily been "what would you buy for 5k?" I suppose the 'real world' comment is what irked.

In my defense I actually meant it in relation to living circumstances, not just dollar spend. Ie a system that could happily live in a shared space, not something that benefit from being 6 ft out from the front wall and take up half your living space eg Quad 2905

My thinking is that most middle aged working blokes like myself would have around 10 - 15k in gear (rrp) after they added it all up - it;s pretty easy to get too. It used to be 10 - 15k would buy you more than a slice of the "high end", but my experience is that you can barely get into a pair of top line speakers for that sort of money now. At least in Australia and NZ.

That is one of the reasons I have had so many pairs of Quad 57's - they hard to beat in terms of bang for the buck, especially for classical. But they aren't too "real world' - they are large and take up a great deal of space. But I digress, you can't buy them new so they aren't fair game.

Bob, what would you put together for 5 k then?

I'd say:

Schiit Bifrost
Exposure 2010S2
Harbeth P3ers or Proac D18 or..

Naim Uniti2 + Harbeth P3ers or

Schitt Bifrost
PrimaLuna Classic
Proac D18 or Response D2

Budget cable de jour


heck we can even play the game at 2k if you like (I'm quite enjoying this now)


Rega P3
Rega Brio R + Whardale Diamond 220.
Budget Cables

Anyways happy holidays to one and all...pick a dollar spend that corresponds to your circumstances and suggest away.

 

Crazy most of you spend more money on amp than loudspeakers! I'll do the contrary.

 

Well I guess I'm just posting from what I own or have owned (or at least have heard) and what I like in terms of what goes with what ie synergy. I don't think that we should necessarily accept that the bigger spend should be on speakers. My Magico S1's were around 12k, but needed close to that spent on them to sound good - in my case a Devialet for 8k but really they will take just about any amount of money spent up front - they are that good. Don't have either now btw - sold the S1's to upgrade to s3's and a tax bill & wife got in the way.... Point being I wouldn't dream of buying Magico S1's and then trying to drive them with 3k worth of front end and amplification (& cables). They are simply too revealing to do that to yourself. It would be horrible. Soooo...I guess it's all about balance

My interest is in combo's at whatever price point (2, 5, 10 or 15 k) that people know go well together. I also just happen to feel the wee 3/5a iterations do an awful lot right, and can be pretty satisfying in most "real world" (he says ducking for cover...) listening environments.

That said - @Beppe please post what you would do (or have done) with your spend - doesn't matter what that spend is.

Oh and seeing you are from Italy (the land of Sonus Faber...drool):

Buon Natale e felice anno nuovo! my friend

 

ATC actives (maybe the 50s), Logitech Squeezebox Touch, a good USB DAC and a pair of HD800s. Job done.

 

I spent more on my amp than speakers, but only because I am limited in size and application. I also have not hear many smallish speakers I prefer to my Aura 10's and REL combo. If I had space for bigger speakers that ratio would change for me as well.

 

Tricka, I didn't mean my comments to be critical of your post at all. Heck, I'm something of an audiophile myself and have spent amounts on gear that I'm sure would seem outlandish to many people. While $10-15K isn't quite real-world in my world, what I've spent would seem like dream-world stuff to many others. I, too, have worked many years (too many!) to be able to spend a few bucks on luxuries, and my point was to just remind ourselves to be grateful that we can even talk about—and listen to—this stuff.

My own $5 system? Well, that's probably about what I've spent on:

Used Harbeth Compact 7
KAB Technics SL1200/Grado Sonata
Cheapo Sony CD player
Used Arcam A85 integrated amp
Cables: The cheapest, decently made stuff I can find (not a believer!)

Happy holidays, everyone.
-Bob

 

My build would be:

PrimaLuna HP Integrated Amplifier $4,199
Oppo 105D $1,299
VPI Scout 1.1 W/Soundsmith Zephyr MKII $3,194.50
Soundsmith - MCP2 MC Phono Pre-amp $999.00
DeVore Gibbon 88 $5,000

Total $14,691.50