Is it just me or Led Zeppelin (or rather half of the band) were simply bad too many times LIVE? *

Agree that some stuff should have been curtailed -- Dazed and Moby only grew longer as the years went on. But some of those extended No Quarters were pretty stunning with the piano, guitar and drum jams in the middle. When I find a new show from that era I immediately go to the No Quarter jam to find out if it's a decent show or not.

But Jimmy did provide backing vocals on some songs on several tours. Not really noticeable. I do like the fact that they went out there every night, just the four of them, and recreated songs that had been elaborately recorded and overdubbed in the studio (I have heard that 17 guitars were used on Achilles Last Stand, yet Page went out every night with just one six-string and pulled it off. The officially released Knebworth performance is phenomenal and has only one small instrumental patch in it -- the rest is allegedly totally live).

I never did see them live, so I'm running off of live recordings. Sometimes they were spectacular and terrible during the same show (hello, Knebworth!).

My biggest complaint is with so many great album cuts, many played on the radio, they stuck to the same hits for many shows. If I were Plant I'd be sick of Stairway too, but Black Dog even more -- yet he still performs the latter to this day. Good Times Bad Times, Levee, Custard Pie and many, many other tracks should have been no-brainers (I know a couple of those were tried briefly and discarded).

 

Are we discussing music or professional wrestling? Seriously, Beck and Clapton have only gotten better over the years. Can't say the same about Page since he hasn't done much in the last four decades.

 

You are correct. They flew in a few guitar bits from other live gigs on Achilles from Knebworth, but there are no studio overdubs, unlike, say, every other live album in the world....

 

Thought they were great live. Listen to the BBC CDs. But as far as in the studio, on their albums, I think they are a 30% great, 70% fluff mix. So much junk on those albums. No good songs on Presence or In through the Out Door or Coda, NONE! The biggest dud album in my life was when in 1979, they dumped ITTOD on me. I was so excited for that and only listened to it a couple of times because to me it was horrible. Presence and Coda are also disasters.

 

Check out Live in Albert Hall from 1970. That's where We're Gonna Groove and I can quit You were lifted from for Coda

 

Is it just me or Led Zeppelin (well, half of it) were simply bad almost 90% of the time (that we have recordings of)????.

I'd say 90% is way too high a percentage of bad performances, overall. That's laughable, imo!

The three performances I saw in '77, the opening show in Dallas was blah... it was like a practice session, as Robert said in concert....

But, after the break, I saw the Houston and the Ft. Worth shows, and, they were very good to see and hear.

I was also at the two Dallas shows in '75, and the first night was very, very good. The 2nd night, although good, was not as good as the 1st night in Dallas.

'73 was okay. '71 was less so.

But the 1970, August 22nd show in Ft. Worth was Golden.

Because fate has given us some less than great video footage along the way of the band, does not mean that 90% of their performances were bad.

 

Okay, don't look at the 90%. Substitute for "most".

Also, folks, please keep in mind that the thread title means live stuff only. As far as studio goes, I LOVE 90% of the material!!

 

A whole second guitar part was added to "Achilles Last Stand" on the official DVD. Not really an overdub in the traditional sense.

Basically, they took bits from the original guitar parts and layered them over the top again with echo and whatever else. You can read a better, more detailed description here: http://www.thegardentapes.co.uk/dvdknebworth4.html

 

I'd say that editing old footage to the extent that Jimmy Page did the official DVD is uncommon. I'd argue that it's even a talent. But I'm not sure comparing this to people putting overdubs on live albums is apples to apples.

And, technically, adding a second guitar when there wasn't one at Knebworth is an overdub. It's just that they did it by using existing bits in cut and paste fashion as opposed to recording something fresh which probably would have sounded really out of place.

 

I heard many Led Zeppelin bootlegs.

I think this was an excellent band both live and in the studio. Not sure what the OP is hearing but it's a testament to how people can hear things differently.

I'd say this; I have a good friend who never really enjoys live shows. He want songs to sound like the record. Well...real music by real musicians doesn't sound like the record. I enjoy the differences. It's what I like about concerts.

I guess enjoy the albums, but your really missing out on the best part of the band. No Quarter live is brilliant. Kashmir live...brilliant. The Rain Song live.... brilliant!

 

You do know what the other band members were doing during the long solos
Not just a break in a 3 1/2 hour show

 

Duplicating a guitar part on portions of one song from one concert from one live DVD is a pretty heinous act, I must admit. It's almost as bad as the first 3 notes of one of your songs being similar to 3 notes on another song.

 

That good 10% set me on a lifelong curse(course) for good or better more than the 90% of other bands.I`m sure it wasn`t all magical though of course
Train Kept a rollin,Trampled, Achilles from 6/29/80
Dazed,Whole lotta Nothin` 3,24,73 & 7,27,73
Stairway,Immigrant 9,24,71
No Quarter 6,23,77-have you heard the phychedelic guitar tuning part right after the 1st piano solo?

 

Thanks! I will. Although I must tell you I was not particularly impressed with those two tracks. As I've said, I have never been impressed by any live
Zep I've heard. But I'll check it out.

 

For all you naysayers who are slating Zeppelin especially the guy who started the thread who never saw them live ,has never seen any classic band live claims that Jimmy Page & Robert Plant were bad 90% of the time!!!! 90% 90%......what a claim meaning they were only 10% good & can't fathom why he is getting a backlash? (For all I know he is listening to muffled bootlegs replayed on a stereo system that can't handle the true dynamics of Zep) I would like you to name the band who were better than Zeppelin who had 10 year career or more & were perfect 100% of the time including live. Btw it is well known fact that the Beatles retired playing live in 1966 due to frustration of hearing themselves & they felt the musicianship was suffering (their quote not mine) so that's them out the (bathroom) window!!!

 

I think recordings are way more important than live shows. Live shows are fun but they are what they are, they're all flawed unless it's the Eagles and then they're boring.

 

As a Grateful Dead fan, the idea of a band giving rote performances that sound just like the record is akin to a having a nightmare.
The Ramones come close, but there is still an insane edge to the way that they up the BPM and have no pause between tunes that is great.

 

Keep in mind - 90% of LIVE stuff. I thought that was clear in my initial post. Again, if you haven't understood, I LOVE... Again LOVE! 95% of their studio output. Due to their work in studio they are band no.3 for me of all times and because of STUDIO material I consider Plant one of the best singers to have ever treaded Eartg. I enjoy a fraction of their live material, however. Because, imho, they never managed to reach the level of studio perfection. And I am not opposed to hearing different interpretations of the song as long as it is done well, mind you.

And I do not listen to goddamn muffled bootlegs. But to friggin' officially released bluratyedition of Song Remains!!!!!

One thing I have understood - impossible to argue with those who were at their concert and enjoyed it. Their sole prism of perception is that moment in the past, nostalgia. I, mind you, judge rhe music. Not experience of seeing them live.

Now ... Band better than LZ. How about Gentle Giant? Always played differently from studio but brilliantly nonetheless. Another example - King Crimson, I mean Discipline and later periods. In terms more or less faithful reproduction, if one is interested in that - Yes with Anderson, Genesis.

 

You know, I am not a *****. I did get acquainted with their official live releases.

Oh... These people with "you kids get out of my lawn" mentality. Never give a chance to look at smth with a fresh perspective or ar least consider it. Oh, I've been to a concert of theirs, I am a superior being.. Oh you watched that same concert in soundboard quality and in color? Ha! Still can never evaluate it, no right whatsoever!

Btw, a question to all. Is there a concert version of Immigrant Song where Plant executes the initial "aaaaaaaa" as perfecrly as heard on the studio record?

 

I wonder if someone could help me enjoy the studio drum solo on Led Zeppe;in II's Moby Dick. I just don't understand or see anything in it.

 

I really dig LZ II version and the one on Albert Hall, '70. Bonham plays like Joey Baron there only 10 times more powerful. These two drum solos are very musical to me. And they don't last for eternity. ))

 

Is it just me or Led Zeppelin (well, half of it) were simply bad almost 90% of the time?

 

This post has absolutely no merit. The OP is addressing the MUSIC presented live by Led Zeppelin -not the concert experience by those in attendance. It is perfectly valid to critique their live sound based on the audio evidence available.

 

People are taking this too personally. You didn't even say anything insulting about LZ, and it's clear you love the band. So, just don't pay attention. The moment you revealed your age was when you should have known a lot of folks were gonna jump on your back. So, lesson learned. But also, their problem.

Good thread, and I'm a huge LZ fan, who even enjoys the admittedly problematic The Song Remains the Same. But you have a point, I know what you're talking about, and I don't see why this shouldn't be discussed.

 

count me out after europe '73.