What does Steve Hoffman think of the new Beatles Sgt. Pepper remix?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by NGeorge, May 31, 2017.

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  1. Gems-A-Bems

    Gems-A-Bems Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Duke City
    :confused:
     
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  2. I would say the vinyl is similar but with better dynamics and not slammed like the digital.
     
  3. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Yes...Treasure. I am going to buy that Sgt. Pepper remix thing tomorrow. I am hoping for the best.
     
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  4. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Believe it or not there quite a few people who just love those Doors 40th anniversary remixes. I am one of them. Although I respect your opinion, your statement, "..they made a mess out of the remixes..." is well..subjective. And in the end it's is only one opinion as well as the opinion of many others on this site. My only experience with the original Doors mixes was with some vinyl I got from the U.K. Harsh, and not very pleasant.

    But in regards to Pepper remix - leave the album alone Giles Martin. WHOOPS! Too late.
     
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  5. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    Absolutely!
     
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  6. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Aside from loving the Giles remix of "Getting Better", i've settled back into the mono version of the album.
     
  7. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Do you think the press /public would have been so enthusiastic if the MONO came out in a lavish anniversary box with other mixes included rather than the hyped stereo/mono hybrid ?
     
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  8. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Very good question! I don't think anyone except for audiophiles and headphone listeners would have even noticed the mono mix.
     
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  9. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    I listened and did a comparison of the following 4 Sgt. Pepper CDs in this order:

    1987 issue (made in "West Germany", purchased in Boston upon release)
    2009 stereo remaster bought upon release
    2017 remix
    2009 mono bought upon release

    My ranking and very brief summary:
    1. 2009 mono remaster - biggest plus here are the voices. They sound like real people and not electronic reproductions. Overall has great balanced sound.
    2. 2009 stereo remaster - nicely done for the stereo mix. Voices don't sound quite as natural as the 2009 mono to me.
    3. 1987 stereo release - sounds good but I like what they did on the 2009 stereo remaster to clear it up a bit. Still, this one sounds great also.
    4. 2017 remix - too much bass, drums mixed in too loud in several areas. Voices are not natural in too many places. Have now listened to this 4 times and always conclude the same.
     
  10. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario

    So I did the deed and bite the bullet and bought the Sgt. Pepper remix CD....I was really impressed until I got to "Good Morning Good Morning," and that's when I shouted aloud, "Giles Martin, what have you done now?!"

    You mention that the volcals sound unnatural. Well, you hit it right on the head only it's worse than worse: Giles made extensive use of panned effects and/or stereo delay. The idea is that if you have a background volcal half way right, it is nicely balanced with a delay/reverb effect panned somewhere on the other side. If the effect send of the mixer channel is turned up enough the delay (if it's set right) can sound like second volcal. Used discretely this kind of effect might be pleasant but on "Good Morning Good Morning" it's criminal. Giles has this delay effect way too loud on the horns, the volcals (Good Morning part) and it's even detectable on the drums at times. This gives the illusion of double tracked volcals. Where there double tracked volcals? And it's on the horn track as well. Pop on headphones and you will hear it. I think the power went to his head.

    Down to nitpicking.
    The bass is loud enough but it has lost it's weight. The bass on stereo 67' Pepper used to sing like liquid velvet. Same with the volcals. You can hear more detail but they have lost some dynamic range. The reason? Compression. He didn't use a lot but just enough to take the icing off the bass and volcals. It has been common practice for decades for mixers to put compression on bass - so that every note has the same loudness. It is a normal mixer practice but it sucked the liquid velvet out of most of the songs. "When I'm 64" still has weight in the bottom end.

    Why are the cymbals so bright?
    "Being For The Benefit Of Mr. Kite" is way to bright.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2017
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  11. candyflip

    candyflip Forum Resident

    Location:
    Liverpool, UK
    Only just got round to listening to the new mix. Kicked back in the dark with headphones. Gotta say I'm a little disappointed, maybe it's just because I'm so used to the originals...? Before hearing it, I listened to the recent Bob Boilen interview, where Giles talks about how they used all the original compressors etc, and it sounds to me like they went a little overboard with it, especially on a lot of the vocals and drums.

    The whole thing just sounds a little too hyped, I didn't really find any moments that sounded relaxed and laid back. At times it almost reminded me of Michael Jackson's backing vocal sounds... super wide, super compressed, stacked, and louder than the lead vocal. I feel these new mixes sound a little too clean and detailed, lacking subtlety. The final chord of A Day In The Life is kinda ruined for me too now that that buzzing electric organ is a louder. One track I DO like more than the original is Good Morning...the new mix is a revelation! The rhythm guitar is actually audible, the backing vocals sit perfectly, there is some great bottom end in the drums now that isn't too overpowering. The new Strawberry Fields isn't too bad either.

    It's a shame, as I really loved what he did with All You Need Is Love on the Love album, so I had I hopes. The backing vocals in that sounds massively improved over the original, and I love the way it goes into Goodnight/Johnny Rhythm...that bit always punches me right in the heart...but that's getting off topic :cop:

    Just my .02c!

    edit: Just read the comment above mine, regarding Good Morning haha... horses for courses I guess! :) Peace
     
  12. Keith V

    Keith V Forum Resident

    Location:
    Secaucus, NJ
    I like having the remix just for the clarity sake. It would have been nice if someone else did it though.
    The Beatles OWN children don't work on Beatles projects so neither should Little George Martin.
     
  13. Bill Lettang

    Bill Lettang Forum Resident

    they cut off Ringo's "an of2" on the hi-hat at the stop after the solo on Fixing A Hole...I'll never listen to this remix again..... All goofing aside, they really did.
     
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  14. tages

    tages Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Or a perfectly fine mix that wasn't intended to be heard on headphones in the first place.
     
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  15. Francisx

    Francisx Forum Resident

    Ok...so everyone knows that a "New Mix" or "New Remaster" is well...NEW! You like it or you do not like it! You buy it or you do not buy it! There really
    is no right or wrong here! Anything from the Beatles is fine with me...old new, remix, bootlegs that have yet to ever be released, Doctor Ebbetts and
    the likes......the 50th anniversary SPLHCB is "Something New".....ooh a Beatles album title in a post about another Beatles album that is new..
    very spooky.......I hope Giles and team do the same thing with all of the Beatles canon. At least the lot of you will have something to complain about for
    years!!!
     
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  16. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Excellent point. But we will never know. And besides the Fab 4 didn't like stereo back then, so getting their opinion on a new stereo mix is like getting their opinion on the original stereo mix. They hated stereo back in those days so why should we even need their opinion.
     
  17. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    No argument there.
     
  18. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Oh-h-h but come on now!...Why can't Little Giles play with the Beatle 4 track tapes...Just for a little while.

    Seriously though. I gave your point some long hard thought. Why? Giles has been around a mixer board since he was 15.

    Better the devil you know than the devil you don't know
     
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  19. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    I don't think the mix wasn't meant to be heard on headphones. There were stereo headphones in those days. Good quality ones but expensive. In fact the people of the sixties would've loved all that extreme seperation. That was the big issue of the day -seperation.
     
  20. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    They did what!?...I shall check that on the remix.
     
  21. walrus

    walrus Staring into nothing

    Location:
    Nashville
    A good mix should sound good no matter what the listener is using. And rethinking of some old mixes for an age in which more and more listening is done on headphones isn't the worst idea if the goal is to introduce recordings to a new audience. If a 15-year old today was tempted to look up Sgt. Pepper on their portable device after reading one of the 2,000 articles written about it this month to find out why it was such a big deal, I'd much rather they hear the new stereo mix.

    Granted, if the Beatles had just decided the mono mixes were going to be the 'primary' ones, we wouldn't really need to have this debate.
     
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  22. Derek Slazenger

    Derek Slazenger Specs, rugs & rock n roll

    To me it's uneven. The title track sounds like it's from a different session altogether from WALHFMF. Mr.Kite smashing in is jarring and the compression on most of it squeezes the life and magic from it. It's interesting and if the SQ hadn't been sabotaged I'd have probably been rotating it more, but once the novelty has worn off I won't be grabbing it for a relaxing, involving sit-down. Haven't got my TT set up yet so haven't listened to the vinyl but hoping that will be a less challenging listen :) Shame.
     
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  23. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    It all depends on the quality of the audiophiles digital and analog systems. Some audiophiles will spend $5 000 on turntable, tone arm, cartdrige (gotta have that line contact stylus), phono preamp, and wet vacuum cleaner; but only spend $1 000 on a CD player / U.S.B. D/A converter and then state that the record sounds better.

    Which is probably does anyway.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2017
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  24. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Steve doesn't like it so.....

    I was all excited about the remix. The kind of excitement I feel (used to feel before J.J. Abrams @!$# with it) when a new Star Wars movie was coming out. And I loved every song he remixed...Wow! I didn't know the guitar sounded like that on the title track. The end of side one came and I was so happy. Perfect remix. But then as we know, all good things must come to an end and they did when Giles Martin abused reverb/delay effects like a 12 year old who just discovered the existence of stereo reverb for the first time, AND HAD TO USE IT ON JUST EVERYTHING. (I think that just qualified as a run on sentence.)

    The remaining Beatle opinions should matter. But if Ringo and Sir Paul could sit there and listen to the heavy effect drenched "Good Morning Good Morning" and give a thumbs up to that song bleached white in thick syrupy delay/reverb then their approval means nothing and I no longer want it.

    Beside that, yes, your point is valid and people shouldn't 'poo-poo' on it until they have heard the whole L.P. and not little bits...
     
  25. Onder

    Onder Senior Member

    Could you be more specific? I can't find the right spot you're refering to. Do you mean the stop between the end of the solo and "and it really doesn't matter" line? It sounds the same to me.
    I found out that they did repair John's sloppy bass playing in the third verse though.

    Ondra
     
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