M*A*S*H- a season by season discussion!

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by ohnothimagen, Dec 1, 2017.

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  1. HGN2001

    HGN2001 Mystery picture member

    I don't think I'll ever understand the dislike here for the M*A*SH freeze-frame endings. Sometimes they were fairly amusing.
     
  2. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    Sometimes amusing, sometimes cheesy, but they are what they are. I'd say we're used to 'em by now:laugh:
     
  3. dirwuf

    dirwuf Misplaced Chicagoan

    Location:
    Fairfield, CT

    Because they are like a rimshot emphasizing the final joke, which is fine if it's a big laugh...but oft times the show liked to end on a gentle character moment or little smile, in which case the freeze-ending feels totally out of place..
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2018
  4. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    I will say this: I'll take the freeze frame endings over some of the cheesier, more 'sitcomy' sounding bumper music they used to open and/or close out the first and second acts of the show in the earlier years (I want to say season 7 was the last season to actually use these pieces of bumper music). The bumper music really felt out of place after a while.
     
  5. GLENN

    GLENN Forum Resident

    Location:
    Kingsport,TN, USA
    Police Squad had the all-time best freeze-frame endings, but that's for another thread on another day.
     
  6. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Yeah, Police Squad made it hard to take freeze frame endings seriously ever again.
     
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  7. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Sure she does. She eventually clarifies that Donald had impotency issues during the honeymoon, while "Frank never had that problem."
     
  8. Jay_Z

    Jay_Z Forum Resident

    Yes, and Police Squad came and went before M*A*S*H even left the air!

    Freeze frame endings are horrible and tacky. But let's look at a few of the tags from the first 5 seasons.

    Abyssinia Henry: The tag is just a greatest hits of Henry Blake clip. A nice touch, but if I'm creating the also now anachronistic syndication cut, it's the first thing to go. But what "zinger", that can't be touched in syndication, do you want to use on that episode? Do you really want to end that one with a freeze frame? (Actually, a fan did a re-edit of that ending, with Maclean's scene from Cher in the life raft. THEN the freeze frame ending. Now that one was funny!)

    The Late Captain Pierce: Now I love the ending to the episode itself, with Hawkeye getting off the bus and walking back into camp. This sort of ending was also something they couldn't pull off in the later years. The tag is Hawkeye talking to his dad on the phone letting him know he's okay. This tag is a little more essential because Hawkeye deserves the moment and it's a relief from some of the black comedy of the episode. Hawkeye has a good talk with his dad, then they're cut off for whatever reason. So the moment of joy passes, and Hawkeye hangs up the phone. Well done. And... let's slap a freeze frame zinger on the end of it, right?

    Quo Vadis Captain Chandler: The tag is Klinger trying to get out of the Army like Captain Chandler by pretending he's Moses. Not really an essential scene. There was never a laugh track for this episode, though it hits a lot of different tones anyway. But slapping a zinger on the end of Klinger's scene puts a lot more emphasis on that bit than it is designed to carry. I don't want a freeze frame on the end of Chandler's scene either.

    Margaret's Marriage: The tag is not essential, except that it's the last scene we ever will get with Frank Burns. Again, where is the need for the "zinger" freeze frame here. Does "Goodbye Margaret" need to be shoved in your face with a freeze frame? Make your own fan edit then.

    I just can't fathom anyone defending such a hacky device in 2018. I'm sorry the show ever went there. That they did so merely to cram more credits on screen, also something that would never be done today, boggles the mind.
     
  9. Jay_Z

    Jay_Z Forum Resident

    Thinking about this, and The Late Captain Pierce. The scene with Hawkeye's pay is great. What a great heel scene. Frank likely didn't even have the money for Hawkeye since he was dead to the Army. But he was an a-hole about it anyway. I love it, loved that part of the show. So visceral. Winchester never got to that point of moving my raw emotions.

    That one was written by Glen and Les Charles, better known for their work on Taxi and Cheers. This was the only M*A*S*H they ever wrote.
     
  10. HGN2001

    HGN2001 Mystery picture member

    I'm sorry you cannot appreciate it for what it is - just a final wink to the audience. I can't fathom why a freeze-frame is such a big deal to you or anyone else.
     
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  11. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    A Police Squad! Episode by episode thread would be quick work!:laugh:
    Yeah, you're right. And I just watched the bleedin' episode yesterday!
     
  12. Luke The Drifter

    Luke The Drifter Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    That is why I really like it when they are friendly to Frank. Someone here will remember the scene. He gets back at Margaret somehow, and they are sitting in the mess tent. You feel like Frank is one of the guys for a change.
     
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  13. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    That's the tag to "Margaret's Engagement". Frank asks Hawkeye if he wants to go trolling for nurses- Hawkeye is surprised but agreeable, and Frank mentions a redheaded nurse. Margaret says "She's a little young for you, isn't she?" to which Frank replies,
    "Oh, I dunno- I thought a little youth might be nice for a change.":laugh: Margaret storms out of the mess tent in a huff...fade.

    To be fair, the rest of the characters weren't always mean to Frank, but often enough that it does get a little tiring after a while. Of course, they're downright nasty to him in the movie:laugh:
     
  14. dirwuf

    dirwuf Misplaced Chicagoan

    Location:
    Fairfield, CT
    Frank would usually have to do or say something to get the wrath of Potter, but for Hawkeye and BJ to go after him, all he would have to do is appear...
     
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  15. Scooterpiety

    Scooterpiety Ars Gratia Artis

    Location:
    Oregon
    I actually felt sorry for Frank during the last few seasons, the attacks were more personal and vicious and sometimes came before he ever said or did anything.
     
  16. thgord

    thgord In Search of My Next Euphoric Groove

    Location:
    Moorpark, CA
    I attended one of his appearances when I was as at SDSU in 1985. Thanks for reminding me. The presentation was very enjoyable.
     
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  17. dirwuf

    dirwuf Misplaced Chicagoan

    Location:
    Fairfield, CT
    I really wish they would have made more use of the the Japanese/American music that was prevalent in the movie, and actually the beginning of the pilot...

     
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  18. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    Absolutely. Season five is the worst when it comes to gratuitous abuse of Frank Burns.

    Of course, as has been pointed out over the years, it is very unlikely that they would have gotten away with some of the things they did to Frank in real life. I imagine Hawkeye, Trapper and BJ would have been court martialed a few times over:laugh:
     
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  19. Grand_Ennui

    Grand_Ennui Forum Resident

    Location:
    WI
    They would have been court martialed, until Henry (or later on, Potter) would intervene and say how great they are as surgeons, so all charges would be dropped ;)
     
  20. ohnothimagen

    ohnothimagen "Live music is better!" Thread Starter

    Location:
    Canada
    Yeah, that kind of deux ex machina might apply on TV but in real life I bet their skills as surgeons would only protect them so far...
     
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  21. thgord

    thgord In Search of My Next Euphoric Groove

    Location:
    Moorpark, CA
    He was especially great when he snowed Burns into buying a worthless pieces of junk.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2018
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  22. thgord

    thgord In Search of My Next Euphoric Groove

    Location:
    Moorpark, CA
    Re: S9, I really liked No Laughing Matter as that's the episode where Col. Horace Baldwin returns and Charles is having to grovel, suck up, and lose money in cribbage to a man he absolutely despises. Also A War for All Seasons in which Charles is tormented by all the money he lost on the '51 pennant race, thanks to "where is that Lebanese mongiose" Klinger. Catch a theme here?
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2018
  23. Jay_Z

    Jay_Z Forum Resident

    The TV show was held to the realities of sitcom TV, particularly episodic sitcom TV of the time. Limited if any story arcs at the time. If you're watching a drama, Mannix, for example, got hit over the head, got shot at, etc. enough for hundreds of actual private detective's lifetimes. The same was with M*A*S*H. The volume of stuff that went on would never happen to anyone in real life.

    That being said, the movie characters seemed to get away with even more than the TV show characters. Burns and Hotlips were kept more formidable. In reality there would probably be just a few incidents. In reality the surgeons were there for a year tops. In reality Blake and or Potter would not have been practicing surgeons, and would have had to let the surgeons run the OR so long as the results were there.
     
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  24. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Well, if we assume the MASH book is more or less factual (albeit embellished) then they were able to get away with a lot, including both Duke and Trapper beating up Frank on separate occasions. Of course, the key difference is that in the book Frank was also a Captain, not a superior officer.
     
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  25. KevinP

    KevinP Forum introvert

    Location:
    Daejeon
    This is a Facebook link but hopefully you don't need to be on FB to see it:

    Kim Rosko
     
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