Ethernet Cables in for evaluation

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Puma Cat, May 17, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. jmczaja

    jmczaja Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    I'm assuming he means 'Blue Jeans Cable', which is just as good a vendor as any other out there..
     
    Shawn likes this.
  2. Rolltide

    Rolltide Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallejo, CA
    I would however add that Blue Jeans Cable is a company that sells audio cables and thus is a weird place to purchase ethernet cables from, as ethernet cables aren't audio cables any more then the twist ties used to bundle them are audio cables. While it's true that they offer assurance their ethernet cables meet spec etc etc, $20 for a 6' patch cord is several times more than the standard price of that fungible commodity.
     
  3. jmczaja

    jmczaja Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    True.. But at least they're not making the snake-oil claim that they sound any different! If people are willing to pay 10x for a patch cord w/ certification, so be it..
     
    JohnCarter17 and james like this.
  4. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    This is a classic informal logical fallacy. Find one error or one misstatement, use it to reject an entire field of study or endeavour, then misapply it to try to distract a questioner or dissenter. It’s a terrible position to take and also a classic straw man argument just as @Archimago posted.

    If by “Audio” magazine you mean “Audio engineering” magazine, it was publishing and highly respected up until it ceased publication in 1999 IIRC. It ceased publication because it lost its niche in a changing market, not at all because its credibility was in question. And as @Archimago posted, it has nothing to do with a thread about ethernet cables.

    Your assessment of the now-ancient Crown DC-300 is interesting. I owned a DC-300 in 1971. It was a terrific amp - the very best DC coupled power amp of the day, IMO, at anything close to a reasonable price point for solid-state electronics. Sounded wonderful. More important, J. Gordon Holt’s review in Stereophile back in 1970 was spot-on. Nobody does DC coupled designs anymore because the power density is insufficient, the technology has moved along, and even better sound is available. At the time though, I think the DC-300 was well-regarded by a lot of music lovers.

    Cherry-pick details all you like. It won’t get you far on SHF. If you don’t want to be asked by someone like @Hooch on the whys and hows of your posted opinions, don’t tout your professional scientist position ahead of your opinions. It seems to me that the only reason you mentioned your professional scientist position was to assign weight to your non-scientific opinions about how ethernet cables sound, even though ethernet cables don’t even carry audio signals (they carry data streams, not audio waveforms). You also mentioned noise performance, but you don’t indicate any measured differences in noise.

    You seem to hate Blue Jeans Cable, but even with BJC you don’t state any relative differences in noise performance (most likely because BJC uses perfectly well-shielded wire and perfectly mounted connectors) compared to other cables you’re trying. Stating a dislike for a product without any basis other than what you claim you heard is common enough around here, but when you do that it severely undermines your position as a “professional scientist”. Mixed messages like that raise suspicion.
     
  5. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I think we may need to be a little careful here. I have the Series 8 which just came out a week ago. Jay's review was on the older series. Timbre and bass sound fine on my cable into the Network Bridge.
     
  6. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I don't hate Blue Jeans but I compared the WireWorld Starlight to the Blue Jeans Cat 6 and it was no contest. The Starlight was better in every way.
     
  7. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    :D

    It's a beautiful device. 20 hours of break-in so far. Roon Radio playing continuously. Sounds excellent so far and build quality is off the charts.
     
  8. jmczaja

    jmczaja Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    I'll blow everyone's mind by moving their speakers a couple of inches.. The difference is audibly measurable! :biglaugh:
     
    sublemon likes this.
  9. The Starlight cable you got at a substantial ‘preferred’ journalist discount straight from the manufacturer, right, vs. the full price you had to pay for the Blue Jeans?
     
  10. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Yes, I got a standard accommodation price on the Starlight but that doesn't factor at all in my subjective judgment. I have more integrity than that.

    No matter what the cost of either, the Starlight performance was significantly better than the Blue Jeans cable. I kept the Blue Jeans cable for a backup so I can soon try it with the Bartok and see if there is any difference.
     
  11. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    In your opinion as a product reviewer, what differences between the two wires (presumably, both will pass all CAT 6 rating tests) account for the differences you report you’re hearing?
     
    JohnCarter17 and beowulf like this.
  12. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I don't know exactly but it's definitely there. You can hear it over different systems with different DACs and routers.
     
  13. james

    james Summon The Queen

    Location:
    Annapolis
    I need to figure out how to wire better software for the lossy Ethernet cables Ive not been accounting for all these years.
     
    jimbutsu, jmczaja and Rolltide like this.
  14. Muriel Heslop

    Muriel Heslop Night is young and the music's high

    Location:
    Canada
    Following along with interest here.I will be receiving a Nordost Heimdall 2 ethernet cord in another week or so.My use will just be for streaming.I look forward to seeing if I can hear any difference between it and the generic cord that is currently in use with my system.I will report back then.
     
    MGW and LeeS like this.
  15. Rolltide

    Rolltide Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallejo, CA
    You know, I don't think the problem in the "ethernet cables have a sound" space is a reviewer discount. The people who believe in these things are the usual suspects who believer in everything always because #audiophile. I'd actually feel better about the situation if I thought money was influencing opinions.
     
  16. I just think it’s worth noting when someone gets a discount us common folk don’t get, as I feel it’s reasonable to at least consider a psychological bias to the company one has a professional relationship with, one substantial enough to get products at special pricing. Likewise, it’s worth pointing out when said products are held up against those from a competitor where no ‘preferred’ relationship exists, and those competitor’s products are written about in a negative light. Of course, not suggesting or implying LeeS is susceptible to psychological bias in any way, shape or form.
     
    beowulf likes this.
  17. swvahokie

    swvahokie Forum Resident

    Dude, you are old! I don't know why, but I had you figured for 50 tops. Nope, you were rocking a Crown while I was still in primary school. Good call on Audio mag, hated to see them go. Any mag that had Bascom King and Richard Heyser on staff was pretty credible.
     
    Agitater likes this.
  18. LeeS

    LeeS Music Fan

    Location:
    Atlanta
    If anything, any psychological bias would be in favor of Blue Jeans as I had a nice conversation with the owner when I ordered the cable.
     
  19. Rolltide

    Rolltide Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallejo, CA
    I hear you, I just don't think it matters because I know that the moment people like this learned of the existence of "audiophile ethernet cables" made by the usual brands they instantly decided they were going to be better. The most disingenuous thing you read in these cases is when they say things like "I'm not sure if this will make a difference, but we'll see just for fun". Riiiiight, we'll see.
     
    JohnCarter17, Shawn and Agitater like this.
  20. Agitater

    Agitater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    Seriously now @LeeS - a subjectively favourable accommodation doesn’t affect subjective personal judgement? Quick! Someone call the university! Tell the neuroscientists and psychologists they’re all dead wrong! And the Starlight looks a heckuva lot prettier than the bog-plain BJC too, and good looks (or at least non-plain looks) make a huge difference to every audiophile I know (including me - it’s unavoidable).

    Got it. I think it’s reasonable to suggest that in the absence of any technically relevant differences between the wires or any measurable differences between the wires, and in the absence of any musical waveform traveling through the wires, and because of the fact that CAT 6 shielding is very good at noise rejection at home audio wire lengths and environments (and more important, very good at keeping to itself), that any differences you report are purely subjective and difficult to reproduce or hear by anyone who isn’t first primed to hear them.

    Problems can arise with CAT 5, CAT 6, CAT 7 and other CAT standards when running hundreds or thousands of feet of the stuff connecting dozens or hundreds or thousands of switches and servers, etc. Why any audiophile would care about CAT 7 or 8 data transmission (2GHz!) is bizarre when CAT 6 already exceeds our needs and even the most stringent noise requirements and performance requirements for home environments. Data transmission over home audio distances is ridiculously trivial by comparison, and that’s why listening tests in which audiophiles don’t know what cable is being used at any given time always show no differences whatsoever between ethernet cables.

    I think that encouraging audiophiles to buy ever more expensive wire is a unwise and a poor use of time.
     
  21. Archimago

    Archimago Forum Resident

    Since I see the AQ Vodka cable mentioned, I think it's important to remember that we've been down this path of "audiophile" ethernet cables before, let's remember our history. As recently as 2015 with the James Randi $1M Challenge:
    The audiophile’s dilemma: strangers can’t identify $340 cables, either [Updated]

    Unfortunately the $1M Challenge has stopped a little while back. Otherwise folks here could practice and try their hand at scoring a cool mil!
     
    beowulf likes this.
  22. swvahokie

    swvahokie Forum Resident

    I just ordered a CAT 8 cable off Amazon. My cable company freebie just broke at the connector and I use it to hook up my Sony to the internet. It was only 15 bucks shipped, and the connectors looked sturdier than the cheaper stuff. I have no idea if it will give better sound than the old cable or better picture. I just dont want it to break in the middle of baseball season. Got to have my mlb.tv.
     
  23. james

    james Summon The Queen

    Location:
    Annapolis
    Frankly, I’m surprised that these things are legal.

    Or anything by:

    Machina Dynamica Audio Products
     
  24. swvahokie

    swvahokie Forum Resident

    Pulling out random folks that think they get good sound from their phones and expecting them to pick out expensive cables isnt exactly good science either. Randi's challenge was garbage. I have a local dealer that will let me try cables over the weekend. I liked some AQ stuff enough to pay for it. Have you tried different cables in your system?
     
    unclefred, SirMarc and Muriel Heslop like this.
  25. Rolltide

    Rolltide Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallejo, CA
    I think it's similar to how we apparently need to carefully limit the number of background processes running on our quad-core computers to make sure the music plays okay.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine