The Technics SL-1200 GAE/G/GR general questions thread

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Halloween_Jack, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. Davey

    Davey NP: Hania Rani/Dobrawa Czocher ~ Inner Symphonies

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    True, but if that was really the case, why would the nominal tracking force be so different for the two? Some think AT is just kind of sloppy in their specs at times. In the end, the mass/compliance match probably doesn't matter that much, some of the best sounding setups use high mass tonearms with high compliance cartridges, and vice versa, though I tend to believe high mass tonearms with minimal added damping usually sound best, regardless of the other factors, provided that high mass is due to a strong tonearm structure. But that's just my own opinion, many think differently, and some take it to extremes, but in response to @joeym3, if it sounds good and tracks well, you are probably OK.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2019
  2. tzh21y

    tzh21y Forum Resident

    Location:
    Buffalo
    I t works great at that setting as well.
     
  3. Oliver Meyer

    Oliver Meyer In Audio Heaven Up Here

    Location:
    Virginia Beach
    I have asked at VTA - 0 VTF - 1.75 and skate 1.1
    Loading is 67db and 475ohms on the SPL Phonos and 64db and 470ohms on the 20/20
    It sounds very good
     
  4. Timbo21

    Timbo21 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Sadly not if you do a bit of googling. You may have a point with the bi-metal design, but I personally think they are like that when they leave Technics.
     
  5. Davey

    Davey NP: Hania Rani/Dobrawa Czocher ~ Inner Symphonies

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Used (3 months) G with Achromat listed for $3000 (free shipping) today on audiogon if anyone interested. I know some have reported getting them new for around $3200, so maybe not a great deal, but it's out there, might be able to negotiate some on price.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2019
  6. thenice22

    thenice22 Active Member

    Location:
    UK
    Hi everyone
    Has anyone got the HFN and Hi Fi World review of the 1200GAE from 2016
    It's not l need to be convinced l ve a 1200G it's just l want to see the measurements as well as points made etc
    that got them so excited
    Thanks in advance

    Frank

    Cause l am a noob l keeping it nice and short
    Well done
     
  7. Davey

    Davey NP: Hania Rani/Dobrawa Czocher ~ Inner Symphonies

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Think I posted it earlier here, but you can download it from the Oslo Hi-Fi Center page for the 1200G ... TECHNICS SL-1200G
     
  8. thenice22

    thenice22 Active Member

    Location:
    UK
    Thank you so much l ve the HFN 1000r review from 18 the hum and noise at 5cm is 59. 9
    While the 1200G is 62. 6 the rumble through bearing is better 74.1to 1200G 73.6
    Dont ask me to work it out
    The
    1000r a tweaked 1200G who knows for sure

    Hi Fi World review technics 1200G anyone

    Thanks again Davey

    Frank
     
  9. wbass

    wbass Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Hope this might prove useful for those considering the 1200GR... In another thread, I posted a review/comparison of the 1200GR and another popular table in this price range, the Marantz TT-15S1. I'm running the Technics with a 2m Bronze, the Marantz with the stock Virtuoso with an ATN95SA stylus. I guessed from the start that the 1200GR would be my primary, but later got the Marantz for a *really* good deal (less than the price of a new Virtuoso cartridge) and figured, what the heck, it'd be a good way to learn more about 'tables generally. (I got back into analog about a year ago, and stepped up from a Pro-Ject Debut Carbon.) Review follows, with hopes it might help someone else out....

    General build quality: Marantz is well made, but the 1200GR definitely wins on this count. Rock solid, robust, heavy.

    Looks: A toss-up. Marantz is stylish. Technics is industrial. I slightly prefer the 1200GR for its fit and finish and the way it disappears a bit more in the room. Neither are subtle however.

    Speed stability: Technics is a known leader here, but the Marantz also has good speed stability--at least compared to a Music Hall Ikura I demoed (which was also nice but showed its fluctuations on piano notes especially). The 1200GR is, no surprise, rock solid on pitch.

    Tone arm: Here I'm not so sure and need more time with both decks. Some say the Technics tonearms lag behind other manufacturers, others seem to rate them as competitive. I'm not experienced enough to have an opinion. The Clearaudio-made Satisfy arm on the Marantz does seem really quite smooth and sells for $1500 on its own (probably well marked up), so you can certainly feel you're getting a nice piece there. One appealing thing about the Marantz package: You can transplant the arm to another turntable if/when you upgrade to another turntable.

    Usability: Technics wins here. Its controls are fuss free and fall under your hands so easily that it becomes second nature quickly. Not that I have a ton of 45s, but I especially like being able to change between 33 and 45 with a button press. I don't really like switching the notches on the Marantz motor. Maybe I'm butter fingers, but half the time I seem to lose the belt under the platter. Annoying. Still, that said, I find all of the reports of the Marantz motor shifting around or whatever overstated. It's also a perfectly user friendly table. It's just that the Technics is truly made for ease of operation.

    Value for money: Hard to say. A lot of people consider the 1200GR a bargain in its class/price range. I probably agree. However, there's little doubt the Marantz, as a package, is just a great deal. I'm really quite surprised how much I prefer the Virtuoso to the 2m Bronze (itself a solid cartridge for the money). That said, I upgraded the Virtuoso stylus to a shibata, so that could be making the difference here.

    Longevity: I'll give this to the Technics, too. There just don't seem to be many direct drives of quality in between the Hanpin clones and the mega bucks DD models by VPI, etc. I'll agree with the consensus opinion that direct drive has a sound (I don't think it sounds remotely "digital" however), and I love its speed stability. With that in mind, I can't see parting with the 1200GR any time soon. I'm imagining it will be a workhorse for years and likely decades to come. And I believe it will scale with better cartridges (which I'm considering now). The Marantz is a great package, but, to me, it gives you a glimpse of the ladder you can climb with belt drives: stepping up to heavier platters, more robust motors, speed controllers, multiple arms, etc. You can't actually upgrade the Marantz itself, but it shows you--or me, anyway--how all those parts begin to influence the sound.

    Upgradability: Not sure much can be done with either (or, anyway, I'm not yet interested in the various KAB Technics tweaks). Both are somewhat closed systems. However, the swappable head shell and easily adjustable VTA on the Technics lets you play different cartridges *much* more easily. I find replacing and installing carts on the Marantz a pain, as the connecting wires are small, fiddly, and easy, it seems, to break. That said, as I note above, you can put the Satisfy tonearm on another table. So that's an upgrade path (and one I might take in a couple, three years, while hanging on to the Technics).

    TL;DR: The 1200GR remains my primary. If I was buying it again, I'd skip the 2m Bronze and go to a ~1K cart like a Dynavector or an AT ART9 (which I haven't heard but are often recommended here). That puts you at $3K, however. If you prefer to stay around $1000-$1500, the Marantz is a truly excellent choice. I didn't see anything else out there that's as good a package. Either way, you'll have a great table. And, if that's not true, then I did a lot of research for nothing!
     
    Tlay, ranch 22b, Gabe Walters and 2 others like this.
  10. punkmusick

    punkmusick Amateur drummer

    Location:
    Brazil
    Nice! And how about sound?
     
  11. wbass

    wbass Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Indeed! But, tbh, I don't feel I've gotten enough experience with various decks to really make any solid judgments about the sonic character of either 'table. The Marantz surprised me with its subtlety, transparency, and bass note differentiation, but that could be down to the Virtuoso with upgraded stylus.

    Certainly I prefer both tables to the ones I've had previously: a Pro-Ject with Sumiko Oyster cartridge (which sounded really dark and muddy) and a Music Hall Ikura, which was a pretty cool table and sounded decent with a 2M Blue but perhaps didn't have the best speed stability, especially next to the Technics.

    I have the idea to get a second Virtuoso cheap (i.e. broken cantilever), put another ATN95SA stylus on it, and do a straight up comparison between the 1200GR and the Marantz. But with two different cartridges, I don't think I can make any meaningful sound comparisons.
     
    punkmusick likes this.
  12. keiron99

    keiron99 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Stockport, UK
    I was dusting my SL1200G this morning and, for no particular reason, lifted the mat (it's a leather one) just to clean under there too. You can see what I saw in the image (hope it's uploaded...)

    I tried wiping with just a damp cloth and it won't come off. Any idea what it is - has it come from the leather? What cleaner to use?

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/hf2V4rripz2eAP4i9
    [​IMG]
     
  13. Slick Willie

    Slick Willie Decisively Indecisive

    Location:
    sweet VA.
    Wow, looks like there was some chemical residue on the mat...hope it didn't etch the clear coat!

    [​IMG]
     
  14. gguy

    gguy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wildomar, CA
    You will likely need a metal cleaner like brasso
     
  15. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    That will ruin the lacquer. I think that is leather dye? I suggest try automotive restoration paste for clear coat paint and hope that it hasn't got through to the brass. Why anyone would think leather is suitable for TT mats is beyond me.
     
    Andrew Littleboy likes this.
  16. gguy

    gguy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wildomar, CA
    Wasn’t aware of a laquer over the brass, I’m surprised it would get through if so...

    I’ve never had such an issue with my leather mat over a steel Thorens platter or my 1200mkii platter
     
  17. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    Try mild soap solution (colorless, no alcohol) for glass and see if it works.
     
  18. TarnishedEars

    TarnishedEars Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Seattle area
    Why not (at least before seeing these pictures)? Many people have reported that leather matts sound the best of anything that they have tried. And unless the leather is saturated with some chemicals from the tanning process, one would think that it should be perfectly safe. I had actually considered trying one myself until I stumbled upon a superb sounding combo for my GR.
     
    Lucca90 likes this.
  19. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict Look what I found

    Location:
    AZ
    Maybe that is a result / reaction from some cleaner / chemical you already used? Did some moisture, liquid or cleaner get on the bottom side of the mat, and was installed damp or wet and left there to react?

    Also, what brand of leather mat was used? Maybe the quality of the leather inferior and was leaching and / or tanning and drying process was flawed or incomplete?

    Either way, something clearly leached out or reacted with something from the bottom side of your mat. Can you post a picture of your mat, and the bottom of the mat too?
     
  20. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict Look what I found

    Location:
    AZ
    I can't tell from the pic - but also realize that if whatever reacted with the platter, that if it etched into the metal / surface, it maybe something that will never be completely correctable. I can't tell if what you have is surface crud or is etched into the surface from the pics though -- I am sure you tried to wipe it with distilled water or something first?

    Any attempts at cleaning it? Realize also depending what is on there it is possible that your cleaner will react with the substance and it may create further etching.
     
  21. Slick Willie

    Slick Willie Decisively Indecisive

    Location:
    sweet VA.

    I used the term 'etched', but don't know if that is correct. I also stated a clear coat, again not sure. But all bronze I have seen will dull after some years past.
    So, I assume a clear coat....but upon closer inspection of my table, I am not so sure.
    However there is somewhat of a milled finish that polishing may change. May have to power polish the entire platter to remove staining and keep a consistent finish?
    Anyhooo….think I'll just stick with what Technics thought would work on their products...the rubber mat.
     
  22. TarnishedEars

    TarnishedEars Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Seattle area
    I'd try windex on that platter myself. I've never seen anything become damaged by cleaning with windex yet. It is the only cleaner that I trust for most of my equipment.
     
  23. Vinyldude63

    Vinyldude63 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Smithtown, NY
    Just set up my 1200gr. Anyone using the interconnects that come with it?
     
    punkmusick likes this.
  24. punkmusick

    punkmusick Amateur drummer

    Location:
    Brazil
    I am. No problem.
     
    MusicNBeer likes this.
  25. MusicNBeer

    MusicNBeer Forum Resident

    Location:
    Florida
    I'm not, but only because I have a 0.5m super low capacitance Bluejeans coax, and I have an AT VM740ML that's super sensitive to capacitance. The included cable is fine if your cartridge is less sensitive.
     

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