Schiit Sol- The Next Great Turntable?

It's always have been obvious to me most of the hate comes from the "expensive is better, so need to think" audiophiles - of course, even if you are that affluent and can afford the $500K system, they are still self conscious about that.

That is true of many companies, specially in this industry. Linkwitz? Grado? many more - again, their sin is being good and affordable. That's why I am in the middle of this. Trying hard not to come off as a fanboi - I like Schiit, but I HATE the unthinking "more expensive is always better" attitude more. You can see it around the audiophile forums - everytime someone posts a question trying to solve a problem, there is always someone saying "well, the problem is that your gear is not high end enough".

1.- Personally, I disagree on making "Made in America" a selling point - don't care, just want a good product. You are 100% right - built in China does not mean bad - I see a lot of that around audiophile products - gotta tell you the truth - I see ugly prejudice on that. They build to a price point requested by the company employing them. Blame the company if bad, but as Apple have shown, high quality products ARE being built in China.

2.- Re: Topping - man - I was not even gonna reply to the comment but again, we need to stop saying "I listened therefore X is better" - without a true blind test experiment this is just an opinion, not the truth. - opinions - we all have one and they all stink...

Therefore, while I have not listened to those products side by side, I can say that no, it is NOT proven that one (any one of them) is better than the other one.

v

 

We can agree to disagree about superior sound not mattering while doing something else. I still like my vinyl while I’m cooking or doing housework. I wouldn’t probably want to use a Sol in those situations...

I used to use a Fluance (admittedly not their newer, improved models, but basic plinth and tonearm design appear the same), and it was fine, but unreliable and definitely nowhere near as enjoyable to use or listen to as my Technics SL-1210GR. Returns are absolutely not diminishing with that step up (8.5x the price of the RT-80 I have, but at least 10x the value to me, which of course is subjective). I would agree if your max budget is $500 (I realize this is hypothetical in your case, as you said you’re all set), the top Fluance model is probably the best choice among new turntables. I do think most people would rather use that than a Sol, which is decidedly for tinkerers, but I would guess the Sol sounds better with proper setup, if for no other reason than the ability to align a cartridge properly (Fluance has no VTA adjustment).

 

Unfortunately, lots of times, the mundane/logical/obvious course of action is amazing...

v

 

I'm not an adoring fan of any brand/corporation. I like the few inexpensive items of Schiit gear I have. I think they handled the issue nicely.

 

You realize product quality is not the main selling point of “Made in America” to a lot of people, right? I agree with you regarding quality, and I have also seen the “ugly prejudice” implying that everything made in China is crappy. However, a very large component of the “buy American” mindset is to help support the livelihoods of fellow Americans and keep money in our own economy, rather than support horrific working conditions in China (sure, Apple makes great products in China, some of which I am using this very moment, but they have also had to take suicide prevention measures at the plant...). A company like Schiit making everything in the US is desirable beyond just “America good; China bad.”

 

Definitely - a complex subject - I said I did not care - to most consumers it is like that - but I also think is indeed sad that there is no more manufacturing here in the US. But to keep going on is to open a can of worms - your comment is 100% right.

v

 

Actually, sound quality DOES matter to me even when doing something else.It's just that it's "less" important than when I'm "just listening".

 

I can't really speak to the reliability of the Fluance, and honestly I would just assume that, other than belt replacements, it would last for decades. That may be way off base, but it also speaks to why I only do Direct Drive. Reliability.

Regardng the tinkering aspect, it's a big deal for me, but I don't consider a turntable with a fixed headshell to be good for tinkering, since the main way to "tinker" with a tonerarm is to try lots of different cartridges. Changing cartridges with a fixed headshell is something I swore, way back in 1979, that I would never do again.

 

Definitely not buying one of these right away (not that I have the money at the moment regardless) but will definitely be watching this going forward. I'm looking to get a 2nd TT for my upstairs and $700 is definitely the limit, but I'm not sure what other models are comparable in the $500-700 price range? My main TT is a Technics 1210 but I know the new rebooted Technics are wayyy out of my range, and I'll probably never stumble on a used one for the same $500 I got my current one. (Thanks, craigslist!)

I had a Pro-Ject entry level TT for a bit but I wasn't very impressed with it. I'd love for this Schiit one to be the answer.

 

Well, let’s just say I went through five different motors until the warranty period was through, but it’s possible the newer models use a better motor, for all I know.

Sol has interchangeable arm wands, which effectively gives the same function as interchangeable headshells, though it does cost more (unless you’re using $200 headshells...). I agree, even though I currently only use one cartridge, I wouldn’t want to have to unmount it in order to try another one, so removable headshell or arm wand is high on my list of must-have features.

 

To each their own. I swore decades ago that I would not use a 'loose' headshell again after hearing how much better a fixed one sounded. But, I like to keep an open mind; I even had an FR64FX at one point because they were supposed to be good, but the sound was dark and muted, with indistinct, muddled bass. Sold that one on and never looked back.

I agree though that the fixed shell can be a pain in the butt when installing cartridges. That's what's appealing about the Sol...the arm can simply be pulled off to to work on it.

 

You're in the wrong topic...this is about the Sol! Not about the best sub $500 TT or about the importance of cart vs. table or about cars.

 

Back in the 70's, when I bought my ADC LMF 2 tonearm there was also an LMF 1. The difference was that the LMF 1 had a fixed headshell. And yeah, it was supposed to sound better. But, being a salesman, it was very easy for me to audition both.

That's why I got an LMF 2 with two headshells. To this day, one has had the ZLM mounted and the other the AT20.

The best analogy I can think of regarding removable headshells: A car without air conditioning will get a little better horsepower and mileage, but I still have AC. If I lived in Alaska, it might not be my choice though, come to think of it, summers can be warm. But in the 60's AC really hit your mileage and power. Not so today. i.e. there is little reason NOT to have it, which may be why pretty much all cars come with it standard now. I'm surprised the same thing has not happened with removable headshells. I think it may be a cost thing.

 

Yeah. I get that. I just keep responding to other people that responded to me. i.e. we've hijacked the thread. Sorry.

Sometimes, when responding to posts, I don't even look at the thread title.

 

A better analogy would be a road bike with skinny, high pressure tires vs a mountain bike with fat, heavy ones. The fat tires will give you a cushier ride, but slow and plodding; the skinny ones will transmit road vibrations to the frame but will be more responsive in the turns and accelerations. Each has its purpose...as it happens I don't do off-roading....and my car doesn't have AC...

 

Fluid damping also adds resistance to acceleration and deceleration.

 

Although it seems to have a few minor glitches, how can you beat the price with that much tweakability? It looks to be far better than most of the cutting boards in that price range. I would definitely like to
see a more massive platter. Looks promising.

 

I think you make some good points here. But as it seems to me, Schiit are the ones beating the drum against "more expensive = more good" to serve their own goals of claiming their products are better then Unnamed Higher Priced Competitor mostly apropos of nothing. It paints a picture where nobody actually makes anything better then Schiit, only more expensive.

At this point I'll loop in the Topping example - I paid $500 for the BiFrost. I paid $120 for the Topping. As I follow you, shouldn't I be biased towards the product I paid more money for? You're right that me saying I felt the Topping was better and I feel most people would agree is meaningless, but wasn't I supposed to pick the higher priced gear that gets more accolades and forum raves?

We definitely agree that people take their objections to things being made in China to a very ugly level and don't understand that race-to-the-bottom decisions are made by the Western companies that employ the factories, not "China".

 

Is this a joke? The D30 measures great but sounds like dog doo. You must be an Amir admirer.

 

The Topping D30 was the worst sounding DACs I've heard since the 1990s. Just a huge amount of digital glare. Not at all natural sounding.

 

My analogy fits my point, and your analogy fits yours.

BTW, I have a mountain bike AND a road bike.

And one reason I bought my ATLP120 was to get a 78rpm stylus for the factory cartridge to play 78's.

 

I see $100 as junk and $500 as entry level. If you think $500 is were diminishing returns sets in you have had little experience of more sophisticated turntables. Maybe $5000 or even $10,000.

 

It's nice to see a company admit a mistake (although I think a touch of professionalism might be more appropriate than folksy rudeness).
It's also disheartening to see a company brag that it took 5 years to bring a product to market because they are perfectionists only to immediately turn around and brag that they are being so honest in admitting they totally screwed up the product.
I was actually looking at this TT the other day, but his is a turn-off for sure. Not sure I can afford to spend my money on products from companies that are so eager to admit how they 'dun ***** up'.

I'm not a partner in the company, I'm not 'one of the gang'. I'm a consumer who is looking to get the best value from a company I can trust will provide that.

 

That's a valid point.

 

About removable head shells, I do love the convenience of them. However, I can see how it would add cost and complexity to produce. Offering the option for multiple tonearms is a good compromise in my mind, because while a whole tonearm is more expensive than a head shell, the Schiit tonearms are also way cheaper than most companies that sell standalone arms.