the 2017 Ludwig LPs use the same transfers as these SHM CDs? how can that be when the SHM CDs say they are 2018 transfers?
the discs themselves don't say so, must just be a mistake on CDJapan's listing; "Cardboard sleeve reissue release from Elton John features SHM-CD format. The mini LP faithfully replicates the UK first pressing LP design (gatefold) with a 12-page booklet. An obi faithfully replicating the Japanese first pressing LP design. Uses the master made in 2018 based on the UK analog tapes."
the Japanese took the 2017 transfers and (re)mastered them in 2018, i get it now. shame they sucked the life out of some of them in the process.
Off topic question. Does the fact that two masterings don't exactly line up, move out of sync in a digital editor always mean that a new analog to digital transfer was done? I mean, apart from the possibility that an engineer willfully digitally sped up or slowed down a track while mastering. I'm thinking in particular of eighties digital masterings copied from one videotape to another or from one vcr editing system to the next.
Tthis could only happen if incorrectly (re-)sampled. For instance going from 44056Hz (old semi-pro NTSC videotape-based sampling rate) to 44100Hz. Going from say 44.1kHz to 48kHz would be very noticeable in terms of speed and pitch difference.
Yes, have compared and it is there on the earlier shm cd, but its not as obvious, the more i listen it sounds like someone holding down a note on the organ if i was to guess.
Thank you. So the existence of such screwed up commercial releases seems unlikely. Or do you know of some?
I don’t see how it could be a keyboard sound that didn’t exist on the recording before. Would have to be some error with the mastering.
really it was just one out of three i was disappointed with for being too laid back (Caribou).. Blue Moves & Don't Shoot Me = fab!
If you dont hear anything its no big deal,what make me thinks its a keyboard it does change pitch slightly,and when the song picks up volume it stops and restart when the volume reduces, its quite deep in the mix.
I have heard that some Dead Can Dance CD releases were like that but I never checked. And there was a 44.1 to 48kHz screw up on the last King Crimson boxset.
I order airmail all the time from CDJapan and it usually takes around two weeks but for my last order of 13 cds it took almost a month so times can vary. It states on the website that it could take up to 8 weeks. I live in the U.S. Just be patient.
Empty Sky “Empty Sky - SHM is best overall by a good margin.” -- lovealego “Empty Sky - DJM CD13 (mastered at Nimbus)” – Jelloza “Empty Sky - 1) Polydor/DJM 2) [ runner-up] none worthy” -- Brudr “… the new SHM is more compressed than the others and lacks the warmth and balance of the others in the series. I find the Polydor CD (likely DJM clone?) to sound more like the original DJM vinyl (which is a good thing).” Brudr, Thursday at 12:11 PM #2856 “Average as an overall listening experience compared to the others in this series, but probably above average if the quality of the original recording/mix is taken into account.” Stefan, Yesterday at 2:14 PM #2864 “Empty Sky always had a rougher sound to me - just less polished. While Elton's other albums sonically sound really great for being nearly 50 years old, ES sounds like a 60s recording to me - sonically.” JamesRR, Thursday at 2:31 PM #2866 "Listened through Empty Sky again and actually think it sound as good I think it coould. It was recorded on a less than stellar way and I don’t think possession of the original master tape would have changed much. Since I never had this on CD before I can not compare. To me this one sounds OK with it’s wide stereo/separation and bass more frequent than on the others. It still sounds good but no sonic make up can hide this is an inferior recorded album than what came next from Elton. Still worth having – it’s charming period-piece with a few great ones. The stonesey Psych-rock of the title-track is stunning for example." Bemagnus, Thursday at 8:04 PM #2882 “Listening to the SHM of Empty Sky. This is interesting as it sounds exactly how I remember the vinyl, particularly the grainy vocals. It has to be said though that the SHM brings out some striking details, Caleb Quaye's psychedelic guitar licks during Empty Sky, the whistling at the end of Hymn 2000, which I have never heard the random bit right at the end, nice rolling piano sound on other tracks. TBH, it sounds like early Procol Harum albums do. It is no louder on my system than the others I have listened to. This version is not as bad as I was expecting, it maintains the raucous and the primative sound of the original recording but adds something extra. At the moment I couldn't say whether this is best, but it's certainly worthy and if this was my only copy I would be happy. Edit, just backed to backed Gulliver's gone, with the DJM, and think I get what happened and why the DJM sounds smoother - its because the vocal is lower in the mix. The SHM allows the distortion to come through more. You could argue the SHM is maybe more faithful to the original recording.” Oyster Boy, Yesterday at 3:09 PM #2898 “I would say that the volume is certainly louder on this SHM compared to the other Eltons, but the waveforms do not show brickwalling or limiting. It may be a result of the master they used. It's interesting, because, when you look at the waveforms (I know, trust your ears), the other SHMs I've seen have a lot of headroom. As I posted earlier, the highest track peak on Empty Sky is "Val-Hala" at 0.999969. None of the others come close. It's just... different.” supermd, Yesterday at 3:39 PM #2900 “Actually, I was listening to Empty Sky a bit more today and it's not really that bad. It's definitely growing on me. I really think the difference we hear between it and the others in the series is due to the quality of the recording more than whatever master tape may have been used. The mix is denser, with more compression (not digital compression or brickwalling). It doesn't have the sound of a well recorded album, the way the others do. Still, it's not too bad and not that far from the album that followed it (in the UK). One thing I can say is that my comparison of the Empty Sky tracks from the Ludwig master download that came with the vinyl LP reissue and the SHM-CD line up perfectly digitally. This mean it's extremely likely that both were mastered from the same transfer from analog tape.” Stefan, Yesterday at 10:00 PM #2905 Thanks again to everyone for your comments. I learned a lot from them, especially from the Oyster Boy review. Unfortunately, I cannot take into account neither the historical importance of Elton's debut album, nor the fact that the original master tape was missing along with its very first spare copy (very possible). Another fact that it sounds closer to the original LP does not make the sound of the SHM-CD version better. I understand that they did everything possible to find the best sound source for this release... but what we have here (grainy vocal, some abrasiveness in a mid-range and "boominess" in the bass) is associated in my mind with DR8. (To be honest, I wonder what happened ... - since the Universal Flat Transfer trademark is its good dynamics). Because this is not DR4-5, and it’s still listenable at the normal sound level (especially in quieter songs), and because it has a more detailed sound, the best I could do, just to raise a little above the “Average” to the border with the category “Good”: Empty Sky – Good/Average (second after Polydor/DJM CD, which has smoother sound and better dynamics) P.S. Universal provided sound samplers of this album in 2018, and more likely this is 2018 master. (love this song)
- update - The rating now looks more realistic, but far from the finish: Empty Sky – Good/Average (second after Polydor/DJM CD, which has smoother sound and better dynamics) Tumbleweed Connection – Best (second best after MFSL) Elton John Don't Shoot Me I'm Only the Piano Player – Best (the best digital version) And Goodbye Yellow Brick Road – Best (the best digital version) Blue Moves – Best (the best digital version) Captain Fantastic – Best (the best digital version, slightly superior to MCA and DJM due to advantages of the new 192Hz/24-bit transfer) Caribou – Good (the matter of preference: roll-off trebles of SHM vs. heavy brightness of DJM CD) Greatest Hits – Good (second best after DCC) Greatest Hits 2 – Good (the best digital version)
I am confused on how you labeled TC as Best, then put 2nd Best to the MFSL in (Brackets)? Were not enough reviews done for 'ST' and 'MATW' yet to add to your concensus? I am getting a few of these Titles, but for the ones I already own still have no plans to sell of my MFSL Gold CDs for TC, MATW, HC & GYBR and my DJM for Captain Fantastic & Self Titled(although own 2 copies of that ST, so maybe will sell off one of them in the future). The Deluxe 2 CD Sets from the early 2000s are great to have for the Bonus Songs like the Earlier Version on 'Madman Across the Water' Song(Better IMO) on the 2nd CD on the Deluxe 'TC'(and Wembley Concert for the Deluxe 2 CD Set for 'Captain Fantastic', which would make for a Great RSD Release-IMO).
I have to be but have ordered just 3 titles to see if they are as good as (mostly) everyone here says. I'm just worried that any time "no longer available" will pop up under some of the other titles I (may) want.
I’ve been able to spend more time with these remasters over the past several days. While I would not change the order of any of my preferences, I may have been too harsh on a few of them. For example, Empty Sky is my second favorite after the Polydor and better than my initial impressions. I would say the same for Honky Chateau as, upon further listen , I would say it is as good as the MFLS, though the Polydor may still be my favorite.
Sometimes there's some sort of very minor speed variation introduced. Exactly how, I don't know, but I've run across it. That said, it's usually pretty easy to tell if that's the case or it's an entirely different A/D transfer. If you attempt to sync two sources using the start and end points, and they basically stay in sync, they are almost certainly the same A/D transfer. If they frequently drift, however, they are almost certainly different A/D transfers.
