Madonna: Madame X - album released 14th June 2019

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Bink, Apr 30, 2019.

  1. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    well American Life was a much bigger sales disaster than Erotica, but I don't remember her public image in tatters over it the way it was open season on her in 92-93. I was a young teen at the time and pretty much the universal opinion was Madonna was a "slut" and people looked at me weird for being a fan of hers. Her image took a huge beating at the time and most people seemed to assume her best days were behind her. Granted I was much older in 2003 but the only people I really saw getting mad at her over American Life were the Bush supporting uber-conservatives who were pro-war and saw that video as "traitor", but these were not generally people who listened to Madonna to begin with so they weren't really a factor in her fanbase. The album just didn't connect with the public and didn't have that killer single associated with Madonna albums. Radio on the other hand wouldn't jump on "Hung Up" as a followup even though itunes numbers were big and the song was a smash everywhere else as if making an anti-war video was unpardonable when it offended less people than a book of nude photos
     
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  2. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Yes, "Erotica" sold better, but it also marked a much bigger sales decline than "AL" did.

    "AL" "bombed" because people didn't like it, not because of image issues.

    1992 was the first real chink in Madonna's armor, and that's why it seems like a much bigger deal.

    2003 was just the slow, inevitable decline of a pop star who'd been popular for 20 years.

    BTW, lots of people called Madonna a "slut" and looked funny at male fans well before 1992! ;D
     
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  3. Crimson Witch

    Crimson Witch Roll across the floor thru the hole & out the door

    Location:
    Lower Michigan
    I like MadameX, in spite of the vox effects/processing which I usually have a vague aversion to. I like Madonna's writing and studio work enough that the electronic manipulation of her voice in places doesn't prevent me from seeing the album for the solid effort that it is artistically.
     
  4. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Well true, but I do remember a huge decline in her "coolness". I was in the first grade when True Blue was big and I remember all the eighth grade girls loved me because of my love for Madonna, Janet Jackson, Cyndi Lauper, The Bangles and the other female pop stars of the day (I know a lot of "stans" partake in this music as sports analogy that liking another female pop star is like rooting for two basketball teams who are competing, but I've never subscribed to that), Madonna was considered cool back then. I remember she wasn't as popular as Paula Abdul in 89-90 in my school but I thought she was better than before. By Sex/Erotica, she was considered shameful for some reason.

    I think AL was probably a bigger dropoff because Music sold roughtly 3 million in the US, American Life sold 700k last time someone posted Soundscan numbers. Compared to Like A Prayer's 4 million and Erotica's 1.9 million (these numbers were posted on Madonnanation a long time ago), AL fell far worse because Music retained about 80% of ROL's numbers and had one of her biggest hits ever as well as another top 5 hit, American Life was a freefall in comparison. But Confessions sold 1.6 million in the US yet despite the upturn in sales radio wouldn't welcome her back the way they welcomed Mariah back the same year.
     
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  5. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    Assuming you grew up in Kentucky, you and I will have different perspectives.

    You're also way younger than I am. I had just finished my 1st year of college when "True Blue" hit, so I was in late high school when Madonna first emerged.

    Madonna was never cool for straight guys to like, so I got crap from friends...

    I don't think simple #s comparison tells the story. Madonna was unquestionably the biggest female pop star in 1990, so for her to become so "shunned" a couple years later was an enormous dip.

    Yes, "AL" showed a bigger %age sales drop from "Music" than "Erotica" did from "Prayer", but as I mentioned, 1992 was the first time Madonna hit a major snag in her career. The drop in 2003 was less surprising...
     
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  6. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Well Louisville is the more liberal/metropolitan/free-thinking area of KY.. The divide between us and the rest of the state (except for maybe Lexington which is also a big college town) is like NYC and Alabama (we're proudly the one city in the state Trump lost in 2016).

    I've always been a big fan of Madonna because I first heard her around age four from my older sister who was a big fan of that first record in 1984 (she's 15 years my senior, so she was 20 when I was 5). But yea, I kept my fandom a little more on the downlow when I entered high school and was in the closet and also happened to be a fan of a lot of the alt-rock that was big at the time, so I would be buying her cd's and keeping them (and TLC and Alanis Morissette and Mariah Carey and so on...) in a drawer whenever friends would come over at one point out of fear of being judged lol.
     
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  7. bob60

    bob60 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    Why wouldn't radio play Hung Up?
    It was a fantastic single that sold by the truckload.
     
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  8. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Radio tried to claim "this won't fit on our playlists" when articles posted about the refusal of US radio to get off their Madonna ban after AL. The song did go top 10 due to being #1 on digital sales but it didn't even crack the top 40 on radio airplay, when even something as uncommercial as Die Another Die had been an airplay hit three years earlier.
     
  9. bob60

    bob60 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    Wow, US radio sure holds a grudge...
     
  10. fsutall

    fsutall Senior Member

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    The "Sex" book didn't help matters, but IMO the relative failure of Erotica had more to do with the lack of any killer singles. Nothing on the album was anywhere near as catchy as "Vogue", "Like A Prayer", "Express Yourself", "Open Your Heart", etc. from the preceding albums. I still put on Erotica occasionally but I haven't been able to sit through the entire album since 1993. Some judicious editing would have made for a much better listening experience!
     
  11. George Co-Stanza

    George Co-Stanza Forum Resident

    Location:
    America
    Interesting.

    I wonder, too, if younger peeps view her collaborations with younger stars as desperation, like she needs to latch on to them to try and stay relevant and sell records.
     
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  12. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    "Deeper and Deeper" is super-catchy! As is "Bye Bye Baby", though I admit I prefer the live version of that one. Omar Hakim for the win!

    And "Erotica" is an ear worm. It's not a bust-out pop song like the other others, but it's still something that embeds in your brain.

    I also loved the 2006 reworking she did for that one:

     
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  13. pwhytey

    pwhytey Forum Resident

    Yes, I was also going to mention 'Deeper and Deeper'. I've always thought it should've been the lead single from Erotica. It would've been a massive #1.

    Of course, I realise the song 'Erotica' charted very well — but it did seem inextricably linked with the Sex book, and must've contributed to the (mostly American) backlash. Heralding the new album with a big disco song could have changed everything.
     
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  14. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I think "D&D" was fine as a 2nd single.

    For an artist with a track record, it's not a bad idea to put out a less obvious hit as the first single. It'll get plenty of attention on its own because it's your new song - see Prince and "Gett Off".

    Save the stronger singles for later to revive interest in the album - also see Prince and "Cream"! :D

    Now you don't want to push the killer singles too far down the road or you risk the whole enterprise, but holding a great single for the 2nd release makes perfect sense for someone who's famous already.

    If you're a new artist, obviously you put your best out there right away!
     
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  15. Jmac1979

    Jmac1979 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Back to Madame X. I saw the picture disc of it at Barnes And Noble today. They want $59.99, no wonder this thing didn't sell a lot of units. I actually am someone who finds picture discs neat and have a handful of albums on the format (Madonna's first two albums, Purple Rain, Sgt. Pepper to name a few) but basically $60 for THIS

    [​IMG]
     
  16. fsutall

    fsutall Senior Member

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    So you rate those songs as high as the singles I mentioned? We'll have to disagree on that. "Deeper and Deeper" is a good song and was deservedly a top 10 hit for her, but I don't think it would have placed much higher than it's #7 peak even if it had been the leadoff single.
     
  17. fsutall

    fsutall Senior Member

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    Amazon has had it for $35 for several weeks. I'll probably pick it up if it drops down around $25 even though I already own the black vinyl pressing.
     
  18. Oatsdad

    Oatsdad Oat, Biscuits, Abbie & Mitzi: Best Dogs Ever

    Location:
    Alexandria VA
    I didn't specifically rate any of them other than to say I think "D&D" and "BBB" are very catchy.

    Just indicating I think "Erotica" does come with catchy single material!

    Gotta love this!

     
  19. fsutall

    fsutall Senior Member

    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    I do find it odd that Bye Bye Baby was never released as a single in the US; it was one of the best songs on the album
     
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  20. Psychedelic Good Trip

    Psychedelic Good Trip Beautiful Psychedelic Colors Everywhere

    Location:
    New York
    I like X but wish she would just cancel this debacle of a tour and make a new album with a really good producer. Better lyrics would help as well. Like Madge very much I just hope she realizes that she can no longer do these strenuous live shows. Dance around sing but don't over do it. Age sucks for all of us but keep it real Madge.
     
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  21. Bink

    Bink Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I am just curious about what the plan is next recording wise now that she has come to the end of her current contract. I would kind of like her to do a deal with Warner Bros that would involve new music as well as a decent reissue programme.
     
  22. Psychedelic Good Trip

    Psychedelic Good Trip Beautiful Psychedelic Colors Everywhere

    Location:
    New York

    Well Madge is very business smart she'll know what to do, I hope. A solid producer would help as well.
     
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  23. bob60

    bob60 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    Not sure about that really, you can track her downfall right back to when she signed to Live Nation.
    I thought Madonna was fantastic right up until then, and I haven’t liked anything she’s done since, well not a full album anyway.
    It will be really interesting to see how she plays it out next. This whole period must surely have made her aware of how her career has slipped. But you can never write Madonna off...
     
  24. bob60

    bob60 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London UK
    Madonna arrived on stage only 20 minutes late last night, she was informed by Westminster council in no uncertain terms that the curtain would be coming down on stage at 11pm no matter what.
    There are some good reviews coming through..
     
  25. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I heard a good report of the show this morning. It was stated Madonna is performing in a lot of pain. UK is generally very strict about performances ending by 11.00 pm as local councils have strict noise policies. Even Glastonbury festival.
     

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