Stranger than Fiction, Larger Than Life: the Finn Brothers song-by-song discussion thread

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Lance LaSalle, Jan 21, 2019.

  1. Mooserfan

    Mooserfan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eastern PA
    That chord makes it for me. What a beautiful tribute. What’s not to love? It could go on forever and I wouldn’t care. I’m a day late, but Mary gets a 4.8 from me.
     
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  2. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    New average for "Mary of the South Seas" (the last one was miscounted and this one includes Mooserfan's rating)

    1-0
    2-0
    3-4
    4-7
    5-3
    Average: 3.8714
     
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  3. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Collated ratings for Finn

    1. Only Talking Sense 4.425
    2. Eyes of the World 3.9458
    3. Mood Swinging Man 3.925
    4. Last Day of June 4.5367
    5. Suffer Never 3.925
    6. Angel's Heap 4.6906
    7. Niwhai 2.9471
    8. Where Is My Soul 4.0533
    9. Bullets In MY Hairdo 3.17
    10. Paradise (Wherever You Are) 3.8083
    11. Kiss the Road of Raratonga 2.7933
    Finn album: 3.889
    Average by song: 3.8382

    • Mary of the South Seas 3.8714


     
  4. jcr64

    jcr64 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Indiana
    "Comet" is an enjoyable trifle, the kind of thing that a talented songwriter like Tim can toss off with seemingly no effort. It's cotton candy--it's insubstantial, and it dissolves instantly, but it's sweet and bings a smile.

    3/5
     
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  5. factory44

    factory44 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA USA
    I thought everyone here would want to see this. From the April issue of Mojo magazine.


    [​IMG]
    upload images
     
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  6. robcar

    robcar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    "Comet" is nothing special, certainly lyrically, but it hits a sort of sweet spot. Glad that it was issued on one of the I Like It Rare compilations.

    3.2/5
     
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  7. factory44

    factory44 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA USA
    Yes—you are going to want them all! Like I said in their tour documentary, “Sloan are like The Beatles to me”. That’s how much this band means to me.

    Since you liked NHTEOI so much I’d recommend going for their 2nd, 3rd, and 4th albums next; Twice Removed, One Chord To Another, and Navy Blues.
    I know you’ll enjoy them!
     
  8. dthomas850

    dthomas850 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cleveland, Ohio
    I'd also recommend "Commonwealth", such a great album!
     
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  9. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    Thank you very much for posting this article - very interesting!
     
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  10. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    In a way, it was both surprising and not surprising. I was on the fan mailing list (Tongue in the Mail) back then, which was very active and had lots of discussions. During the Together Alone tour, there was usually at least one list member at any given show, posting detailed reports of the concerts they/we attended, almost every article in any magazine about the band was reported upon and the same with radio and TV appearances. Even before Paul's departure from the group in April 1994 it seemed clear there were tensions within the band, that the U.S. record company was pretty unenthusiastic about the band at that time and that there were also conflict within the management. After that very long world tour it was then announced that Tim and Neil would do the Finn Brothers album before any new Crowded House album would happen. I remember reading an interview with another songwriter who had been in a very successful (Swedish) group and had released his first solo album one year before his first group disbanded. In this interview, he said something along the lines of "It's usually a warning sign if the main songwriter of a band starts doing solo albums or side projects, that would never happen when the writer is fully committed to his group". (It happened with Split Enz when Tim did a solo album in 1983 and now it was happening with Crowded House). That theory doesn't always apply, some writers can have both solo albums and albums by their group, but in quite a lot of cases it has a ring of truth about it.

    When Crowded House toured Australia (with Midnight Oil and Hunters & Collectors) and New Zealand in early 1995, Neil spoke in interviews about how Crowded House was probably not going to be touring again for the next few years and how he was looking forward to doing other things, producing Dave Dobbyn and Emma Paki and perhaps other NZ artists. He did say that CH were planning a new album at some point but that they wouldn't tour to promote it and the impression I got was that he was less than keen to go back to Crowded House. It wasn't just the departure of Paul from the group, there seemed to be a lot of other issues as well.
    In early 1996, when Neil was touring with ENZSO in New Zealand, there was an article in Q (circa February 1996) which featured separate interviews with Nick (who I think was in Ireland) and Neil and remarkably, Nick asked the journalist to ask Neil if he had written any new songs. You'd think he could just pick up the phone and ask Neil himself. I remember reading the article in a magazine shop and then deciding to not buy a copy, that article was so sad to read, they didn't seem like a functioning band and they didn't seem particularly enthusiastic to talk about upcoming album recordings either, though the article said that the "best of" album would be followed by a new studio album in late 1996.

    Around this time, I spoke to the new A&R guy at the record company in Sweden. There had been a very good person before, for the first four albums, who had been enthusiastic about Crowded House and worked very hard promoting the band, but he had moved on and the new guy had an entirely different attitude. I recall he said, "yes, first there will be a 'best of' album by Crowded House and then later in the year a new album, but we haven't decided which one of them we will promote". Clearly, he didn't think it was worth the bother to promote both. Of course, Sweden is a very small market and not that important to Crowded House either way and I'm sure the UK record company had a different attitude, but at the time it seemed there was only any real commitment to the band from the UK record company.

    So, just as a fan observing from afar, it seemed like there were a lot of issues to be solved before we could expect a new Crowded House album and tour in 1996 - the band members actually getting together and being in the same room, working on songs, record company indifference in many countries, management problems and it just seemed they had a lot to sort out. But before the actual announcement in June 1996, I think most mailing list members expected that things would progress as had been promised - first a "best of" album with some new songs and then a new studio album a few months later. It didn't happen and I remember being surprised at the announcement when it happened, but looking back, it seems the writing had been on the wall for at least 18 months before that.
     
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  11. Michael Rofkar

    Michael Rofkar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Santa Rosa, CA
    "Comet" - meh. 2.5/5
     
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  12. AB40

    AB40 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    I liked it enough that everything is on the list eventually. I already have 'Parallel Play' on the way. However, a friend who works in the Healthcare System recommended that I avoid taking any unnecessary postal shipments for the next few months, particularly internationally, and I trust his advice. Maybe later in the year.
     
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  13. jimbutsu

    jimbutsu WATCH YÖUR STEPPE

    I really like Comet - it's cute. It'd be a fun one to noodle through on a guitar and sing for s#its and giggles (if I had any aptitude). It's charming as all get out, sweet and simple.

    3.75/5
    (I know, I know, I'm trying to keep to whole numbers, with the occasional half number... but I was really truly torn between 3.5 and 4 here)
     
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  14. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Our votes for "Comet"

    1-0
    2-0
    3-4
    4-2
    Average: 3.175
     
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  15. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Apart from the Finn and Altitude albums, Tim seems mainly to have kept himself busy working with other artists in 1995/1996, contributing a couple of songs to a Vika and Linda album and co-writing and co-producing half of an album by Andy White. The album was called Teenage, released on Cooking Vinyl records (who had also released the Altitude album in the UK and True North in Canada, both labels had released Altitude in their respective countries, if I'm not mistaken.) NOwadays, it's administered by ALT recordings.

    Andy White's background essay on the Teenage's genesis and gestation can be found on this page, if you scroll down: Studio Albums 1986–2016 | andywhite.com

    F
    our of the thirteen songs were recorded at Tim's Periscope studios and another song was recorded at Real World Studios in Box, Wiltshire, UK with Tim producing. The rest of the album was recorded in Dublin, and Tim contributed instruments and vocals to a couple of songs on those tracks as well.

    Besides production and some co-writing credits Tim also played various instruments and distinctive vocals.

    I plan to hold up the following songs:

    • If You Don't Know By Now (Andy White-Tim Finn)
    • Jacqui (Andy White-Tim Finn)
    • Because She Loves It (A. White-T.Finn)
    • My Gay Cousin (A. White) (features a co-lead vocal and extensive instrumental work by Tim Finn)
    • Whole Thing (A.White-T. Finn)
    Note: the last song's credit is the original credit; the song appeared later on a Peter Gabriel album Big Blue Ball and the songwriting credit was revised to Alexis Faku, Tim Finn, Peter Gabriel, Geoffrey Oryema, Karl Wallinger & Andy White. The credit seems to have been applied retroactively to the Andy White version but there is no evidence that any of those people worked on this version of the song, and I don't believe they did, though I'm happy to be corrected by someone more steeped in Gabriel lore.

    I have Teenage* and it's a pretty enjoyable and very well recorded light folk-rock album -- certainly tighter than the ALT album. I get the impression from the album, and from ALT and Andy's contribution to "Mary of the South Seas" that Andy White is a stronger wordsmith than he is a melodist -- sort of like an acoustic, mellower Joe Strummer -- and Tim's co-writes are the most melodic of the songs.

    *this thread is nothing is not expensive. Now, I'm going to have to get the Sloan catalogue, apparently.
    -------------------------------------------

    Today's song is "If You Don't Know By Now", written by Andy White and Tim Finn and produced by Andy White, Tim Finn and Simon Polinsky (who had engineered the ALT abum.)


    If You Don't Know By Now

    Andy White: Vocals, Bass
    Tim Finn , drums, vocals (and piano?)

    Andy seems to have released the song again under the name of "The Last Day of Summer", and the lyric can be found under that name.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
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  16. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    This is a beautiful, melancholy piece, stripped bare to its essence of piano, drum, bass and melody. The wistful lyric is great and the performances of both Andy and Tim are understated and subtle. Tim's backing vocals are effective and haunting as well. There are what sounds like the vestiges of an upbeat Tim Finn R&B track here, lying like dead leaves on the ground of the song, so to speak.

    Seeing that Tim and Andy were capable of a song this tight again underscores the intentionally off-the-cuff nature of the ALT album to me and makes me wish they had recorded a whole album that was more serious (with or without Liam.)

    I'll give it a 4.5/5.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
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  17. robcar

    robcar Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    Big Blue Ball was the only album by that self-named project. Although it was spearheaded by Peter Gabriel, it's not a Gabriel album. The album involved several artists and musicians and was slowly developed over a long period of time, only seeing release many years after most of the recordings had taken place. I have the album and will compare this version of "Whole Thing" with the Big Blue Ball version when we get to that song. I would surmise that this represents an earlier version of the song before the other artists added their input to it.
     
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  18. Doctor Mu

    Doctor Mu Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    Late to the party.

    Big Neil/Tim/Enz fan

    Only Talking Sense may be one of the greatest songs ever written. I don't listen to it often. The purity of the emotion is explosive - maybe I'm afraid of its beauty and raw truth.
     
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  19. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    Welcome to the thread. The party is only halfway done. Though perhaps the peak has been reached, we're a long way 'til morning.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
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  20. Doctor Mu

    Doctor Mu Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    Thanks -

    Something backward, something forward.

    I really like the organic paradigm Youth's permissive "production" that spurred Neil's "restlessness" on Together Alone. An absolute gem of an album. Possibly a Top 20 of the Rock Era. The most creative since Split Enz, but a much different sound, particularly with native voices and instruments interwoven. The title track sound harkens to Peter Gabriel's Biko from Melt.

    Mitchell Froom gave CH a sound distinct from Enz, but I felt his production constraining, although Neil and later Neil and Tim imposed their will more on Temple of Low Men and Woodface. I prefer the soundscape Eddie Rayner massaged into the creative machine on Can't Carry On. Rayner is a creative genius. I'm unsure how Froom will fit in the reunion. There's something about the depth of sound on Froom's CH albums and Randy Newman that bothers me. It's a real nuance though and the top shelf songwriting carries the first 2 CH albums. It's exciting to have CH back in any form



    I might rank the Finn Brothers Everyone is Here and Liam's I'll Be Lightning as the most interesting Finn family albums since Together Alone, WIW. I like Dizzy Heights a lot. Second Nature from Out of Silence is near miraculous, although Neil removed the best lyric in the final cut (the best version remains on the YT sessions). Liam has encouraged more exploration in his dad.

    It's strange - although Neil and Neil + Tim's songwriting are fantastic, more sophisticated post-Enz, the production largely less so. As CH as a live Band - early in the Together Alone tour before Hester became too despondent - they were tight and lively. Neil really worked on his guitar acumen over the years.


     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
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  21. Doctor Mu

    Doctor Mu Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    But there's nothing like Enz on their game. The ARIA reunion performance is amazing, even when Neil's vocals get out of the pocket to everyone's amusement.

    Tim crushes Poor Boy. Mygod that band's sound!

     
  22. Doctor Mu

    Doctor Mu Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas
    I agree - Mark Hart made the band, both in studio and live better on Together Alone, Intriguer, the band portion of Time on Earth. Hart opened more possibilities and made Neil a better guitarist.
     
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  23. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    I guess he’s on a fair bit of the FB songs of Woodface, too.
     
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  24. Turk Thrust

    Turk Thrust Forum Resident

    Location:
    U.K.
    If this song didn't have a Finn connection, I would probably quickly forget it. Andy White's voice is pretty thin and the guitar sound isn't to my taste at all.

    It does have a vaguely pleasing overall feel, but a harsh 2.5/5.
     
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  25. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus Thread Starter

    There is no guitar on the song.
     

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