Steve Vai - Appreciation and Album thread *

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by mark winstanley, Feb 4, 2020.

  1. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    I did used to have this book. It is actually quite interesting and not just a tablature book. I may still have it in Australia somewhere, but not over here, so I can't really reference it.

    [​IMG]
     
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  2. Miles1968

    Miles1968 The years just pass like trains

    Location:
    Cardiff
    Great write up Mark :targettiphat:

    I came to Vai through 'Skyscaper', and if I remember correctly had picked up most of the albums we've already been through by the time this came out. I was eagerly awaiting the release of this album and wasn't disappointed.

    I'd tried some of the Shrapnel 'shredder' records which mostly left me cold, as I felt that there was a lot of flash and not much melody. The only other instrumental guitar stuff I really liked at the time was most of Jeff Beck and Yngwie Malmsteen's instrumental tracks.

    Nowadays, I listen to a lot of instrumental guitar music of one kind or another. I credit 'Passion and Warfare' with blowing this kind of music wide open for me. It led me to check out other artists e.g. Joe Satriani, so I'll always be grateful to Mr Vai in general and this album in particular for the amount of pleasure I've had subsequently from this type of music.

    I still listen to this album now and again and think that it holds up very well. Its a great album and one of the best rock instrumental albums around.

    I used to love watching this Guitar Legends show, which includes three tracks from this album - starting just after the 20mins mark (so much so that I've just ordered a DVD of it :))

     
  3. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Firstly - that is magic. The two masters of harmonised guitar May and Vai, beautiful.

    I reckon Jeff beck is about the only guitarist that makes whole instrumental albums as interesting as Vai
     
  4. Miles1968

    Miles1968 The years just pass like trains

    Location:
    Cardiff
    Glad you liked that video - I hope others might check it out, I used to have a cassette of it I taped off the radio too.

    Yes, Jeff is great too (I'm a big fan).
     
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  5. Anthrax

    Anthrax Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Passion And Warfare came into my home around Christmas 1990, when my big brother brought in the cassettes for this album and also Joe Satriani's Flying In A Blue Dream. I immediately liked them both, but it was Passion And Warfare that rewarded repeat listens as it had so much going on that, the more familiar you got with it, the more layers you could hear and focus on. I listened to it so much it became one of those albums from which you know every single detail and noise by heart. I loved having it on my walkman when I had to go on a train trip somewhere, the music itself being its own trip. It wasn't long until I bought my own CD of it.

    Over the years it hasn't lost its shine at all for me and I consider it an absolute masterpiece of composition and arrangement. There's so much music in here, and so many ear-grabbing twists and turns, but it's eminently accessible and, like I said above, gives you more the more time and attention you give it. One of those albums that keep you interested throughout and goes by in a flash. Vai's guitar sounds just like it sounded on Slip Of The Tongue, but you feel as though all the barriers of the conventional hard rock song format have been blown away and now there are no limits to the atmospheres and moods, the melodies speaking in ways that somehow something inside you is able to decode and absorb.

    Passion And Warfare is not just a hard rock guitarfest, it's way more inspired and displays staggering craft and skill. It's mysterious, sensuous, spiritual, tremendously emotional, and a whole lot of fun. Yes, it's just like MUSIC.
     
  6. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Spot on mate :righton:
     
  7. mertoo

    mertoo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Turkey
    Couldn’t explain better, you definetely nailed it:righton: I remember 14 years old myself sitting in my room after school and wearing out the tape, amazed by the musicianship it possessed. It was a game changer for me, love at first listen. I believe that Passion and Warfare is still an underrated album despite all the critical acclaim, sold more than 1.5M units and peaked at#18 on the Billboard chart. This is not just the best instrumental rock record ever created, but also one of the greatest albums of all time. Revolver, Dark Side of the Moon, Nevermind, Led Zeppelin IV, OK Computer or name any other usual suspects that always made the all time album lists; P&W deserves to be there. It is also a great sounding record, expertly recorded and mixed. Get the original US vinyl on Relativity to hear it best. The original cd is good but little bit loud. Friday Music 2LP reissue with bonus tracks is also very very good, actually for a while I thought that the Friday release was the best version ever but after so many listens it just doesn’t have the liveliness of the original. The original vinyl is AAA, I know because Steve confirmed that during one of his interviews but I don’t know if the Friday one was all analog or transferred to digital first before cutting which is a common procedure these days. Anyways, it doesn’t have any effect in my opinion. Both versions mastered and cut by the great Bernie Grundman himself.
     
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  8. Anno

    Anno Forum Resident

    Location:
    Penketh
    First things first, I am a fan of Vai since his Zappa days and through the DLR albums and tours, however I say him play at Donnington with Whitesnake and it just didn’t work, my initial reaction on the first few notes was what on earth happened to Coverdale voice and secondly why is Steve so out of place in this lineup?
    1987 was the last Whitesnake album in my collection and Passion and Warfare my last Vai.
    A truely awful combination!
     
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  9. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    For interest sake what was your issue with Passion and Warfare?
    How long since you listened to it?
     
  10. Anno

    Anno Forum Resident

    Location:
    Penketh
    I loved Passion and Warfare,just didn’t keep up with his career, same with Satriani and Yggli Malmostein or whatever that Blackmore guy is called!

    I tend to like songs and struggle with ‘stunt guitar’ I can appreciate it but don’t really choose to listen to it.

    I am a massive fan of Page but whenever I saw him live he walked the tightrope of genius and car crash every time, which bizarrely I prefer!
     
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  11. Fonz

    Fonz Forum Resident

    Like you, I got this album on release. I was anticipating great things, as I'd been devouring anything and everything 'Vai' for the 12 months prior to its release (clippings, adverts, catching up with any Roth and Zappa stuff I didn't have etc).
    All the guitar mags, particularly the American ones, were hyping it up too, and Steve was clearly giving them plenty of copy. Combined with the release of the Universe (Ibanez) it was a very exciting time to be a guitar player, with an interest in Vai (and the connection with Satch was also milked-I think Flying... had come out about a year before).
    Steve understood the value of marketing. He had such a strong image.
    'Guitarist' magazine in the UK had the P&W cover on their back cover, split over 3 months. Think about that for a second. What other artist could get that sort of coverage?

    This album is every bit as special today as it was then, and one of the tracks will be played at my funeral (No prizes for guessing which!)
     
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  12. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Liberty
    This track is really quite interesting. It is quite short, but manages to say everything it needs to in the time it has.
    It works somewhat like an overture, and also somewhat replicates a national anthem kind of feel.
    "Heads Up" is used several times during the course of the album, unless my mind is playing tricks on me, and it seems to reflect a feeling of reflecting on school. I guess here it is in the context of saying the pledge of allegiance at school to start the day.
    We come in with that tight snare roll and move into that beautiful layered guitar arrangement. In fact predominantly what makes this track such a special opening track is the beautifully arranged layered guitar.
    The grand majestic feel here is really hard to avoid.
    I believe the first live performance of the was in 1991 on Guitar Legends from Seville in Spain... was this an annual event? The one posted said 1992, and I am reading that the initial one was 1991?
    Anyway a perfect opening to the album.

     
  13. Miles1968

    Miles1968 The years just pass like trains

    Location:
    Cardiff
    Great track - I'm going to be saying that a few times as we go through this album :)

    I pretty sure the Guitar Legends concerts took place over 5 nights in October 1991. There was a theme to each night - blues, rock etc. They were part of the build up to Expo '92 in Sevilla which took place in April to October 1992.
     
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  14. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Cheers mate. Thanks for the info
     
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  15. Anthrax

    Anthrax Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Yes, 1991. Those were incredible shows and had coverage in many countries. I got to watch and videotape the majority of each night's performances, since my national tv channel broadcast a show each night but never in full. Incredible line-ups every night, and those shows were my gateway into discovering many great artists. Needless to say, at the time it was the rock night that I watched more than any other, but all concerts were well worth watching.

    My videotapes have long since disappeared, but surely some tv station somewhere must still have the footage. It's probably one of those cases were the myriad different artists and copyrights makes it near impossible to be released in full, but hey, if the complete Woodstock finally saw release, I'll keep on dreaming that one day there'll be a complete Guitar Legends '91 festival on dvd or bluray or whatever.
     
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  16. Miles1968

    Miles1968 The years just pass like trains

    Location:
    Cardiff
    This DVD looks like it has the last two nights, including the 'rock' night featuring Vai etc. You may be able to find it on your local Amazon store, or eBay etc.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Guitar-Leg...ords=Guitar+legends+dvd&qid=1588934977&sr=8-1

    I've got a copy on order, and will post more details on the content when it is delivered :)
     
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  17. Anthrax

    Anthrax Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Thank you. I'm aware of that DVD, but both nights are missing a bunch of performances, which is a real pity. Do tell us about video/sound quality when you get it, though, as it's got a good price anyway.
     
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  18. Miles1968

    Miles1968 The years just pass like trains

    Location:
    Cardiff
    No problem, I'll post more about it once it's delivered and I watch it :)
     
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  19. Sentient Six

    Sentient Six Forum Resident

    Location:
    Annandale, NJ USA
    I remember having that flexi disc with Blue Powder on it but it is probably long gone at this point.

    I had P&W on cassette when it first came out and ended up getting it on CD later on. I remember finding the first Japanese disc at a local chain (Compact Disc World) on the way to work one day. Somebody must have dumped a ton of Japanese CDs because I remember buying Japanese versions of "Eat Em and Smile", Faith No More "The Real Thing", P&W and Metallica "Load" during that trip.

    For me, "For The Love Of God" is still the ultimate Steve Vai song. It is as emotional and passionate a song as anyone could put out. The guitar phrasing is so emotive as a guitar "vocal" that I don't think that any critic of "guitar albums" could rightly sit there and say that having any type of singer of his work could possibly be any more emotional. It is one of Steve's strengths as a composer to do that but this really is his masterwork.
     
  20. peymei4ever

    peymei4ever Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    Thanks Mark! I discovered Steve Vai via Skyscraper and "Hot Dog & a Shake" became the 1988 equivalent to "Eruption" for a 1978 kid I guess to me. I only became aware of P&W release when I travelled to the USA in the Summer of 1990 for the first time. I already had Flexable that I loved, owned a VHS of Crossroads (made an audio tape of the duel out of the TV speaker!) and PIL but wasn't yet aware of the FZ work prior to it. I was already all VAI and preaching his talents to the entire school on a daily basis. So imagine when P7W was released, how i felt!:)
    What made a huge difference to me at the time of purchase is that the Cd was stored in a long box in the USA so if you were careful enough, you'd basically be able to unfold the cardboard box and have a flat of the cover that you could pin to your 17year old self's bedroom wall (in between a "Justice", DLR and VH posters if I recall correctly). And NO ONE had that where I'm from, believe me!:) I remember putting the CD on my brother's boombox for the first time and feeling something I have seldom felt again since then: an overwhelming musical experience that I could tell was going to unfold only from multiple listens. I liked it instantly but it was just too much. I borderline blacked out after For the Love of God not being able to handle more of that feast as I was overwhelmed with joy, awe, tears, shock and a lot more.
    I am not a guitar player so I always get so puzzled at people who claim this is guitar wankery or what not. They must be jealous or something, not sure. I mean, the songwriting is so complex and there is so much to listen to and pick up on that has nothing to do with guitar demonstration. How can one miss out on that even if the genre of music is not their cup of tea. I often say that there are lots of albums I do not personally like but I know the problem is me and not the music. I've always loved the sound of Steve's guitar, how superbly capable he was but also how fun he was adding his Vai-isms everywhere as to make his sound so unmistakable and innovative. I am rather savvy about music and guitar techniques (as a non guitar player that is) so to me it was just as beautiful as any other piece of music that I had at that stage fully embraced and enjoyed. And even if I weren't, just like anything else, if you are moved by it, it's good stuff, period! Anyway, I had a P&W t-shirt bought from a music magazine catalogue before the end of 1990, and for my 18th birthday, my family asked me if I'd wear some meaningful piece of jewelry as a gift (I did not wear jewelry then)? I said yes but wanted a custom made piece. Went to the local jeweler and showed him the cover of the album. It ended up being a gold chain holding a custom made white gold triangle with enamel eye in the middle and 7's in each corner that I wore for the following 10 to 15 years! I just was completely fan boy at that time and championing Steve's music to every single person that had the interest listening to me. I have not listened to Passion and Warfare in a while now and my tastes in music have evolved over the years but I think this fun forum will change that and I'll crank it up again very soon, probably shedding a tear of joy in the process. Peace.......
     
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  21. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    I think Passion And Warfare is the only Vai album that comes close to Beck's instrumental albums. I love Vai's work, but I also think Joe Satriani is produced far better or at least more consistent instrumental albums over the past 30 years.
     
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  22. Trader Joe

    Trader Joe Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Hampshire
    I enjoy his guitar work on the Alcarazz album and on both DLR albums. I did not enjoy his contribution to the Whitesnake album, to the extent that he ruined the whole album.
     
  23. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    That's fair, it's all subjective. I love Beck.
    I like Satriani, and have a couple of his albums, but I find them much less engaging, and would strongly disagree that he has made anything as good as Passion and Warfare. I have seen both live and Joe was very good, but Stuart Hamm was better. Perhaps Steve's albums don't seem consistent to others, but I don't see it that way really.... but we'll get to those albums later
     
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  24. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Fair enough. I would rate Surfing With The Alien higher than Passion And Warfare. The other issue with many of Steve's subsequent albums are the pedestrian lyrics and substandard vocals. He did not produce enough strictly instrumental work, which of course was his prerogative.
     
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  25. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    That's fair, I don't mind his vocals, and find the mix to be good.
    Surfing was a great album. It was a pretty straight guitar album with some great playing and melodies. Not Of This Earth was probably as good or better. I thought Flying In a Blue Dream was good also.
    The reason they wouldn't compete with Passion and Warfare is the sheer inventiveness of the whole album, from my perspective. It has a form and presentation that guitar albums just don't generally have.
     
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