Can you actually hear noise in your music from your direct drive turntable?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by radioalien, Jul 30, 2020.

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  1. Mike from NYC

    Mike from NYC Senior Member

    Location:
    Surprise, AZ
    NO!!!!! But each TT is different and my Kenwood KD 500 and 750 are dead silent.
     
    Old Rusty likes this.
  2. Aftermath

    Aftermath Senior Member

    Technics SL1200 mk2--I've never heard any.
     
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  3. L.P.

    L.P. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austria
    Yes, I already did that! It helped a lot but the sound is still there. I doesn't bother me though. It's less that sound and more this forum that gives me the urge to upgrade sometime.
     
  4. rcsrich

    rcsrich Forum Resident

    Location:
    Virginia
    Don't recall having noise issues with my old SL-D2 when I had it...
     
  5. bluesky

    bluesky Senior Member

    Location:
    south florida, usa
    No - Zero - None.
     
  6. drobo

    drobo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    SL-1800 no noise
     
  7. radioalien

    radioalien We came in peace for all mankind Thread Starter

    Location:
    Washington
    Technics!!!!
    a beautiful thing and design
     
  8. PTgraphics

    PTgraphics Senior Member

    I have a highly modified Denon DP-75 and i don’t hear any unwanted noise.
     
  9. russk

    russk Forum Resident

    Location:
    Syracuse NY
    I was going to make a comment to this effect. It’s funny how they criticized some rather nice belt drives and lavished praise on tables that couldn’t hold the pitch of a sustained note for a damn. Eventually they succeeded to the point where people now feel the distortion added by belt drives is an integral part of the music.

    Not saying there aren’t any good belt drives. Just saying that a modest priced Technics SL1200GR or G or even the original SL1200 are comparable or better than tables costing twice as much. The area where they give it up to the more expensive tables isn’t in the drive systems. It’s the tone arms that end up getting outclassed.
     
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  10. PoeRaider

    PoeRaider Forum Resident

    Only thing I ever noticed on my old 1200 is just a really tiny bit of rumble, compared to my TD-160 which is whisper quiet.
     
  11. JackG

    JackG Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ
    Sl1200 MkII, of course not. I don't hear any pitch instability either.
     
  12. chervokas

    chervokas Senior Member

    I've never heard any turntable of any sort at any price point that doesn't produce additive mechanical noise playing back a record that can be heard. With a great turntable and arm well matched to a cartridge, the noise can be very low in level, barely audible between tracks or in run in and runout grooves, little impacting playback. But it's always there. How conscious people are of it seems to be a psychological thing. I've heard mechanical noise in record playback systems that people who are also listening to it don't seem to hear at all.
     
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  13. Raylinds

    Raylinds Resident Lake Surfer

    Another DD vs BD debate thread. How quaint.
     
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  14. chervokas

    chervokas Senior Member

    Motor cogging is not an urban myth. All permanent magnet motors cogs. 100% of them, direct drive, belt drive, doesn't matter. And that cogging in turntable motors produces motor vibration and cogging torque ripple, which, because the motor is coupled to the platter and also typically to a surface to which the tone arm is also coupled, becomes a source of noise and a challenge for speed stability in the playback system. It's the biggest design challenge in turntables really -- having a vibrating, ripple producing motor at the center of a device that's trying to isolation only the vibration produced by microscopic groove wall modulations and which is supposed to rotate at a steady speed. How the different turntable designs address these challenges -- flywheel effects of platters, servos, physical separation of the motor from the plinth, materials damping, different motor controller electronics to minimize torque ripple amplitude, etc. -- these are thing that contribute to making one turntable better, quieter, with blacker blacks, more revealing of low level detail, better tracking, with wider dynamic range at the p to ppp end of the scale, with a more neutral tonal response, than another.
     
  15. L.P.

    L.P. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Austria
    Btw. weren't there wind-up gramophones? Why did swiss watchmakers never build a high precision wind-up turntable without any motor-noise?
     
  16. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    No, mine is silent. My Technics SL-1500 adds nothing, subtracts nothing.
     
  17. Richard Austen

    Richard Austen Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hong Kong
    20 years back I purchased a belt drive Rega P2 clone (NAD 533) which was made by Rega for NAD. Anyway - I was in a clothing shop - hipster kind of place - and at the back of the store they had 3 Technics tables connected to headphones - they also sold various Trance LPs and the like - I preferred the sound of the Technics to be honest. I didn't hear any more noise from it than my NAD. I also had a DD Duel TT.

    Now I am back to belt suspended high torque. My view is just listen to the things - if we get into preconceived positions then we bias ourselves against or for something based on the technologies. Oh that speaker is ported so it must suck - or that amplifier is Class D so it must suck or that amplifier is solid state so it must be worse than a tube amp (or vice versa).

    And over many years we can certainly have "generalities" to these experiences that "in general" I will probably like design X over design Y" but Once you come across exceptions then keep the ole mind open.

    Circa year 2000 the best turntable I ever heard was the Voyd Reference - an oddball design in the grand scheme of turntables. That sound does it for me - and now it has essentially been improved and brought up to date in the TT3 - and for me it's been the single greatest update to my system. I am sure, like most things, it has any number of questionable design issues.

    Meh - if you like the DD system - and it sounds good - get it. Life's too short to sweat the small stuff.
     
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  18. displayname

    displayname Forum Resident

    Location:
    Dallas
    In highly reveling systems, noise isn't always noise you actually "hear." By that I mean you have all the information presented, but not in it's highest clarity. Removing this noise doesn't really drop an audible noise, but it will provide more detail with a wider soundstage, better imaging, and more depth to the sound.
    Granted, this will not be nearly as noticeable if you're system isn't in a position to produce those elements. It's all about synergy, both in the gear, but also in the set up, recording, and the pressing. We're basically just trying to create a perfect storm of details to get the extreme most out.

    But also remember that's the extreme most. This hobby is supposed to be fun! So if you're not bothered by your sound and you're enjoying your music, don't stress about it. Some people could invest in a nice house with the gear rabbit holes they go down chasing one thing after another. Unless that is part of the hobby for you, there is no reason stress about it.
     
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  19. RhodesSupremacy

    RhodesSupremacy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Away, India
    I can't recall who but I believe some watchmakers also made windup gramophone motors.
     
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  20. That would be Thorens to name but one. They also manufactured harmonicas, wind up music boxes and they invented the cigarette lighter!
     
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  21. allied333

    allied333 Audiophile

    Location:
    nowhere
    I have no noise using direct drive Luxman PD-272 and VM540ML.
     
    Old Rusty likes this.
  22. CDBSX780

    CDBSX780 Member

    Location:
    Northern Virginia
    I recently experienced this with the Pioneer PLX-500, which is a stablemate of the AT-120. There is a thread on Vinyl Engine about it. i will paste in what I added to that thread, as I do not know if this forum objects to links to other forums...
    ............................
    I had the same motor noise issue with its stablemate, a Pioneer PLX-500. A couple of things I did to the thing 1) based on a video on YouTube, I pulled the motor disc and added a very thin plastic "shim" to the bottom of the shaft cylinder and added a little synthetic lubricant to make sure the spindle was as quite as possible, and 2) added very small O-rings to both sides of all screws holding the motor to the plinth plate and the screws holding the plinth plate to the plinth. I recently found out that this is exactly the same treatment AT made to the AT-LP5x to "quiet it down".

    Now it is much, much quieter, and the cogging is slightly reduced. But, that sound between tracks on records is pretty much gone.

    i cannot emphasize enough how much the "o-ring treatment" has changed the PLX-500. it has gone from my least favorite turntable to being my "go-to" turntable. My other turntables are vintage Technics (SL-220 and SL-B5) and a Sony PS-T3, along with several others I do not use due to poor performance or quality.

    I can now crank my stereo waaay up and do not hear the motor in the background as before.
    This is most likely a plausible improvement procedure on any of the AT turntables that have this problem.
     
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  23. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    No noise/rumble on my Technics SL-1600MKII. Seems to get quieter the older I get. Funny how that works.
     
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  24. csgreene

    csgreene Forum Resident

    Location:
    Idaho, USA
    No, I hear no noise coming from either of my Technics tables.
     
  25. Boltman92124

    Boltman92124 Go Padres!!

    Location:
    San Diego
    You should look at the new AT LP140x. No built in pre-amp/USB and a heavier platter.
     
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