Audiophile fuses or standard Bussman fuses ?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Soundlabs, Mar 15, 2019.

  1. Ilusndweller

    Ilusndweller S.H.M.F.=>Reely kewl.

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    I could rip the nonsense written about the A.M. beeswax fuses (Synergistic Research B.S., etcetcetc) to shreds. Not about to waste my time. Suckers...
     
    Agitater likes this.
  2. Tim 2

    Tim 2 MORE MUSIC PLEASE

    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    I found a very slight improvement in sound quality but when I checked the fuses a couple years later they were very corroded. Took them out and stayed away from this tweak.
     
  3. Gibsonian

    Gibsonian Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa, USA
    I bought a high dollar fuse for my phono pre, no difference. I bought the oil, and I won't do it again. My brain said no but I went ahead anyway. Silly. Anyhow, I have first hand knowledge anyway. The expectation bias is strong in our group, I tell ya.
     
    timind and jtw like this.
  4. Swann36

    Swann36 A widower finding solace in music

    Location:
    Lincoln, UK
    This is taken from the Audiophile Man website under an article ...Russ Andrews Superfuse is it a bird ?

    Russ Andrews SuperFuse: IS IT A BIRD...? - The Audiophile Man

    this part comes in the comments where Paul Rigby is a rare reviewer in that he actually answers coments and then takes the responsibility chase up Russ Andrews to get an answer to a readers question .... for those that want to know the answer of the type of fuse that is used its Bussman ....

    'Right, I have some information and answers regarding this fuse issue. To begin and before we get to Russ Andrews itself, let me reassure those readers who are a bit bemused by all of this fuse palaver. The notion of producing a fuse specifically rated for hi-fi use is not a new one and is by no means unusual. Hi-Fi fuses have been around for a quite a while and many audiophiles feature them in their chains. There are many hi-fi manufacturers out there producing fuses for hi-fi use: the Furutech TF series is one popular type as are the Hi-Fi Tuning Gold fuse plus the AMR Gold fuses and so on. It’s not a new concept, by any means and prices per fuse can hit around £100 a pop.
    That said, I talked to Russ Andrews and voiced my concerns and asked several questions regarding the so called ‘revelation’ that it is using a Bussmann fuse as the basis for its SuperFuse.
    There seems to be a school of thought circulating around social media that, because the Bussmann fuse is the basis of the SuperFuse then, ergo, that fuse is merely a basic quality, ten-a-penny item and Russ Andrews is ripping everyone off. I think that, if Russ Andrews wanted to rip anyone off, the company wouldn’t be stupid enough to simply cover the Bussmann fuse with a bit of foil or whatever it used as a wrapper in order to ‘get away with it’. That was my first observation before I even talked to the company.
    The facts are these. Before the SuperFuse was released, when it was still at the development stage, Russ Andrews bought in around 10 or so, ready-made and ready to go, fuses from a variety of companies from all over the world (Bussmann was just one of those 10). The aim was to find the best sounding basic fuse currently for sale on the market. This group testing of components for future installation or tweaking is not unusual. Many companies do the same with capacitors, resistors, volume controls, etc.
    Bussmann – as you may know – make many fuse types and configurations. The fuse that Russ Andrews selected as the best of the tested bunch (the one that’s on sale now via RA) was a Bussmann fuse. The current variant of that has nickel-plated end caps and with a silver-plated copper wire running through it.
    To confirm then, Russ Andrews do not add these features (i.e.: the nickel end caps or the silver-plated copper wire). Bussman has already done this.
    What Russ Andrews did was to take that fuse and put it through its own proprietry Super Burn-in process. The process was primarily developed by Russ Andrews while the design and build of the machine was carried out by Ben Duncan Research. Super Burn In is a treatment process, as adding DCT-type cryogenics to cables and hi-fi components is a well known and used treatment. RA’s treatment offers some similarities but remains unique, though.
    It’s this process and this process alone that turns the Bussmann fuse into a SuperFuse. It’s this process which, says Russ Andrews, justifies the asking price. Of course you, as a potential consumer, might beg to differ. But that’s your right and choice.
    Does the processes make a difference? In my opinion, though my ears and using my reference hi-fi chain, yes. It’s not perfect and can be qualified under certain circumstances but it does work. In fact, you can read the above review to see exactly how.
    As to why the Bussmann chassis was used at all? Two reasons. Reason one? Cost. To independently produce a new fuse from the ground up and then to sell relatively few would not make economic sense. It would cost hundreds of thousands if not millions while the final saleable fuse would be extremely expensive. Bussmann has economies of scale behind it here.
    Second reason? Safety. The chassis tube has to pass British safety standards (you can see the relevant sign on any fuse you buy from a shop). The tube has to reach a certain standard in terms of materials and quality. Otherwise, it’s a tiny but effective death trap. To modify a perfectly working Bussmann was quicker and cheaper than starting from scratch but also safer.
    I think there was also a potential issue raised regarding the hand polished end caps. Russ Andrews, as a company, used to hand polish the end caps of an earlier version of the SuperFuse they produced which was silver plated (I spoke to the poor bloke who used to polish them!) The reason was that silver can oxidise and so hand polishing was done to prevent that. This current variant uses nickel end-capped fuse. It is different in that it does not require hand polishing. You can see HERE that there is no mention of hand polishing of the current SuperFuse. The addition of the DeoxIT wipe is a welcome one. DeoxIT is a contact cleaner that I would highly recommend (in fact, I recall reviewing that company’s spray in HiFi World magazine in the past). It’s great for the SuperFuse but also to clean all of your inputs and outputs. It removes contamination and the mucky build-up of grease and dirt and improves performances all on its own.
    If you like the notion of hi-fi fuses then the Russ Andrews SuperFuse is actually pretty good value for money. It’s certainly a lot cheaper than many of its contemporaries.
    During my conversation with Russ Andrews, I asked several searching questions, challenged it on a few points and placed ‘requests for information’ to it and received satisfactory answers for each. I, for one, am happy with the company’s co-operation and replies.'

    I have no connection to Paul Rigby or Russ Andrews other than reading Audiophile man and buying RAs powercables & extension sockets ....oh i do not have any Superfuses except those that came in bought powerkords ...
     
  5. Swann36

    Swann36 A widower finding solace in music

    Location:
    Lincoln, UK
    I've cleaned all my connections with a combination of 99% alchohol and deoxit especially the fuses & holders, this i feel has as much impact in improving the or maintaining the sound i'm hearing on my system as perhaps a new HIFI fuse would simply by making a clean / good contact ..
     
  6. Ilusndweller

    Ilusndweller S.H.M.F.=>Reely kewl.

    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    As someone with 2 degrees in materials science engineering, I often find myself wondering WTF the shmarketing shnonsense I read is even trying to say. I see how they write their crap to appeal to the yahoos, what BS.
     
    bresna, basie-fan, ggergm and 6 others like this.
  7. DiggyGun

    DiggyGun One Box Is The Future

    Location:
    UK
    A number of manufacturers, including Naim advise leaving on 24/7, but switching off for electrical storms and extended periods of non-use, e.g. holidays. Mine have been on for years and all the forums I’m on, never seen an issue reported by leaving on 24/7.
     
  8. DiggyGun

    DiggyGun One Box Is The Future

    Location:
    UK

    Cheapest upgrade ever. Unplugging and replugging every connection about 20 times. Also check the tightness of rack fittings and speaker bolts, feet, etc. Do mine about every six months.
     
    The FRiNgE likes this.
  9. classicrocker

    classicrocker Life is good!

    Location:
    Worcester, MA, USA
    Just because you have never seen an issue or read about one does not mean there is no risk. You may never see an issue but as a safety engineer for 34 years I have seen enough negative field issues to make me cautious about leaving a product powered 24/7. I have seen issues with products that have been in the field 10-20 years so it can happen at any time in the life of a product.

    With well-made products, the risk is very low but there is always risk. You have to decide if you are comfortable taking it. Based on my experience I will turn my electronics off. YMMV
     
    timind likes this.
  10. DiggyGun

    DiggyGun One Box Is The Future

    Location:
    UK
    Similarly, working in the electrical engineering / safety / quality world since the early 80s. I appreciate your comments. However, for sound quality, I will continue to leave on.
     
  11. classicrocker

    classicrocker Life is good!

    Location:
    Worcester, MA, USA
    I am not telling you what to do mate as I am just sharing my experience with the community here. Everyone has to decide the level of risk they are comfortable with and your YMMV.
     
    George P likes this.
  12. The FRiNgE

    The FRiNgE Forum Resident

    Yes! I watched my Yamaha CD-X2 go up in smoke right before my eyes! It had been in service for several years, and was a "pretty good" sounding player for its time. It was not on 24/7, but was just idling when it began smoking (power never went out, a fuse never opened) So, I opened it up to investigate. The plastic chassis had melted beyond repair, but most amazing of all, NO fuse.. it was designed without one. Even with a fuse, a device still could overheat and catch fire. The risk is much lower but can happen.

    Part II of my story, I was working on a job site in my younger days as an electrician's helper. We had the pool filter on a temp line, 12-2 romex on a 20 amp ground fault breaker. The finish carpenters had made a pile of saw dust just outside the garage door. The temp romex had become pinched in the door hinge adjacent to the saw dust. We can see the hazard of this, a flammable substance and a potential source of ignition? The wire caught fire, and so did the sawdust. The door had pinched the conductors, into a sharp right angle bend which lowers the ampacity of the conductor.

    The wire heated up like a resistor (such as an electric heater)
    The breaker never tripped!!!!

    I immediately stomped the sawdust fire out, but the wire flamed up again just as quickly. So quick thinking, I ran to the panel to throw the breaker, then stomped the fire out... The house could have burned down.

    Well engineered audio products have redundant fusing. Look inside a Pioneer amp or receiver from the 70's ... lots of internal fuses which protect the various stages of circuitry.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020
    johnnyelectron, timind and Swann36 like this.
  13. Andy Saunders

    Andy Saunders Always a pleasure never a chore

    Location:
    England
    l purchased a poncy Furutech internal fuse for one of my Virtue Audio Sensations and it did make a slight improvement l have to say- not that l ever put that out on a public forum.:D
     
    George P likes this.
  14. George P

    George P Notable Member

    Location:
    NYC
    Another cheap tweak: reverse the direction of your fuse. On my regenerator with a cheap ceramic fuse I get a much more open sound with more detail in one direction compared to the other.
     
  15. VinylSoul

    VinylSoul Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lake Erie
    George P. The diode fuse effect no doubt!
     
  16. Coypu

    Coypu Forum Resident

    Don't waste your hard earned cash. I personally use silver paper between the fuse holder using a blown fuse to hold the silver paper in position (i recommend silver paper from chocolate bars)...I have done this for years with no adverse effects, and the sound quality is totally mind blowing.....sorry for the pun. :cop:
     
  17. tubesandvinyl

    tubesandvinyl Forum Resident

    Synergistic Research for the win. Worth the $$$
     
  18. mcbrion

    mcbrion Forum Resident

    Location:
    Connecticut
    I've heard very noticeable differences with fuses over the years. I know, for example, not not use Furutech fuses, because frankly, Furutech's sounds is just a bit sterile (the IEC outlets turned the ASL Hurricanes into rather sterile-sounding amplifiers). I was surprised the fuses did the same thing for my CD players and integrated amps. I tried most of the Hi Fi tuning fuses, AMC, Audio Horizon, Synergistic Research fuses because I trust my ears and I know my equipment's strengths and flaws. It's relatively easy to hear the shortcomings in fuses. Why they make a difference, I have no idea. Not an engineer. But they do and it's audible to anyone who is a careful listener with very revealing equipment. I'm automatically assuming people aren't stacking power cords on interconnects so that a current is passing thru the interconnects (that'll kill your abililty to hear the differences). Poor setup (cords touching, poor grounding schemes) will lessen anyone's ability to hear any improvement, whether fuse, or amplifier or preamplifier (I remember the time i substituted Conrad Johnson's standard tube for the ET3SE preamp for one by EAT. I was always vaguely satisfied with the sound (It was very transparent, but I thought a CJ unit should have a better, more power mid bass, but thought it was me and the traumas I was going thru at the time (brother died of pancreatiac cancer, and then sister, so I just thought I was listening (or enjoying) as much as usual.

    Then one day, years later, I sold the CJ preamp and for demonstration purposes, I put back in CJ's standard tube and played the preamp for the buyer when he arrived. It took all of 10 seconds for me to realize I should not have sold the preamp: the warmth in the midbass I had mistook for part of my traumatized state of mind was SO much better with CJ's standard tube than that expensive EAT tube. So, live and learn. I won't make that mistake again!

    I can see why some people snipe at fuses and have the "how-can-they-possibly..." attitude. That was the same attitude that existed in the '70s, when Stereo Review claimed that all amplifiers sounded the same. We all know how truthful that statement was 50 years later. It's the same with those who would rather dismiss than experiment and have enough actual experience with what they dismiss out of hand, but I've observed in the Internet Age, people don't take the time to do critical experimentation (grounding setups, for example) to achieve the best sound. We're in an age of convenience and "majority votes". Einstein would never have been taken seriously in today's envrionment; he'd have been shouted down by the nay-sayers. Fortunately, he came before that time, gained a high degree of respect and reverence, and even the theories he put forth back then that scientist have spent the last twenty years saying he was wrong, , they are now finding out HE WAS RIGHT ALL ALONG!
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2021
    Elvis Pedalhead, toasty and Tajo1960 like this.
  19. jtw

    jtw Forum Resident

    What exactly is the theory that supports fuses making audible differences?
     
    Razakoz likes this.
  20. Bussman fuses
     
  21. MonkeyMan

    MonkeyMan A man who dreams he is a butterfly?

    I once asked one of the engineers at Boulder Amplifiers about audiophile fuses and he nearly choked to death on a soda he was drinking. Had a very hard time stopping laughing... Soda pop came out his nose.
     
  22. Tajo1960

    Tajo1960 Tajo = tayo (tata, dad ~ in slang)

    Location:
    EU [Croatia]
    Andy, did you perhaps change the fuses in the Vincent SV-237MK? There are a total of 5 to change. I am undecided whether to change or not ...
     
    Andy Saunders likes this.
  23. Rick58

    Rick58 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eagle, ID, USA
    I got a silver mains fuse for my McIntosh C220 and thought it made a small but discernible positive difference. I then got 3 more for the internal ones … no difference.

    If you want to experiment I’d say change the main fuse and don’t worry about the internal ones. Assuming there’s a single one on the back near the power cord receptacle.
     
    Tajo1960 likes this.
  24. Tajo1960

    Tajo1960 Tajo = tayo (tata, dad ~ in slang)

    Location:
    EU [Croatia]
    OK, thanks for the advice. Yes, that’s exactly the position schedule. 1 "main" fuse, value 6.3 A (5 * 20mm) and 4 internal ~ 10 A (6.3 * 32mm).
     
    Rick58 likes this.
  25. Rick58

    Rick58 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Eagle, ID, USA
    I just got a SilverStar fuse for my Parasound A 21 amp … haven’t installed yet, want to tweak other things first.

    Hmmmmmm … dang it now I’m curious about the fuse in my present Parasound P 7. Although it sounds detailed enough, which was what I was trying to improve in the C220.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
    Tajo1960 likes this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine