Stranger than Fiction, Larger Than Life: the Finn Brothers song-by-song discussion thread

New playlist, collating the last six weeks or so worth of discussion.

For anyone reading this thread sometime and curious about the Finn Brothers, I've made playlists of all the songs that we've covered so far that were voted 3.75 or above, i.e. the cream of the crop. Of course, there are songs I really like that are missing from this playlist; and Im sure others will feel the same way, but that's democracy! If you're lucky enough to be in a territory where you can legally stream these songs, try it out.
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Finn Brothers Playlist 1:1973-1977 ( 79 minutes)
Not everyone is a fan of the Finn-Judd songs and at times during the discussion of this era, only robcar and I were voting! Still, it made a nice playlist. I've color coded the songs: by songwriter: Purple=Judd-finn Red=Judd,(Blue=Tim Finn including co-writes)Orange=Neil Finn [incluing co-writes0 [ Green=Neil Finn/Tim Finn collaborations] Pink =Eddie Rayner Magenta =Liam Finn [including co-writes] Brown=other

1. For You: 3.78
2. MalmsBury Villa: 4.66
3. Spellbound: 4.66
4. Walking Down the Road [Mental Notes]: 4
5. Amy: 4
6. Maybe: 4
7. Late Last Night 4.5
8. Titus: 4.5[Second Thoughts]
9. Sweet Dreams: 4.75
10. Stranger Than Fiction [Second Thoughts]
11. Time for a Change [Second Thoughts]
12. Matinee Idyll 4.66
13. The Woman Who Loves You: 4
14. Bold AS BRass --3.75
15. My Mistake --4.35
16. Parrot Fashion Love: 4.25
17. Nice To Know 3.82
18. Without a Doubt 4.13

Finn Brothers Playlist 2 1977-1980(70 minutes)

1. So This Is Love 3.9
2. Semi-Detached: 4.38
3. I See Red: 4.6
4. Give It a Whirl: 4.85
5. Master Plan 3.9
6. Famous People: 3.925
7. Hermit McDermitt: 4.15
8. Stuff and Nonsense 4.333
9. Teh Roughest Toughest Game in the World: 3.9
10. Betty: 4.14
11. Mind Over Matter: 4.233
12. Things: 3.8571428
13. Shark Attack: 3.83
14. I Got You: 4.8333...
15. What's the Matter With You: 3.8428571
16. I Wouldn't Dream of It: 3.8625
17. I HOpe I Never: 3.94
18. Nobody Takes Me Seriously: 4.17
19. Missing Person: 4.41111
20. Poor Boy: 4.6090909

Finn Brothers Playlist 3 1981-1984(77 minutes)

1. Hard Act to Follow: 4.133333
2. One Step Ahead: 4.78888
3. Iris: 4.0125
4. History Never Repeats: 4.8571428
5. Ships: 4.34
6. Dirty Creature: 4.644444 (9)
7. Hello Sandy Allen 4.2428571
8. Small World: 4.36
9. Take a Walk: 4.22
10. Pioneer: 4.425
11. Six Months in a Leaky Boat: 4.75
12. Haul Away: 4.0857142
13. Next exit 3.86
14. Remember When 4.1
15. Through the Years: 3.82222
16. Message To My Girl: 4.625
17. Our Day: 4.0363636
18. The Devil You KNow: 4.4
19. Breakin' My Back 3.77
20. I Walk Away: 4.175
21. Years Go By: 4.2444444
22. Voices 3.776923

Finn Brothers Playlist 4 1985-1989 (78 minutes)

1. Recurring Dream 4.7222
2. No Thunder No Fire No Rain 3.8143
3. Hyacinth: 4.46
4. Big Canoe: 3.75
5. Mean to Me 4.3333
6. World Where You LIve 4.3273
7. Now We're Getting Somewhere 4.0818
8. Don't Dream It's Over 4.9143
9. Something So Strong 4.407
10. Hole In the River 4.4769
11. I Walk Away 3.96
12. Throw Your Arms Around Me 4.2
13. I Feel Possessed 4.38
14. Into Temptation 4.8222
15. When You Come: 4.1125
16. Never Be the Same 4.1941
17. Love This Life: 4.5143
18. In the Low Lands 3.9958
19. Better Be Home Soon 4.7535
20. She's Not There: 4.1667

Finn Brothers Playlist 5 1989-1991(67 minutes)

1. Young Mountain 4.2083
2. Not Even Close 4.3107
3. How'm I Gonna Sleep 4.033
4. Parihaka 4.0667
5. Suicide on Downing Street 3.775
6. Crescendo 4.1566
7. Been There Done That 3.9111
8. Parihaka single [version] 4.3545
9. I Love You Dawn 3.8636
10. Time Immemorial 3.9962
11. Prodigal Sun 3.75
12. Fall At Your Feet 4.9357
13. Whispers and Moans 4.751
14. As Sure AS I Am 4.05
15. Italian Plastic 3.9474
16. She Goes On 4.9063
17. Anyone Can Tell 3.9808
18. Not Made Of Stone 3.9929

Finn Brothers Playlist 6 1991-1993 (72 minutes)

1. It's Only Natural 4.8719
2. WEather With You 4.5033
3. Four Seasons in ONe Day 4.9
4. There Goes God 4.01
5. All I Ask 3.863
6. How Will You Go 4.9167
7. Throw Your Arms Around Me [Finn Brothers version] 3.78
8. In Love With It All 4.8786
9. Strangeness and Charm 4.57
10. Hit the Ground Running 4.06
11. Walk You Home 3.9556
12. Secret Heart 4.0875
13. Persuasion 4.4487
14. Many's the Time (In Dublin) 4.1875
15. Protected 4.1393
16. In Your Sway 4.3909
17. Persuasion [acoustic]
18. One Side Only [demo] 3.875
19. Stand Back --Wendy Matthews 3.8875

Finn Brothers Playlist 7 1993-1995 (80 minutes)

1. Kare Kare 4.7619
2. In My Command 4.4237
3. Nails In My Feet 4.7395
4. Black And White Boy 3.776
5. Fingers of Love 4.4396
6. Pineapple Head 4.4905
7. Locked Out 3.95
8. Private Universe 4.9452
9. Walking On the Spot 3.78
10. Distant Sun 4.6119
11. Catherine Wheels 4.6275
12. Together Alone 4.6562
13. I Am In Love 4.0357
14. Convent Girls 4.09
15. Dots on the Shell 4.0889
16. Private Universe [Acoustic/Zen Mix] 4.4538
17. The Refuge Tree 3.9714 ALT
18. What You've Done 3.8444 ALT
19. I Decided to Fly 4.3 ALT

Finn Brothers Playlist 8 1995-1996 (76 minutes)

1. Only Talking Sense 4.425
2. Eyes of the World 3.9458
3. Mood Swinging Man 3.925
4. Last Day of June 4.5367
5. Suffer Never 3.925
6. Angel's Heap 4.6906
7. Where Is My Soul 4.0533
8. Paradise (Wherever You Are) 3.8083
9. Mary of the South Seas 3.8714
10. Whole Thing 4.5 Andy White
11. Stuff and Nonsense 3.9 Enzso
12. Stranger Than Fiction/Time for a Change 4.27 Enzso
13. Be My Guest 3.8618
14. Help Is Coming 4
15. Spirit Of the Stairs [studio demo] 3.9778
16. Instinct 4.0269
17. Here Come the Gods 3.97 --Annie Crummer

Finn Brothers Playlist 9: 1998-1999 (78 minutes)

1. Drop Out 3.86
2. Rock & Roll Girl 3.75
3. Road Trip [Acoustic version] 4.0571
4. Glide 3.8571
5. Last One Standing 4.23
6. King Tide 4.7364
7. Try Whistling This 4.2588
8. She Will Have Her Way 4.6688
9. Sinner 4.0941
10. Truth 4.33
11. Astro 4.2538
12. Faster Than Light 4.8467
13. Addicted 3.94
14. Identical Twin: 4.1667
15. Spirit of the Stairs: 4.2667
16. Spill the Light 3.7875
17. I Can See Clearly Now
18. Can You Hear Us
19. Burning Water
20. Exquisite Stereo

Finn Brothers Playlist 10: 1999-2000 (78 minutes)

1. Underwater Mountain
2. Currents
3. Death of a Popular Song
4. Twinkle
5. Rest
6. The Climber
7. Driving Me Mad
8. Hole In the Ice
9. Wherever You Are
10. Last To Know
11. Turn And Run
12. Anytime
13. Into The Sunset
14. Drive Home
15. There Is a Light that Never Goes Out
16. Lullaby Requiem
17. Human Kindness
18. Ray Of Hope

Finn Brothers Playlist 11 (79 minutes) 2001-2004 (note: redone)

1. Subway Dreaming
2. What You've Done
3. Dead Man
4. Incognito In California
5. Too Many People
6. Something to Take My Mind Off of You
7. White Cloud Black Shadow [2002 version]
8. Won't Give In
9. Nothing Wrong with You
10. Anything Can Happen
11. Luckiest Man Alive
12. Homesick
13. Disembodied Voices
14. A Life Between Us
15. All God's children
16. Edible Flowers
17. Part of Me, Part of You
18. All The Colours
19. Way Back Down [Visconti version]
20. The Land Torments the Sea [Visconti Version]
21. Gentle Hum

Finn Brothers Playlist 12 (78 minutes) (2001-2006)

1. Move Over [2001 single version]
2. Rain
3. Other Way
4. My Army Of Birds and Gulls
5. Diversions
6. The Ocean Is the Cure
7. Weekend
8. The Bats of Darkwell Lane
9. Couldn't Be Done
10. Still the Song
11. Astounding Moon
12. Midnight Coma
13. Salt to the Sea
14. Horizon
15. Dead Flowers
16. Winter Light
17. Unsinkable
18. How Will You Go [BJB Sessions]
19. Not Even Close [BJB Sessions]
20. Angel's Heap [BJB Sessions]
21. Time for a Change [BJB Sessions]

Finn Brothers Playlist 13: 2007 (82 minutes)

1. Nobody Wants to
2. Don't Stop Now
3. She Called Up
4. Say That Again
5. Pour Le Monde
6. Even A Child
7. Heaven that I'm Making
8. A Sigh
9. Silent House
10. English Trees
11. Lost Island
12. Walked Her Way Down
13. People ARe Like Suns
14. Better to Be
15. Second Chance
16. Gather to the Chapel
17. Remember When
18. Come Home Sam
19. Wise Man
20. Wide Awake on the Voyage Home
21. Shadow of Your Man

Finn Brothers Playlist 14: 2008-2010 (69 minutes)

1. Straw To Gold
2. Out of this World
3. The Saw and the Tree
4. Rearview Mirror
5. Fall From Grace
6. Invisible
7. Snowbound
8. Imaginary Kingdom
9. Forever Thursday
10. More Fool Me
11. False Hope
12. Riding the Wave
13. Too Blue
14. Plane Crash
15. Long Way to Go
16. Weather With You [2009]
17. Fiery Maze
18. Mockery
19. Predicament
20. Never Know Your Luck

 

Haha, good old mustached Neil. Now extinct, I do believe (unless he's gonna go for it again someday). Anyway, this is a phenomenal opener. I was thinking the other day how it seems Crowded House has a knack for great opening tracks. The only one I don't love is "Nobody Wants To", but even that I think is still really good. So that means I have some high hopes for "Bad Times Good."

This is one of those tracks where I'll never hit “next” when it comes up. One of my absolute favorite Neil choruses, but there's no part of the song that I dislike. Great, catchy chorus with big, soaring vocals. Great middle 8 and outro. Wonderful transition from the guitar solo back into the main melody. Mark is really great on this track. The atmospheric keyboards and effects are really good as well.

Love this one a lot, but there are 2 or 3 songs that are even better than this gem coming up on the album, which as a whole I regard as better and more concise than Time on Earth. (Which in it's own right is a really good album, but it is my least favorite CH album of their studio albums, and part of the reason for that is I think there are 2-4 songs that should have been cut.)

4.6/5

 

Sounds like a song about an acid trip, or an all night party that had both nightmarish and blissful moments that culminated in a new day. A metaphor I guess for many things: here at the beginning of the album, perhaps Neil is signifying the band's rebirth.

This was a bit controversial when it came out among fans, it seems, with many seeing it as a complete departure. In retrospect...it is a bit of a departure. The overdriven bass and snare sounds like Liam's production work on Champagne In Seashells and I think that this song, more than any other song on the album, reflects a growing influence of Liam's music on Neil's work -- which probably just means he was listening to it a lot -- as you would do if your son was releasing albums.

But it doesn't really sound like Liam's work otherwise -- at its heart this is still an old fashioned Neil Finn pop/rock song, dressed up in this edgy modern rock clothing -- and I like it, though when I first heard it I thought there was something wrong, as it was so loud!
The vinyl version quietens it down a little and I prefer it overall, even if the difference in sound is not as dramatic as it was on Time On Earth.

This was a good choice to open the album -- it signifies immediately that this is not going to strike the folk-y, seventies-ish, grief-stricken tone of Time On Earth and startles the listener with it's odd sonics.

And it's a good choice for a single: I don't think it was the most commercial thing from these sessions, but close to it.

While I don't think it's quite a masterpiece I do really think it's a cool song with an awesome arrangements and a soaring chorus. Close enough.

4.5/5

 

I'll offer a contrary opinion: I was really disappointed by Saturday Sun. I'd seen the band on a couple of their pre-album live excursions (including one very memorable outdoor show just outside the village I grew up in... I called out for Helter Skelter (of all things) and they obliged!). I'd heard several of the new songs and thought there were some gems there. This, however, was a new song and, frankly, it did nothing for me. The treated vocal that opens the song is awful and the production/mix sucked whatever crumbs of enjoyment I could get right out of it. As time has passed, it has become no more than okay but it ranks as by far the worst opening track in their canon. 3/5.

And I'm pretty sure the song is about attending a local (kids?) football (soccer) match.

 

That's what I meant by "acid trip."

 

Saturday Sun - This is an okay song, but not one I find all that compelling. And like many of the songs on this album, it is buried under production choices that don’t do much for me. The arrangement is a little too busy, and I really dislike the distorted vocal effects. Saturday Sun is the first of many tracks on this album which are just bland to me. Notice I said tracks, not songs, While I don’t think Saturday Sun is one of the better songs on this album, my memory is that I thought just about every song on this album was better performed live on the post-album-release tour.

3/5

 

i want to say I tried to embed the video from Neil's site, but I couldn't figure out how to get a link and embed it.

 

Thanks.

 

Didn't like this song immediately and used to skip it because of that voice treatment. I don't understand why Neil felt like he had to distort his voice, he's got such a lovely one.
Got the negative reaction out of the way!

I no longer skip the song now because of the energy, creativity and the busiest of it. There is so much happening musically (I know what I mean)! I like the drums and that slide guitar comes out of nowhere. The guitar solo is great too.
One thing I immediately noticed is Mark doesn't seem to be sheepish like on Time on Earth and his contribution is clearly here. I've liked his backing vocals so I'm happy one can clearly him.
I'm not overly fussed with the lyrics. Usually if the lyrics are too abstract for me, I don't mind.
Because of that voice treatment, I'll give this 3.8 out of 5.

 

Saturday Sun

Lead singles often denote how well you're going to get along with an album, and Saturday Sun came across as something of a warning shot. A pleasant if rather... drivetime melody, scuppered by distorted and murkily overlayered production. Neil's oblique lyrics at their best are deeply and emotionally evocative. Here they're just vague to the point of meaningless.

On the whole, a decent and reasonably catchy song that just leaves me rather cold with its radio friendly blandness. I only heard Cars Collide recently (the song Sun evolved from), but even in its proto form that was more, well, intriguing than what it became.

3/5

 

Done.

 

I can hear the resemblance, especially in the rhythm, but it really sounds like a completely different song to me! I like "Saturday Sun" better....

 

To be honest I probably wouldn't have noticed any resemblance whatsoever if I hadn't known beforehand.

 

Saturday Sun -

Unlike Don’t Stop Now, which was a great lead single, I was miffed by this one. I’ve grown to like it quite a bit over time, but it’s not a very commercial song to my ears. Either Side Of The World or Twice If You’re Lucky would’ve been a much better 1st single. Or even better, finish The Only Way To Go Is Forward, the most catchiest song from the entire batch (which Neil admitted on the deluxe liner notes).

Anyway, Intriguer is a grower and I really like about half the album. Saturday Sun mixes a dirty bass groove with ethereal keyboard pads. Very cool. The band sounds great, the rewritten bridge (from the first version) is killer. I like the way the Nas Nas return at the very end. Lots to like, I just don’t think it did the album any favours as a single.

 

Saturday Sun

This is a song that I've grown to like more over the years. When I first heard it my reaction was that it sounded OK, but nothing wonderful. Over the years I've come to like it much more. And, I think it stands up as a CH single. It just took some getting used to.

4.2/5

Not having heard Cars Collide before, I looked it up. There isn't that much resemblance between the songs. There's a bit, but not much. I much prefer Saturday Sun.

 

This is a good way to put it, and we're on the precipice of a time when my enjoyment of Finn output drops precipitously. Maybe they're all "growers" that I haven't given enough time to, or maybe the evolution of their sound and style just hasn't suited my tastes. I've not listened to Intriguer more than probably three to five times in the ten years since it came out, and I can't remember ever listening to it all the way through and feeling like I enjoyed the experience on the whole. The hard part is that I don't want to beat up on it too much because I don't want to be down on change and evolution; there's nothing wrong with doing new things and going in different directions. Plenty of artists change up what they're doing and I like all of it, or the old stuff works for me and the newer doesn't, or the new stuff I dig and the old stuff not so much. Intriguer just didn't really work for me.

"Saturday Sun" is okay, but doesn't take me anywhere.

3.5/5

 

"Saturday Sun" is a solid opening track, quite catchy and with good energy. I remember being underwhelmed when I first heard it, thinking it sounded very manufactured to be added to radio stations' playlists. Rather bland, to my ears, this album's equivalence of "Don't Stop Now". Also, the lyrics don't move me at all. Reading them now in the booklet it just seems like a lot of phrases put together, I don't feel there's any story or any particular emotion there.
I like it a bit more now compared to my first impressions in 2010 and it's easy to hum along to. A good album opener, but not exceptional.
3/5

 

Very interesting (and a bit surprising) to see the reactions to "Saturday Sun" so far. Not only did I not hear it as a departure, but to me (aside from the crunchy production), I also heard it as a kind of return to a recognizably CH-ish sound after the major departure of Time On Earth. I guess it reminds me a little bit of "Distant Sun" (and not just because of the title), but even more hook-laden. I just love the soaring quality of the chorus, nicely prepared for by the subtle tension built up throughout the somewhat mysterious sounding verses, with the addition of the na-na-nahs at the end topping it all off quite nicely.

Obviously the crunchy production is different from previous CH, but it was already used to some extent on previous Neil solo albums, and I think it works better here than on some of those tracks (though I can see why it would turn people off--a bit like Neil's mustache, it seems like it's attempting to be polarizing). As always with anything Neil-related after Together Alone, I detest the dynamic range compression; however, by this time I knew to expect it, and I was relieved to hear some classic CH style hooks for what seemed like the first time since at least "She Will Have Her Way." All in all, about 4.8/5 for me.

 

Some months ago we were talking about a song that I was unfamiliar with, and hearing it I thought, "That sounds like the intro to Saturday Sun." I can't remember what the song was - does anyone know what I'm talking about? (It's not "Cars Collide".)

In any case, as the album opener it's a bit jarring (the voice effect doesn't help), but there's a satisfying build-up through the verse/chorus/bridge that says "Neil Finn song". It's also good to hear Mark's steel guitar again. The words make no sense, but that rarely bothers me. 3.8/5

 

The only time you've mentioned "Saturday Sun" on this thread was during "Exquisite Stereo": Stranger than Fiction, Larger Than Life: the Finn Brothers song-by-song discussion thread

 

I have mixed feelings about "Saturday Sun." On the one hand, I like its energy, its melody, and especially its chorus. On the other hand, between the distorted bass, the vocoder, other production choices, and the brickwalled mastering (the waveform is pretty ridiculous), I find it exhausting to listen to at anything above background volume.

Intriguer came out at around the time of the Lost series finale, and for some reason the lyrics to "Saturday Sun" always made me think of that final season, and one character in particular. If I'd been talented and patient enough, I would have put together a music video with footage from the show--I think it would have been pretty effective for fans of the show.

3.5/5 because of the production and mastering.

 

Saturday Sun. I've not listened to Intriguer more than a handful of times since I bought it. In fact I'd forgotten that I had it. So for all intents and purposes this week almost counts as a first time listen (currently playing in the background).

So on listening to Saturday Sun, my first thought was that it sounded like "Don't Stop Now" - I'm thinking it's the bass work that has me thinking that. In any case, to my ears it's a recognizably Crowded House song. But I would agree that it does seem to be an overall departure from the sound of the "Time on Earth" album which was fairly somber.

I think it's a perfectly good album opener - it's a bit too "produced" maybe for me. (This may well be a recurring theme). But I'm trying to put it in the context of when it was released (as opposed to now) and it probably fit in perfectly well to that soundscape.

I suspect my scores are going to be lower than normal. I just don't have the emotional connection to these songs that I had with the earlier CH work (or even TOE which I've listened to a lot more) and I think that's going to factor in.

3.5/5

 

I really like Saturday Sun, I think it was a good choice both as a single and as a lead off song for the album - which I think has one of the strongest opening few songs out of any of the 6 albums.

It also has the rare privilege of being accompanied by a video which doesn't want to make me hide behind the sofa with the sheer cringeworthiness of it all, which is a rare thing for Crowded House.

4/5

 

"Saturday Sun" is a real dichotomy for me in that there are certain aspects to it that I like a lot and feel like good old classic Crowded House, but there is also a lot in there that irritates me.

The melodies are catchy and do jump out at me, especially the verses, but the chorus is overwhelmed by the cacophony of instrumentation that almost drowns Neil's vocals out, and the bridge is so bad for this that 'shouty-Neil' has to make an appearance. And the vocoder (or whatever is responsible for the weird vocal effects) is just awful. On the plus side again, I like Mark's contributions both vocally and his guitar work.

I can see why they thought this might work as a single, to announce that Crowded House is back as an energetic pop/rock band, but it's a long way from being a classic CH song.

3/5

 

Well, this is more "screamy" Neil -- I actually think it works here!