Paul McCartney - McCartney III (Dec 18, 2020)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Jerry Horne, Jun 23, 2018.

  1. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    You mean that middle part...that Lennon admitted he was completely unable to write..this kiddo is criticizing? so Lennon had to turn to McCartney to get one of McCartney’s famous middle eight sections with variable pot smoking lyrics because Lennon himself couldn’t vary the tune in the middle or think up that part with stoner lyrics in 67 , a song now considered by many to be their best co-written song?

    How is McCartney’s middle part empty, but Lennon’s reading a newspaper and filling holes in the Albert hall ..not inane and supermarket emptiness. Kiddo was full of himself then, probably unborn or in diapers in 67. This is the genius John hack paul crap that went around for years...Had the kiddo written anything nearly as good as that McCartney middle eighth with pot stoner lyrics in a psychedelic masterpiece, I’m sure I would have noticed it then and still remember it now. The kiddo was brainwashed by a Norman book...Lol. McCartney’s middle section MADE the song ...along with McCartney’s and Martin’s crescendo orchestra ending of the song...

    This is the era past the seventies, 93, and a little later when not only did folks down solo paul every way but they DARED down his notable contributions in the Beatles songs. You will likewise find many similar folks on SHF.....just get on any later Beatles music songs/album threads...John secondarily George WUZ the beatles though most of the later Beatles huge hits were Paul’s and his ideas got the Beatles through psychedelica as trendsetters, and he thought up the direction of most of their later albums...I was complimentary, but the kidsz not fit to shine Macca’s shoes IMO...lol.

    This kind of stuff used to get me mad...and I read versions of it even all over SHF but it now makes me laugh .....it shows gross ignorance of the song and album it’s from and its extraordinary effect in the sixties...defined rock as opposed to pop, was culturally shifting, no singles from the album...though badly out in these indie days, a huge influence for several decades...Lennon was fumbling with writers block with the song and had to elicit Macca’s help to complete it as stuck on the middle eight that kiddo insulted in 93.....high point of the album and up to then high point of the Beatles...Those John fanboysz got woefully lost dismissing half the great Lennon McCartney team. Had Lennon thought he could have hacked it alone, he’d have done so and never co-written with McCartney as he almost always did except when all of them rarely wrote songs together..
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
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  2. bewareofchairs

    bewareofchairs Forum Resident

    That doesn't change my point. It doesn't matter what an artist says in the press. No one's going to scoff at praise from a Beatle.
     
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  3. DavidP

    DavidP Forum Resident

    Location:
    Edmonton, Alberta
    Honestly, who cares what Damon Albarn thinks. He’s not even on the same playing field as McCartney.
     
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  4. jesse

    jesse Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Oh, he was posing, IMO, but like Oasis, did some fine music. This is a Low is still on my playlist, it is great.
     
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  5. jesse

    jesse Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Seriously, I fail to understand your way of thinking. HE DID!!

    Anyway, I am off now.
     
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  6. bewareofchairs

    bewareofchairs Forum Resident

    No he didn't because Paul didn't even say anything.
     
  7. jesse

    jesse Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Ok, you got me there.
     
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  8. bewareofchairs

    bewareofchairs Forum Resident

    :p
     
  9. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    I’m sure he was..unfortunately like his hero did in later times...hip posturing and posing...but is showing gross ignorance here..as someone remembering pepper in 67, no one dared then dissect the album or a song from it .then ..though some several on SHF are fond of this kind of stuff...with this album or song or others....and declare it as inferior..it was the most wholistic album the Beatles ever did....

    I’m sure he has some talent and has done some good things or wouldn’t have made it...but he definitely didn’t understand pepper or that song,...Boomer saysz failed posturing...I’d come nearer liking him..but you’ve told me too much...
     
  10. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    Very, very true....dude dissed a pepper song...I’ve already said he has some talent but not fit to shine Macca’s shoes, unborn probably in 67 pepper days..has zero concept about pepper....though I’m sure he’s done some good even creative things, he’s done nothing on the same level as pepper or any song on it in its days...a truly culturally shifting album then...
     
  11. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    Now that you’ve told me...my respect for him...has considerably lessened...dude actually downed greatest song on pepper which Paul brought to fruition and completed state .....
     
  12. Brian from Canada

    Brian from Canada Forum Resident

    Location:
    Great White North
    As did I. But I remember quite vividly the savaging he was getting at the time. You were mocked if you liked Broad Street and weren't listening to Imagine.

    And he wasn't alone. Post-Live Aid, most of the older pop/rock acts from the mid-60s to mid-70s who were still getting hits earlier in the decade were starting to flail in the singles charts — Paul with Press to Play, Bowie with Tonight, Clapton with Behind The Sun, etc.
    Mix that with the desire by critics to make pop/rock relevant to social issues like Live Aid had done, rather than the disco-like frivolity that was appearing in music videos in 1984, and Lennon's social issues push him upwards over his living contemporaries.
    When Paul and his contemporaries do climb back into the public consciousness, it's as nostalgia acts, playing more classic hits than recent music in their live shows.
    Unplugged helps, as does some tragedies and gaps between releases (neither of which Paul had at the time).
    So, actually, when Anthology comes along, these older ex-Beatles have been dismissed long enough that they can be "rediscovered" by the new critics who don't care any more about social issues as much as they want non-corporate sounds.

    For the UK, it's a bit different in that there are more publications to promote the music and less power for MTV, but the Britpop wave that comes in the early 90s to North America is definitely done with corporate construction involved.
    Blur vs Oasis drives the narrative as much as the music, and the Gallaghers' behaviour is making press in the longer cycle.
    Most people I know bought Oasis albums because of their reputation and didn't know about Blur.
    And then there's S Club 7. A friend of mine got into their music via the TV show (no idea why… they got the Fromage awards regularly) but had to import recordings because they weren't in stores.

    Other acts are less well known until word of mouth comes across via Internet or corporate push.
    Take That were barely known when Robbie Williams was courting Hollywood and opening awards shows in the United States.
    (That said, some artists got helped by that corporate push, like Kylie Minogue — who's albums were not carried in the US and barely in Canada before Fever despite some strong UK singles.)

    Then came the Internet and things have improved. We're hearing more now from other countries.
    Heck, J-Pop, K-Pop and V-Pop are getting explored, which is something you'd barely hear of.
     
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  13. Chief

    Chief Over 12,000 Served

    So many “veteran” artists learned the wrong lessons from seeing Peter Gabriel, Steve Winwood, and Paul Simon have success with an “eighties” sound.

    Although, I think Paul did a decent job with his eighties album. My take is that things could have been different with Press To Play had the lead single been different and a different album cover. The album was good enough for success in the eighties. “Spies Like Us” had been a top 10 hit in the US only 9 months before. The album even got decent reviews. The marketing was a mess. McCartney would never be a contemporary artist again after the relative failure of Press To Play.
     
  14. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    I well remember those days...but realize....I’m older than you....and was by then long past any caring about mockery over liking BS , PTP..and valuing imagine, the song or album as intrinsically superior....as in the seventies I was a huge Lennon fan during time of that song/album but began to see that song as virtue signaling, before that phrase became popular, though possibly well intentioned and that album and his subsequent ones as ..very soft overall. Most folks my age had kids, bought houses, trying to get yuppie jobs in the eighties...could care less at age 25 or so about contemporary music or what of their older artists were still cool...I guess I kept my juvenile interests...albums, concerts, enjoyed MTV....

    I, as well as the popular press, realized the hypocrisy of Lennon putting how do you sleep after imagine....I know exactly where you’re coming from because I can tell you’re younger than I am. You’re correct about the general public hating that Paul era. I could care less, as has already seen one Beatle die young, wasn’t going to miss enjoying the other living ones. So much of the solo Beatle stuff and notions about them are so generationally based at different eras...so many younger than me cite the mocking they endured being a paul fan in the eighties if they dared confess it while others, still younger, say they became Paul fans in the eighties....I went through this a decade earlier with almost all rock critics mocking all Paul music throughout the seventies...and by BS and PTP, I was almost age thirty ...most my age hadn’t stuck with Paul or any of the solo Beatles throughout the long haul to even get to BS or PTP.

    I do and can understand exactly where you’re coming from because critics and some boomer fans hyped John in the seventies, but before he was killed he’d begun to be seen as a wacko with his causes, a drunk, then retreated into retirement and it took his death for his last album to reach the top, though it was climbing. After his death, he became a martyr and a saint...and again was decreed the “cool” Beatle. I’d gone through my John phase earlier and mid seventies though was greatly shocked and grieved when he died, I continued to follow the solo living Beatles as in the seventies a fan of all of them and rotated my favorite solo Beatle...

    If course most old those older sixties and seventies artists were beginning to fail in the eighties, faced artists half their age...completely different styles of music then, one hit wonders, synth, new wave, some ELECTRONICA....but I myself very much enjoyed eighties music and fashion styles..IMO the last fun decade but sadly, yours truly had to grow up in the eighties...I married, finished grad school, did several different jobs finally landed at employment place stayed at, and moved twice and bought first new car...and eventually first small house,,,
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
  15. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    You, as always are spot on...A professional photographer, can’t remember his name, hynogosis? Did V&M cover also? but an awful cover, terrible marketing...most eighties style song, pretty little head not lead off single...Am I confused with my eras here...but wasn’t hang glide done then but not on the album...may be mistaken there...I remember that critics saw the album as adventurous....but Macca old fanbase wanted a traditional style album...Your posts are always spot on...and rock.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
  16. Bruce M.

    Bruce M. Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hilo, HI, USA
    The P2P cover shot was done by George Hurrell, one of the great glamour photographers of the golden age of Hollywood, and done very much in that style. It's a perfectly fine photo but totally wrong for that album, and I remember thinking at the time that it was a really strange choice. That said, I don't think it played a huge role in the album's lack of success. It just wasn't very good. As for the choice of single, I dunno, I think "Press" is the only thing on the album that sounds even remotely like single material.
     
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  17. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    Thanks for the photographer corrections..knew someone would know. I enjoyed the album but it’s too disjointed...too many production styles. IMO the 12 inch version of pretty little head was utterly eighties sounding....Really like that song, complete with surrealist new age lyrics....though I like press song. To young folks, album cover could have discouraged them as eighties albums had bright new wave colors. Younger folks by then thought Paul too old and traditional older Paul fans thought album too eighties so it fell through the cracks...I had liked the album then.agreed with critics that is adventurous, but I got so busy hadn’t listened to it much, as packing for a move. Upon re listening to it a few years ago, I remembered how much I liked it...singles as well. Folks are very different on what like..but we both agree that ES album maximum slays...
     
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  18. Brian from Canada

    Brian from Canada Forum Resident

    Location:
    Great White North
    Peter Gabriel's So was a black and white cover.
    Sting's …Nothing Like The Sun was black and white.
    Both were successful.
    Tonight and Behind The Sun have brighter covers and were failures.

    I think Press to Play's problem is that it was overcompensating. He was trying to catch up on the eighties sound he had missed as George Martin forced him along a more traditional path up to that point, but Pet Shop Boys-style electronica and Hit Factory-style pop (the likes of which led to Kylie Minogue, Jason Donovan and Rick Astley) weren't on the album. You just never get that unbridled joy that appears on, say, "Say Say Say" or the remake of "Silly Love Songs" — it's either too arty without the full understanding or a rock song that doesn't have the energetic guitar and driving drums that others were succeeding with. The closest he gets is "Press," which is good enough to get mid-chart had it not had the baggage of being Paul's, but he didn't have a further contemporary track to follow it up with: "Pretty Little Head" sounds like nothing in the 80s – and was inspired by a cult film – while "Strangehold" is the same type of middle of the road rock that the other 70s acts were weakening with, such as Springsteen on Tunnel Of Love.

    Just look at the charts for 1985-1987 and you'll see why Press to Play is an enjoyable album to listen to, but wasn't chart material.
    Flowers in the Dirt would be stronger, but the hype system was no longer there: he did interviews that went over the same old ground but nothing to get his new music out.
    Off the Ground actually had more musical promotion in North America, but sadly that album is a tad overproduced — tweak the tracks, make a b-side swap here or there, and you'd have had a VH1 winner.
     
  19. Brian from Canada

    Brian from Canada Forum Resident

    Location:
    Great White North
    The one thing about Press to Play is that almost all the songs sound better on the singles — this is an album that would be amazing as an Archive to show off how the LP didn't give you the best versions.
    I can't wait for this one… after the last 70s albums, that is.

    Hopefully, with the documentary and the looking back into ideas (like he did with McCartney III), he's now thinking about continuing with the Archive series more into the rest of the studio albums.
    London Town, Back to the Egg, Give My Regards to Broad Street, Press to Play, Off the Ground… all have enough to warrant revisiting the project and realizing how much more is there beyond the core LPs.
     
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  20. Chief

    Chief Over 12,000 Served

    I always thought “Strangehold” should have been the single. But if not that, then nothing else really seemed like a single. They went with “Press” of course, which was merely an okay song, yet filled with the technology the album was known for. “Pretty Little Head” would have been a more adventurous sound, but only the remix seemed like a single, and even that was a stretch.

    I’m not sure what I wanted at the time. Press To Play was the third new McCartney album I bought when it came out. I thought it sounded great. I didn’t mind the drum programming. It sounded like a good album to me. Still does.

    “Hanglide” was on the 12” of “Press”.

    The photograph was professional and elegant, hardening back to a long ago era in Hollywood, and made absolutely no sense as the album cover. I wouldn’t have wanted an “eighties” style album cover though.

    I have always thought that album covers matter a lot. Maybe sometimes some stuff slips through that isn’t very good and it doesn’t matter. But Press To Play was an important album to McCartney and he knew it. Maybe it was a risk that just didn’t work. Knowing how involved Paul seems to be in every aspect of his albums, it was probably a personal choice, and who was going to suggest otherwise?

    Part of the problem with “Press” was that it was a really simple song with a lot of decoration. The song didn’t justify the production, whereas something like “Sledgehammer” worked hand in glove with the production, as did the Genesis tracks Padgham was doing concurrently with PTP. The other big eighties production songs like “Talk More Talk” and “Pretty Little Head” made more sense, but they were really right for singles.
     
  21. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    Always you write great posts and are...on if my major eighties Paul PTP era experts...you’re probably right on the single selections...I really love talk more talk...As someone who got totally lost in that Paul era, I’ve learned so much in SHF threads about those multi various Paul eighties mixes of then..l truly had no idea so many till a few comments listing them and online I found some of his...great to me as love that genre , eighties 12 inch singles or b sides songs,,,As a big fan if this era..wish I had all this oddity stuff, in all physical media form I guess...I even excused all those simple eighties songs with lots of decorations...that was the last decade I bought lots of new albums by so many artists...
     
  22. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    So true about those archives..you know I’d want LT and my favorite Macca era, egg, archives but there’s so much additional PTP era stuff as well would be a tremendous archive...And yep, boomer here enjoyed broad street, as George said..rather enjoyed it..it was cute. Maybe I’m just old...but to me pretty little head and talk more talk is utterly eighties...Very true about George Martin and the traditional path...After TOW, Martin’s time as an asset came much later with FP. I personally am a huge fan of OTG, the deluxe songs also, a great stoner chill album as was released IMO. Flowers was a traditional Paul album...I always especially loved Paul’s stoner albums and OTG is his last...preceded by LT, rrsw, WL and ram...great daze music, lol.

    His..”error “ then during PTP era was ..noticeably aging..showing gray flecks in his hair before began dyeing it and a few laugh or regular wrinkles..MTV was a completely visual medium ....And its audience and the main record then cd buying public was...was younger...only a few older artists could get through successfully and regularly like Gabriel, but they weren’t quit as old as Paul and the kids knew it...Other older artists were usually in super groups, like the stones and wilburys....Paul was completely solo...and in 86, age 44. He did a little better on VH1 with an older audience and doing unplugged but by then after flowers he was increasingly an oldies touring act though making new albums...
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021
  23. Paulwalrus

    Paulwalrus Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chile
    I gather you're saying, Albarn meant he thought George praising them was very strange, because he was known to just criticise the new acts, while it wouldn't have been much surprising had Paul praised them?
     
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  24. Chief

    Chief Over 12,000 Served

    I kept track of the Press To Play singles and 12” singles and the different mixes with the help of Beatles Monthly. Then I saved my money and did mail order from a now-closed store in Maryland called Music Machine. After collecting everything, I had filled a 90 minute tape with just Press To Play stuff. On my phone it’s just under two hours. Yikes, but I also have the “Spies Like Us” stuff in there. It was an alternately fun and frustrating era to be a fan, for me.

    Minus the spoken word stuff, I think “Talk More Talk” is really good. It was remixed for release as a single, but “Pretty Little Head” was chosen instead. It’s an interesting mix removing most of the spoken word parts, and adding a few vocals, but not as dramatic as the “Pretty Little Head” remix. It doesn’t sound like a hit, but who knows?
     
  25. joy stinson

    joy stinson Secret friend

    Location:
    Dickson. Tn
    Utterly impressed you were that current.I .had no idea about Beatles Monthly later ...as I have many original paper issues of it in from the sixties and all the reprints of it in the seventies once began reprinting the entire mag as published in the sixties...You and a few others on those Paul eighties threads have incredible Paul music collections from these eras....far beyond me then....I think it was called Beatles monthly book then....I liked the weirdness of talk more talk...spoken parts as reminded me of the spoken parts on egg.....Your later Paul musical complete collection maximum slays...I’d will you my Beatles and solo Paul collection, but you probably already have all the music but I do have a mother load of dinosaur paper stuff of all kinds and some memorabilia stuff...Yep, all the SHF folks would be..doing their cringe fests, their favorite expression , over an eighties style PTP cover....lol. You wouldn’t though cuz you are cooler ...On those eighties Paul threads several of you guys have those great oddity Paul singles,, tracks of then...I’m an odd female old collector to even be interested in this obscure stuff...
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2021

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