Jack Kirby - King Of Comics

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Purple Jim, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    I enjoyed Jack very much throughout my comic book years...
     
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  2. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    something I can say I never knew about Jack!
     
  3. freddog

    freddog Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    ...and your point is?
     
  4. Shoes1916

    Shoes1916 Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    You've lost me.
     
  5. maccafan

    maccafan Senior Member

    Absolutely love this! Sinnott is my second favorite inker on Kirby, Royer is my #1!
    Pretty good representation of Darkseid, Steppenwolf, and Desaad in Snyder's Justice League. He even threw in Granny Goodness! Now let him do a real New Gods movie!
    Also coming in May is the Kamandi animated short that will be included on the Justice Society Blu-ray!
     
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  6. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    He’s also recounted times where fights ended up with him being laid out and the guys dropped him off at his mothers doorstep unconscious. Street fighting was in the culture of his upbringing, Kirby was not out of the ordinary.
     
  7. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    For example?
     
  8. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    Sinnott and Royer are both fantastic, but if I had to pick my favourite: Sinnott would be #1, but not by a lot! He’s just got that little bit of extra flair that draws the eye.
     
  9. Shoes1916

    Shoes1916 Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    You can Google it, or check this thread - I think it was discussed here.

    Might have been Normandy/D-Day.
     
  10. Spencer R

    Spencer R Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oxford, MS
    Sinnott was Kirby’s best inker, by some distance. When Royer took over from Colletta on the Fourth World books, Kirby’s pencils were drowned in a sea of black ink overnight. In fairness, I think Kirby’s own style was getting more “free” around that time, but Royer was not a subtle inker.
     
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  11. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    Well Colletta wasn’t exactly a great measuring stick at any point. He was nitrous for just straight up erasing and simplifying stuff from the composition he didn’t want to ink.

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    Last edited: Apr 30, 2021
  12. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    There's no doubt Colletta had a terrible reputation for "simplifying" Kirby's original art, I think his run on Thor was classic! As a youngster, I remember reading the 1st FF annual, and they had Colleta ink the Thor panels; it was the 1st time I realized Kirby worked on all the different classics of era! A very looong time ago!;)
     
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  13. freddog

    freddog Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    Despite the shortcuts, I liked Vince Colletta's on Thor. When he began on Tales of Asgard his scratchy style gave an old feeling to the Norse mythology, and as he moved on to the rest of the book Lee & Kirby gradually abandoned the Don Blake character and Jane Foster soap opera. Jack Kirby's epic "cosmic" work was most evident in the Fantastic Four issues that focused on Galactus, the Silver Surfer, and the Negative Zone, but I think it actually began in Thor.

    It would have been interesting if Wally Wood had stayed at Marvel and added a Hal Foster sheen to Thor. Just before he left, he inked two covers when the book was still called Journey Into Mystery. Lee had a canny knack of finding the right talent to match the look of the book. Chic Stone was a good inker on Kirby during his run, but would have been dreadful if he had stuck around for a few years.

    Joe Sinnott's arrival was the final piece in the puzzle for Fantastic Four creative team. From his first issue (not counting FF #5) the art is beautiful, it just soars. The whole "cartoony" aspect is gone, and there's this gravity to the book. He replaced Colletta--whose style did not work at all on that title--who I think added his own gravity on Thor when he replaced Chic Stone.

    For awhile you had three different inkers for Kirby: Sinnott on FF, Colletta on Thor, and Frank Giacoia on Captain America in Tales of Suspense. Each were suited for the characters and gave Kirby's work on them a distinct look.

    Sinnott eventually replaced Giacoia on Captain America (and like his work on The Origins of The Inhumans backup that replaced Tales of Asgard in the back of Thor) the work is jaw-dropping. If you look at his work just as an artist, at that point Kirby was at his peak.

    My feeling is that Mike Royer is loved more by Kirby fans who were introduced to Jack while he was at DC. I like a lot of his work, but some things about it I don't care for, such as his clunky lettering, which made Jack's clunky prose seem even worse. I know that Roz Kirby liked Royer because his work was the closest to "Pure Kirby," in that he followed every line that Jack put in. But often all those lines have equal weight with no distinction between foreground and background creating an overall flat effect. Sinnott would take a few liberties and avoid this, making him a true embellisher who brought out the best in Jack's work.
     
  14. Because you asked for an example. Exhibit A, which you posted in reference to my dog (who was in my avatar pic but since removed due to your childish behavior):

    Also, my creme golden retriever is prettier than your creme golden retriever. Probably smarter, too, and a better dancer.

    Putting people’s pets down is a new low, even for you Dilly.
     
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  15. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    Fellas, Kirby lived through a certain time that allowed for horror, science fiction, romance, cowboys, film noir, war heroes and so much more. That he was able to transfer those experiences into a comic book is nothing short of genius! All this jibber-jabber about child abuse and what-not is nonsense.
     
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  16. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    Great thread.
    Just needs a clean up!!!
     
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  17. maccafan

    maccafan Senior Member

    For me that's Royer!
    Royer was the most faithful inker to Kirby's pencils ever! That so-called sea of black is just what Kirby's pencils needed. I remember all the praise Royer's inking got from the readers at the time. I was one of them!
    Bravo sir, Bravo!
    This thread doesn't need any cleaning up, the discussion has been great, and so has the awesome art!
     
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  18. Greg Gee

    Greg Gee "I tried to change but I changed my mind..."

    Location:
    Oklahoma
    I've always liked Bill Everett's finishes over Kirby, especially on Thor. He did a few consecutive issues with Kirby shortly before J. Buscema took over the art chores on Thor. My fave Thor cover is #171...
    Thor Vol 1 171
    Sinnott always finished Kirby very well...kind of rounded Kirby out a bit. He added a bit of realism, I think, and had a smooth, very controlled line. A true master of his profession along with Kirby.
    Chic Stone is another fave of mine finishing Kirby. Those early Cap stories they did together in Tales are gorgeous.
    Is anyone here familiar with IDW and their Artist Edition books featuring full Marvel stories in full sized scans of the original art pages? There have been many Kirby releases.
     
  19. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    One thing that always fascinated me was Kirby futurism. Their is a quote we he said he plotted his future 30 years ahead, and their is one particular single issue that sticks out to me.

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    2001: A Space Odyssey, Issue 5. And although it is set in New York 2040 it resonates strongly with some issues we wrestle with today.

    “In the year 2040 AD, comics have reached their ultimate stage. They have offered and become a life style for the descendants of the early readers, what began with magazines, fanzines and nation-wide conventions has culminated in a fantastic involvement with the personal life of the average man.” reads the caption on the splash.

    Our hero is pursed by a a grotesque alien and guards, he rushes into a room containing the “Holocaust Bomb” and destroys it. But the villain appears on the monitor threatening the Princess Adora, so our hero races to save her and defeat Death Master. As he rushes through the hall he comes face to face with the monolith His contact with it hints at something greater, what is this really about... a hidden trap door! Just dodging two missiles, he sprints toward Death Master and disintegrates him with his Ray Gloves. Victorious he rushes toward the princesses and AND!

    It’s the wrong princess!

    Furious he calls the video phone and demands the manager. The manager says the model couldn’t make it and our hero leaves in a huff with an outburst toward those waiting in the lobby.

    Heading home from comicsville, he stops by the shopping mall which stretches for miles and boards a Trans-City subway line and disappears into the smog. Now at home, a seemingly endless row of silvery apartment complex, he eats a pre packaged self heating dinner while watching a hologram box. Stopping to take a breath of imported mountain air.

    The day after he goes to the beach, seemingly unaffected. But that illusion is soon knocked down as well.

    “it’s not real! Its film and solar lamps! It’s wave machines and plastic sand! I’m a captive in a man made cage of illusions- a world wide comicsville.”

    Sitting on the beach, seeing the artificial sunlight dim: He is suddenly transported to the monolith. It’s appearance moves him and he decided he must join the space force to explore what might be the final frontier...

    I’m sure my annotations weren’t half as good as the story. But I hope this will give you a peek into this incredible story. Unfortunately due to legality of being a movie tie in, a re-printing is unlikely. But I encourage those who are interested to seek it out. It won’t disappoint!

    While some of the predictions are a little off base, or were projections from what existed at the time but have now fallen off. The echoing of modern pillars of culture like gaming, VR, role play and theme parks make the implications of this book ring much louder today than I imagine they did when this book was published.

    Oh yeah, it was published in 1976.

    Much more than meets the eye.
     
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  20. Exotiki

    Exotiki The Future Ain’t What It Use To Be

    Location:
    Canada
    Yes! A revelation to see the original art boards presented unaltered at full size and as complete story’s.

    And also in addition to the artist edition their is Pencils And Inks, where photocopies of the original pencils are compared with the final inked versions, also very instructive. One of my favourite comics channels: Cartoonist Kayfabe did a episode on them and it was fun to hear their perspectives.

     
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  21. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    maybe it’s been cleaned up since I last looked.
     
  22. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Wood was also considered as a potential inker for the Fourth World books, but they went with Colletta instead. That's really too bad.

    Sinnott also did a lot of redrawing, softening the facial features and making characters more attractive. I tend to agree he was Kirby's best inker.
     
  23. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Nah. Just as threadcrappy as ever, in places.
     
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  24. Shoes1916

    Shoes1916 Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    Colletta was a fine artist in his own right, but of a more conventional commercial nature.

    Kirby's clenched, claustrophobic and cartoony style was never a good match with finishing by Vince.

    Perhaps if Jack had worked looser - in more of a layout style - Vince could have brought more to the drawing table on pages he inked.

    While overmuch is known about Kirby and the Marvel bullpen, it would be interesting to learn if Stan or anyone else ever contemplated wooing any of the trio of brilliant inkers who worked at Harvey - long the best in the field.

    While Grace seems unlikely to have responded, Jackie or Helen would have been superb matches with Kirby's cartoony sketching.

    But I imagine we'll never know, as certain artists and companies are lauded while their equals & betters remain in the shadows.

    Pity.
     
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  25. Shoes1916

    Shoes1916 Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    Yes - Everett's dynamic & cartoony style matched well with Kirby's - those collaborations are quite brilliant.

    :love:
     
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