'Tone Poet' Jazz Reissue Series*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by cds23, Dec 23, 2018.

  1. dastinger

    dastinger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portugal
    Sorry for hijacking the thread, but in case there's someone here from Europe that falls victim of Craft's deceiving tactic: I and a few others have discovered that the copies of A Boy Named Charlie Brown being sold over on this side of the ocean are not cut by KG even though they have the hype sticker saying they are AAA by KG. Read from here on if you want to know more:

    Craft Recordings Vinyl Reissue Info and Reviews

    Now back on topic.
     
  2. Josquin des Prez

    Josquin des Prez I have spoken!

    Location:
    U.S.
    Yeah, I think that’s really pretty crappy how that went down. Craft is on notice now. I will be a lot more vigilant ordering anything from that label in the future, even as a US customer. What they did is just not OK at all.
     
  3. jwoverho

    jwoverho Licensed Drug Dealer

    Location:
    Mobile, AL USA
    I got this Japanese pressing off eBay last year:

    [​IMG]
    MINT! BILL EVANS WALTZ FOR DEBBY RIVERSIDE VIJ-113 OBI STEREO JAPAN Vinyl LP

    (184316567758)
    ITEM PRICE: US $44.00

    Here's the Discogs listing:

    [​IMG]
    Bill Evans Trio* – Waltz For Debby
    Label:
    Riverside Records – VIJ-113
    Series:
    Riverside Jazz Golden 50 – 13
    Format:
    Vinyl, LP, Album, Reissue, Stereo
    Country:
    Japan
    Released:
    1984
    Genre:
    Jazz
    Style:
    Post Bop, Modal

    Bill Evans Trio – Waltz For Debby (1984, Vinyl)
     
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  4. scotti

    scotti Forum Resident

    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    First, sorry to hear this as I have not been on the Craft thread where this was originally posted. I know many like Craft very much, but I have been always hesitant of their releases. Sure I have gotten some great sounding records from them but have also been the victim of some pretty crappy pressings (different from your situation). So the version you got is not AAA and does not not sound that good? If this was done with them fully knowing it, that is some major BS!

    Do they think folks don't examine the record itself when we first open them up and get them ready to play?
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2021
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  5. Josquin des Prez

    Josquin des Prez I have spoken!

    Location:
    U.S.
    Also surprising because the consumer protection laws are pretty strong in the EU.
     
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  6. magnet

    magnet Forum Resident

    Location:
    Athens, Greece
    @dastinger I've just canceled my order from dodax.de if the version they have is the EU one.
     
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  7. dastinger

    dastinger Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portugal
    It's not that it doesn't sound good. It does, but not as good as the KG (a user was kind enough to send me a needledrop of his KG copy). And, honestly, even it did sound just the same, it would have gone back to where it came from. It's a matter of principle and I felt cheated.

    I had this on my wantlist since forever and was really excited when @Josquin des Prez let us know that this was coming. I immediately pre-ordered it and, when I got it, as always, I checked for KG@CA on the deadwax. To my surprise it was not there and I started to realise that everyone in Europe had the same runouts as me, without KG@CA. I then contacted Kevin Gray who was kind to reply immediately saying that this wasn't the first time it happened and, even though he can't talk for Craft because he doesn't know what they do, if it was mastered by him, it'd have his initials (he gave me permission to share the e-mail). This was more than enough for me to realise that I was right on suspecting and then another user received confirmation from Craft themselves saying it was a mistake which I honestly don't believe.

    And thing is, if we didn't pressure them, I bet they would never do anything about it. I'm still not sure if they will ever do anything about it. As someone stated before, did the hype stickers flew across the ocean into a totally different pressing plant to be used on these by mistake? Really?

    As a customer, it sucks to buy a product that claims to be something it isn't and, as Josquin said, I'll become a lot more aware of what I buy from Craft from now on.
     
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  8. Swann36

    Swann36 A widower finding solace in music

    Location:
    Lincoln, UK

    Seems we did get the same email ... I'm glad you've got the Chet with good listening as you say that's the most important thing ...meanwhile i simply sit and wait the repress ..
     
  9. Marko K

    Marko K Forum Resident

    Location:
    EU, Estonia
    With the Alice Coltrane & Joe Henderson - The Elements album Craft used a very similar hype sticker on the US and EU variant but at least on the EU variant Kevin Gray name was removed since it wasnt actually cut by Kevin Gray.
     
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  10. Swann36

    Swann36 A widower finding solace in music

    Location:
    Lincoln, UK
    It is certainly making me think about how i feel about Craft ....and what i believe about their labels ..
     
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  11. Petter Premberg

    Petter Premberg Forum Resident

    Location:
    Amsterdam, NL
    Hey @dastinger , thanks so much for tracking this down, and for sharing with us!

    I got this one last week from Amazon UK, and I actually did think it sounded a bit weaker than I had expected. As you said, not terrible sound, it was all ~OK, but after reading the positive reviews on this thread, where we are used to the massive SQ of the Tone Poets and similar, I had expected more of a knockout. I thought it might be a volume thing, as it's cut a bit low too, so I was going to try cranking it a bit next time. But after reading your messages here and on the thread you linked, no high hopes on that...

    Shame, I hadn't listened to the album in full before and really liked it musically. I agree with you that it'll be difficult to score the US one; given how they messed up the hype sticker, even sellers won't know for sure which version they have.

    It really feels to me like Craft would probably do a lot better commercially if they were to acknowledge that there are other countries in the world than the US. They seem to be able to make nice products, and obviously have a hell of a catalogue to pick from, but what makes it over here seems to either be priced up a lot or, as in this case, not even the right thing.. :(
     
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  12. MisterBritt

    MisterBritt Senior Member

    Location:
    Santa Fe, NM, USA
    Preamble:

    Scene from Glengarry Glen Ross

    Blake (Alec Baldwin): "Let me have your attention for a moment. 'Cause you're talking about what ... bitchin' about some sale you shot? Some [SOB] don't want to buy land? Somebody don't want what you're selling? Some broad you're trying to ... ? So forth? Let's talk about something important. Are they all here?

    Office Manager, John Williamson (Kevin Spacey): All but one." [Ricky Roma (Al Pacino)][Note: we haven't seen @Gabe Walters for several days.]

    Blake: "Well, I'm going anyway. Let's talk about something important. (Dramatic pause as Blake stares down the aisle at Shelly Levine (Jack Lemmon)) Put that coffee down!!"

    Reply:

    Are we talking about Bill Evans vinyl? Almost? That's close enough.

    Last night I was enjoying a couple of my favorite Bill Evans Trio albums. Come morning, and @jwoverho 's Waltz for Debbie post inspired this reply. I was reminded of an awesome auction many years ago when I hit the motherlode. It's daunting to consider what I must have paid in shipping alone getting these albums over from Japan. I recall being out-bid on a couple of choice records, but I don't recall which ones. Even so, I know I was bidding in and around the $200 mark for some of these over-the-top gems. And that was seven or eight years ago! I wouldn't sell them for twice that. Better said, I simply would never sell them.

    Ernest Hemmingway, in his fine book By-Line, based largely on his experience as a journalist for the Kansas City Star newspaper, advised the incipient writer to simply begin each paragraph with the truest sentence he could muster. It has been written on this thread that due to their nature, there is no such thing as a "perfect" record. If that's true, these come as close as I've ever come across.

    These (mostly) Riverside white label promo (WLP) albums are as fine of records as I've ever encountered. I thought it might be fun to post some photos of what represents only a portion of the motherlode I secured that day. We'll start with Waltz For Debbie and fan out a bit from there, to include a shot of the hard-to-find, non-WLP How My Heart Sings. That might have been one I was outbid on. It took me years to find the non-WLP of this one in NM condition. I can remember the seller had both the WLP and non-WLP and when I pulled the trigger on Discogs, only to reply the WLP was no longer available. Maybe it's still out there in the wild somewhere.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    As I say, there are even more (beyond what's pictured) than these stellar Bill Evans specimens, including Sonny Rollins, Johnny Griffin, Bobby Timmons Trio, and some Thelonius Monk (including a couple of non-WPL) records. All are Near Mint and include original inserts and obis. There is zero ring-wear on the jackets, but a couple of the black cardboard sleeves you might be seeing some wear on the clear plastic protective sleeves. Heck, I even double-cleaned my floor (original Swiffer followed by Swiffer Sweeper Wet) before I dared to set them down for photos. I just thought this might be something fun to look at on a quiet Sunday afternoon.

    Conclusion:

    What a great label and what a great period for jazz! These are, in my opinion, and experience, as close to "perfect" records as are out there.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2021
  13. 2xUeL

    2xUeL Forum Philosopher

    Location:
    Albany, NY
    As I said earlier, I take it many of you have already realized that the official Blue Note (Universal) store should be avoided. In sum, 1. They didn't have everything in stock that I ordered (of which nothing said 'sold out'), 2. They were not proactive about letting me know, 3. I had to email them twice to finally get a human/helpful response 11 days after my order was placed.
     
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  14. bruinuclafan

    bruinuclafan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    nothing I’ve ever ordered from them has been in stock. In three attempts, I’ve had to cancel all three orders. It’s frankly bizarre.
     
  15. Hardiman

    Hardiman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hartlepool
    This is the same (other than the WLP) pressing as my Waltz for Debby, great pressing!

    Off topic, anyone know the source for the new Lilac Wine by Helen Merrill press? Not sure if this was recorded digitally in 03 or to tape, anyone know?
     
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  16. misteranderson

    misteranderson Forum Resident

    Location:
    englewood, nj
    I had problems ordering direct from Craft this year. First, they shipped three LPs in the skimpiest packaging they could, and all the covers came out slightly crushed, with seam splits. Records weren't damaged though, so they wouldn't replace. Gave me a discount, which is nice, but any brick-and-mortar record shop on Discogs would have done better.

    2nd was Bill Evans On a Friday Evening. Pre-ordered in April. They told me they couldn't deliver on the LP in June. Didn't get the rest of the order 'til this past week. Clearly, pre-ordering gets you nowhere.

    I like what Craft does, but I wouldn't trust them ordering direct.
     
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  17. Josquin des Prez

    Josquin des Prez I have spoken!

    Location:
    U.S.
    I’ve had more problems with sellers on Discogs than anywhere, even eBay. I avoid buying anything there if I can find it elsewhere.

    One Discogs seller in partticular screwed up by not reading my purchase note to make sure he had what he claimed he had. He didn’t read the note and sent me the wrong thing (basically selling a US pressing of a ECM record he claimed was the German pressing - Discogs sellers seem to have a problem with that). Then he hounded me several times when I gave him a bad review. I’ve not had worse experiences than with Discogs.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2021
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  18. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Bigdz68

    Bigdz68 Forum Resident

    Location:
    SF peninsula
    Great! I ordered 13 albums over labor day at 30% off. Now I won't be surprised if it doesn't show up. Thanks for the heads up.
     
  20. poodlebites

    poodlebites Forum Resident

    Location:
    The Netherlands
    unfortunately it is. i got it last friday and it's going back.
     
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  21. Crazysteve

    Crazysteve Gonzo Party Member

    :eek::bigeek:
     
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  22. scotti

    scotti Forum Resident

    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    Last night (being that it was Sunday) I needed to quench my thirst with some HB3. I think I remember someone upthread saying they were considering Lonnie Smith's "Live At The Club Mozambique". So I started off with some songs from the 2019 BN 80th 2 LP set. Another title that's hard to believe it was kept on the shelves for 25 years. Featuring George Benson and one tasty cover of Coltrane's "Expressions", this got me chilling big time.

    Then it was off to Jimmy Smith's "Prayer Meeting" which seemed like an appropriate choice to follow up after a hang at the "Club". Did I ever feel the awesome groove, Jimmy, Stanley, and company were bringing to the "Meeting". And after I got finished listening to side one, I heard my wife yelling from upstairs asking me what the heck was going on down there. I shouted back, honey, it's Sunday evening and I went to church. Another Tone Poet I had forgotten just how great this one sounds.
     
  23. Thom Lieb

    Thom Lieb Forum Resident

    Location:
    Baltimore, MD
  24. Josquin des Prez

    Josquin des Prez I have spoken!

    Location:
    U.S.
    I have way more Art Blakey than I need to listen to. I don't think I want to buy any more titles.
     
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  25. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

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