How to respond nicely to someone who says Pet Sounds is the most over-rated album in the world?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Brian Lux, Nov 24, 2021.

  1. JosepZ

    JosepZ Digital knight of the analog masters

    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    With that I have to agree. There are better ways to express your puzzlement.
     
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  2. skinnyev

    skinnyev Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    This isn’t an easy album to get into, Wouldn’t it be nice is probably their greatest song, but the rest of the album is a bit slow and some of the Harmonies are great, but don’t exactly have the same pop hooks that the Beach Boys were known for. It’s definitely a huge leap forward musically as a band and for Brian Wilson’s writing, but originally I thought that it was overrated as well. I’ve come to love it and will play it straight through when I do listen to it, but that was a challenge to get there for me. I listen to the Beach Boys for some fun upbeat music and Pet Sounds is a lot different than their earlier pop music.
     
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  3. ostrichfarm

    ostrichfarm Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York
    What if you think an album has been ranked highly for reasons other than its contents? What if the critics who rated an album highly acknowledge, sometimes years later, that they were motivated by something else -- fashion, politics, the desire to be part of a "big moment"? Or pressure from their editors not to alienate the companies that buy ads? Or pressure from themselves to be boosters of their friends, their local scenes, the people from whom they can reliably score drugs after the gig?

    (The question, as always, is "Overrated by whom?" Or "...by who", maybe: my grammar's rusty. Naah, it's whom.)

    Conversely, is it arrogant to say that something's "underrated"? Is it arrogant to think that people might have dismissed something out of prejudice, bigotry, insecurity, etc.?

    And really, who cares what anyone thinks about anything? Why does anyone bother telling the world what they do and don't like? What's the purpose of expressing an aesthetic opinion, ever -- other than this reason?
     
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  4. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical omnivore.

    Location:
    Victoria, Canada
    The words 'different' and 'interesting' can smooth over many troubled waters I feel.

    "I think Pet Sounds is over-rated."
    "Rap music is all the same."
    "The Beatles weren't that talented."
    The best album by Love was Reel To Real*."
    "Lou Reed was boring."
    "Jimmy Page invented everything."

    "Well, that's... different, how... interesting." :D

    * I said something daft to this effect once, although I think it was about Four Sail. And, I used to feel Pet Sounds didn't offer that much to get into, until an anniversary stereo mix!
     
  5. Vangro

    Vangro Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    It's overrated in the person who thinks it's overrated's opinion. I don't see the problem with that or why it's especially arrogant. Or should we all just accept the consensus opinion? Honestly, if someone says an album I like is overrated, my first response is not to think, "Oh, how arrogant!" Or is this is just a semantic argument about the word 'overrated'? Let's imagine a conversation:

    "What do you think of the Beach Boys' album, "Pet Sounds"?"
    "Oh it's a really good album, I like it a lot."
    "I'd say it's one their best albums."
    "Yes, possibly, depends on your particular tastes."
    "In fact, I'd go further and say it's the possibly the best album ever made."
    "Well, I wouldn't rate it that highly."

    Is that arrogant?
     
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  6. puddleduck

    puddleduck Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lake District
    Just a fun note, that while a few of you seem to think the use of the word 'over-rated' is arrogant, a google search shows 1000s of threads started here with word 'overrated' in the thread title for this very forum. So either we have a lot of arrogant posters here, or maybe it's just a shorthand that everyone knows what it means - and it stimulates discussion which is kinda the point in the place!

    For your googling pleasure:
    forums.stevehoffman.tv: overrated site:forums.stevehoffman.tv
     
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  7. KDubATX

    KDubATX A Darby Man Never Says When

    Location:
    Austin
    You bring up Sgt Peppers and kill the whole argument dead.
     
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  8. bhazen

    bhazen ANNOYING BEATLES FAN

    Location:
    Deepest suburbia
    This.

    'Overrated' implies that many others are mistaken in their appreciation ... unlike oneself, who has the correct view of the work in question.

    It's dismissive, and adds nothing to the general conversation. I try to say 'not my cup of tea' while, in this case, acknowledging that it is a landmark album (and love the singles from it).
     
  9. fretbuzzed

    fretbuzzed Forum Resident

    Location:
    M16 0RA
    I was disappointment when I first heard it in the early '80's.
    It was regularly listed as one of the Best Of Albums of all time so I had to investigate further and buy it.
    If I am totally honest seeing it ranked along side the Beatles Pepper and similar 'Big Albums' that pop up in these lists all the time, on hearing it I was underwhelmed. I Like it, for the most part but wouldn't place it in my personal top 20 Albums.
    Also worth pointing out, at the time of buying it, I didn't know anyone who had a copy that I could borrow to do some listening before buying,
    at best, a few friends had some BB Hit's albums from an earlier period in their career , to me sounded like Barbershop Rock n Roll so I never really played them more than once or twice.

    I couldn't see what all the fuss was about on hearing Pet Sounds,
    and on looking recently at the early sales figures for the album looks like the HYPE way, way, way, outweighs the Sales figures.
    The sale figures haven't improved that much since the Digital age either.

    so inconclusion, if someone said it was an over 'rated album' or even 'the most over rated', I think they have a fair case.

    Before anyone throws out their toys, it's just an opinion, my opinion,
    you can love it as much as you like, it won't have any impact on my life nor should my opinion have any on yours.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
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  10. Jack Lord

    Jack Lord Forum Resident

    Location:
    Washington, DC

    Exactly. Simply saying it does not appeal to you is more than enough.
     
  11. davenav

    davenav High Plains Grifter

    Location:
    Louisville, KY USA
    Yes.

    “Over-rated” = “I know better than all of you.”
     
  12. puddleduck

    puddleduck Forum Resident

    Location:
    Lake District
    But starting threads with 'album x is not my cup of tea' or 'album y does not appeal' is going to come off like some sort of Victorian era prissiness. And the discussions would probably evolve the same way anyway....

    I seem to be on my own on this, and I'm not out to change minds. All power to you wordsmiths :)
     
  13. Turnaround

    Turnaround Senior Member

    Location:
    -
    The OP's post is about a person who called Pet Sounds "the most over-rated album in the world (in the world!)" and declared "that Beach Boys music sounds like awful children's music". That is a bit more than a clinical use of "overrated".

    It is possible to love Pet Sounds but also consider it "overrated" in the sense of, "I don't think it should be ranked #2 on Rolling Stone Magazine's Top 500 albums of all time; it's pretty up there, but not #2 best of all time."

    But in today's "worst movie ever!" Internet culture, I think "overrated" often takes on the tone of "it sucks!!!" and has becoming more fighting words than "I think it's more four stars good, not five stars out of five".
     
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  14. davenav

    davenav High Plains Grifter

    Location:
    Louisville, KY USA
    Them’s fighting words, to me!
     
  15. Vangro

    Vangro Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    So if I don't like an album as much as you, I'm arrogant?
     
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  16. Jack Lord

    Jack Lord Forum Resident

    Location:
    Washington, DC

    Well, my answers on this thread are directed towards the OP's conversation with his friend rather than how to approach a thread in general.

    Personally, I would not start a thread that is based on what does not appeal to me.
     
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  17. Vangro

    Vangro Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Apparently that makes you arrogant.
     
  18. Brian Lux

    Brian Lux One in the Crowd Thread Starter

    Location:
    Placerville, CA
    Wow! I woke up to finding another 8 pages of response to this thread! Unexpected!
    I was just reading on another forum someone who said they don't understand the debate about who is better- the Beach Boys or the Beatles. I wasn't interested in getting into that tired old debate but I did find it rather amusing that this person said he believes the Beatles are better than the Beach boys "by like 8 trillion miles". I found that to be almost amusing. Almost.
     
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  19. Tristero

    Tristero In possession of the future tense

    Location:
    MI
    This is true for some but not for others. A lot depends on context, but the scenario that Vangro laid out didn't strike me as being arrogant at all, just a personal evaluation.
     
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  20. Wildest cat from montana

    Wildest cat from montana Humble Reader

    Location:
    ontario canada
    'Abbey Road' wears that crown.
     
  21. Brian Lux

    Brian Lux One in the Crowd Thread Starter

    Location:
    Placerville, CA
    Someone started this thread with "album x is not my cup of tea"? Huh?
     
  22. Vangro

    Vangro Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    By the same token...

    "Under-rated" = "I know better than all of you".
     
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  23. Brian Lux

    Brian Lux One in the Crowd Thread Starter

    Location:
    Placerville, CA
    I'm not here to argue. I'm here to discuss.
     
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  24. Bingo Bongo

    Bingo Bongo Music gives me Eargasms

    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    Actually this is the only Forum that I know of that considers it a classic. I never heard that before I joined.
     
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  25. Tristero

    Tristero In possession of the future tense

    Location:
    MI
    This all depends on your frame of reference. What 60s bands would you are a huge part of the zeitgeist now? I remember a time in the late 90s and 00s when the Beach Boys were one of the most influential bands for the indie rock scene, bands like Super Furry Animals, Stereolab, Flaming Lips, the Beta Band, the whole Elephant 6 collective (Apples in Stereo, Olivia Tremor Control, Of Montreal). That influence has waned somewhat since then, but the same is true for most of the old 60s bands. Nothing endures forever.
     
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