let's talk about our pressing of ALVEAR (Led Zep, AC / DC, CCR, Young ... and others ...)

I had a chance of getting a machine-stamped LZII by Hispavox. Worth getting?

 

The only stamped pressing I had in my possession had the following matrix: A5/B4. The mastering is fun because certainly the "most monophonic" version of this album. Or to be more explicit, the soundstage is very narrow but with good depth; hence this impression of listening to an almost mono version! But it is definitely a stereo version... even though Discogs listed it in mono sound!? The legendary seriousness of the contributors! (yesterday I came across a Pink Floyd DSOTM...matrix A1/B1! ).
But back to this A5/B4. It has nice bass and its listening is really cool. I would say it's in the same vein as the ALVEAR A7/B7 mastering (for the mastering movements), but cut a little less loudly. It's easy to see why the engineer at the time at Hispavox reduced the sound volume. I think the tape originally had exceptional energy potential, but maybe not every engineer had enough experience to reveal it!? Not all engineers are as bold as Robert Ludwig, George Peckham or Marta Alvear!
This explains the profusion of mediocre masterings released in the world just after the mythical RL.
For the time, the Hispavox pressing was certainly one of the best here in Europe, but the first cuts of Marta ALVEAR will gradually reveal the original power of the mix (
A6/B6, A6/P5, A7/B7) until the apotheosis of the A8/B8...raw power!!!
So here's my advice: if you're a Led Zep completist, this one is a must...and fun to listen to!
Now if you are looking for huge sensations (and not perfection like me; endless quest)...the monstrous ALVEAR A8/B8 (like the RL, a unique cut) is a must! But I fear that the latter will become more and more difficult to find!

Christophe

 

Hi Esteban,

Too bad you did not accompany your post with some photos! I was a little lost with your demonstration even if finally I managed to understand what you meant. Yes, if you consider that Marta ALVEAR joined the Hispavox team towards the end of the 60s, probably some of her work is hers. What surprises me is that some early works would be "superior or better" than later masterings!? A good example would be Led Zeppelin's album ll...matrix A5/B4 stamped! It's funny because I hadn't made the connection between this adorable LP and its very big brother: the A8/B8! Remember what I said a long time ago: "That the "best" or rather the most characteristic ALVEAR masterings looked like... huge mono!!! ;-)
So maybe finally the adorable Led Zep ll A5/B4 stamped is an ALVEAR!?

Christophe

 

"Those records are: Yes-Fragile (A3-B3), and Led Zeppelin - Houses of the Holy (A1-B1).
I bought the Yes one. Sounds fantastic."

What exact pressings do you own?

Christophe

 

Choose your side comrade!

 

Did you receive your copy?

Christophe

 

Probably 2 copies of Led Zeppelin IV (A8/B4 and A11/B10), 2 copies AC/DC (Powerage and Let there be rock), 1 copies Creedence Clearwater Revival Cosmos factory and 1 copies Led Zeppelin ll A7/B7.

All sound great and the condition is near mint.

These are from my personal collection. Faced with growing demand, it saddens me that some cannot have at least one ALVEAR pressing at home.

My decision is almost made for these.

Remains one of the jewels of my collection:
The famous Led Zeppelin ll A8/B8 [ stampers 1.2 !!! Not yet made a decision about it... extremely difficult!

Christophe

PS: ...and probably a mint copy of the fantastic Greek pressing of Rolling Stones Beggars banquet. Great ! Don't forget that this thread is also dedicated to other countries; there are plenty of hidden gems and secret alternatives to discover!

 

I would be interested in the greek pressing of Beggars Banquet!
Please keep me inform.
Thanks!

 

Yes, I know dear Christophe. My english put me in troubles when the message becomes more specific.
I’ll post some photos in a next message to try to explain my self better.

 

I decided to get a Marta High Voltage instead

 

Great ! A perfect record for a demonstration; if "It's A Long Way To The Top (If You Wanna Rock 'n' Roll)" is bleeding your ears... it's a good sign!

 

Hello everybody,
I will try to explain my last point better. This time with images.
Over the months searching Alvear copies I (and others) have found that every copy "certified" mastered by her (based on his handwritten and/or sign), was pressed in a vinyl wich these kind of labels:


Or this:


Look at the rim text. Letters are "small", and usually they are all around the label.

However, this doesn't mean that every label with this kind of letters has his handwritten or sign. There are stamped matrix in small ring texts labes.
Take a look:


But again, no matter over which music company/band Marta Alvear works, every time I have found her sign/handwritten, the labes has the small "letters"

What I never have found before was her handwriten or/and sign on pressings with this kind of ring texts:


As you can see, letters are bigger, there are more space between them, and usually the text says at 5 or 6 o'clock "Fabricado en España por Hispavox".

With all these examples repeated over the records, I began to discard from my searchings the copies that has the "big letters". Not because they sound bad, not at all! We have discussed that before many times; they sound great, and sometimes even better than the "Alvear" ones. But as my interest was focused on the Marta Alvear work and her sound, I focussed my searching on the "small letters ring texts". If I saw one of them I choose to ask to the seller if he could told me the matrix and if they were handwritten or not. If the images showed the big letters, I decided to let them go.

This until last week I found two records (now three, because a copy of Iron Butterfly's In a gadda da vida) that changed my perspective.
Look these images:


Big letters, and Marta Alvear handrwritten.
None of these records has the "wave" sign.
So I can asumme for the ring texts, and for the handwritten, that these are her earliest works. Before she started to sign her masterings. Because these labels are present in late 60s and early 70s pressings. All the "small" letters labels are later, maybe from 76' or 77' onwards.

Sorry for all this mess.
Whay I'm trying to contribute to the discussion has to do with two thigs:
- The year that Marta Alvear started mastering records in Hispavox. Now we have a more realistic evidence of the years of her first works.
- The clues that you should look for to find an Alvear copy. Now we have "certified" Alvear copies on pressings with the early labels, so we shouldn't discard those copies from our searchings.

Based on these I'm trying to find a nice copy of that Houses of the Holy, and who knows, maybe we will be able to find new Alvear copies hidden over there.

 

More examples of the small letters:



Big letters (with stamped matrix). Sorry for the bad quality photos; I taken these form internet. But look for the matrix at the bottom right corners:



And big letters with Marta Alvear handwritting:

 

Thanks Esteban (lol I typed alvear and had to delete it). I don't really understand all of it yet but will read it all again.

 

So then there is more evidence in the deadwax, but with earlier style, text, labels on the records, that her work may have begun as far back as say 1970, because they are 'older' labels?

 

To be more explicit, one of my colleagues played bagpipes. One day he brought her to work. Then he played a few meters from me. It was almost deafening! The ALVEAR mastering reproduces this instrument with great realism. I heard other masterings from this album and it was a little less convincing! The AC/DC ALVEAR/Hispavox series sound great! I haven't had the opportunity to hear an Australian LP (too expensive) but I think that the ALVEAR LP's should not be out of place!

 

This should not be an excuse to dodge the fantastic reissue of Tattoo you series 10C[...]!

 

Ha! Very true. It's still on my list

 

Thanks. Am understanding it better now. I will check the labels on all the ~~ and ALVEAR name, with label text size etc. that I have and report back.

 

Some of the first Led Zeppelin released on the Hispavox label are often exceptional, I have already spoken about it.

Led Zeppelin l ( A2/B2 stamped)
Led Zeppelin lll (A5/B3 stamped) and Led Zeppelin lV (A5/B3 stamped...Hot mastering !) particularly.

 

Sounds exceptional! Like most of this series (Sticky fingers, Exile, Goat's head soup...)

 

I was a little teasing with this post.

Regarding your RL/PF pressing, how does the B side behave in relation to the RL side? I heard two masterings cut by Günter Pfanz. One was overkill in a bad way. Monstrous bass but no musicality. More is not always better! The other was clearly superior in terms of musicality; dynamics respected, well balanced. But not as rich and heavy as its Spanish (and English I imagine?) counterparts; hence a little feeling of metallic texture. But nevertheless not prohibitive! A good pressing to start.

PS: for information, I answered this comment on Discogs. The author lacks a bit of discernment because the A7/B7 and A8/B8 masterings are slightly different. The A7/B7 mastering is already superb, but the A8/B8 is THE masterpiece of Marta! As spectacular as the mythical RL but completely different. While the RL offers a racy reading, the ALVEAR shines with its primitive beauty.

 

It appears the printing co. that Hispavox or Hispavox S.A. used was the same, and connected to the Hispavox record label, and the Hispavox S.A. manufacturing of records from many different international labels, until 1980.

Then the printing co. changed apparently. According to discogs. Or did their address only change. Have to read some more. So, it might be interesting to see what label text changes took place before and then after vinyl releases from around 1980 and afterwards, until 1983 or so?

Until 1980 apparently all vinyl labels for Hispavox and Hispavox S.A. record manufacturing releases (plus their album sleeves, inners?) should have come from the same Hispavox and Hispavox S.A. printing company that they used through the 1970s, and 1960's, I presume.

Does the above make sense?

 

Do the stamped variants have the wave (Alvear) symbol?

 

No.
The “certified” Alvear masterings by her sign (wave, alvear, m.a.) are only on the handwritten matrix.
Sometimes you can find a handwritten matrix without her sign. We are sure that are her masterings too.