technically speaking, what is 'fake' stereo? (Duophonic, Electronically Re-processed, etc.)*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by daveman, Dec 21, 2003.

  1. IHeartThe80s

    IHeartThe80s Forum Resident

    We all know Capitol's Duophonic process ruined a lot of innocent mono records by the Beach Boys and others. But what exactly did the process consist of; how was it achieved? It always sounded to me like the mono signal was filtered and split to either stereo channel, with low and high end on one side and midrange on the other. And then there was some sort of reverb added in the middle.

    In other cases I've heard fake stereo that sounds like it was created acoustically, via a monitor and stereo mics in an echo chamber. Was this ever actually done? (Do I remember some story of an engineer attempting the same effect using a concrete stairwell as a chamber?)

    I have a More Chuck Berry Chess reissue (70s) that has some of the most shrill and unlistenable fake stereo ever (think White Light/White Heat).

    And then there was our recent discussion here of the flanged fake stereo Psychotic Reaction by Count Five, achieved by playing two mono copies in either channel, slightly out of sync. And then there are the risible attempts to create stereo by turning the pan pot left and right, moving the mono signal briefly into either channel. (This is actually done on the UA Hard Day's Night LP, I think on I Should Have Known Better: lead vocal in one channel, answering vocals in the other.)

    Anyone know how these awful effects were achieved?
     
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  2. empirelvr

    empirelvr "That's *just* the way it IS!" - Paul Anka

    Location:
    Virginia, USA
    This is supposedly the basic Duophonic process as I read in an old magazine. It was a three step process, if the article was accurate.

    1. Play mono tape, and split the output to two channels. Time delay one channel slightly.
    2. Run each channel thru a comb filter, one that emphasizes even harmonics for one channel, the other channel through one that emphasizes odd harmonics. This is the part that confuses the ear, as it sounds like a bass/treble cut/boost. It's also why, time delay issues aside, you can't sum a Duophonic track to mono and get a reasonable tonal balance. It's been too royally screwed up by the comb filtering.
    3. Add a dollop (or a ton) of stereo reverb to the mix and print to tape, creating your new "Duophonic master."

    I discussed this on one other forum once and a respondent claimed you couldn't use comb filters "like that." Maybe they were right, I don't know. I'm just reporting what the article stated. (I wish I could find that article again...dang it!)
     
  3. getitgoin

    getitgoin Forum Resident

    Location:
    LA, CA, US
    I am interested in knowing this as well. I thought it was simply a matter of turning up the bass on one side and the treble on the other, but the processes described above sound much more maniacal.
     
  4. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    There were all different types of ways of doing it. All bad. Why waste a minute on it?
     
  5. JP Christian

    JP Christian Forum Resident

    I have some German 70s re-issues of early Elvis LPs - it's beyond unlistenable

    As a young teenager I created my own 'fake stereo' using a stereo 16 band graphic - just for fun but made a damn sight better job of it than most of the released stuff...
     
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  6. MasterGlove

    MasterGlove Active Member

    Location:
    Argentina
    I sort of came up with one while fooling around with audio editors. My goal was to achieve a similar effect to the one Black Sabbath used on Ozzy's vocals on "Behind the Wall of Sleep" (from their selftitled debut album).
    I took a guitar track, vocal track or whatever and brickwall it by applying hard limiting. Then filter out the signals that exceeded 0 dB.
    Then, place the compressed audio in one channel and in the signals that were cut off on the other channel.

    It sounds funny.
     
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  7. JP Christian

    JP Christian Forum Resident

    I've got a Shangri-Las compilation that does the same thing - it's actually not a bad pressing but would have sounded much better in Mono - here in the UK there was this obsession to make everything stereo from the late 60s through to the late 70s - with some shocking results!
     
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  8. JP Christian

    JP Christian Forum Resident

    that should read 'make every mono recording stereo'
     
  9. crispi

    crispi Vinyl Archaeologist

    Location:
    Berlin
    I'm interested in how Columbia/Epic did it. I recently heard a Sly & The Family Stone original "Greatest Hits" on Epic. It has some fake-stereo songs on it, which were originally mono singles. What is interesting, though: they fold down perfectly to mono – no artifacts, no delay, no cancelling, the frequency spectrum is all there and it sounds great & full-bodied, actually. Now, I guess this was on purpose, right? Also, can this be said about all "Electronically Re-Channeled" records on Columbia?
     
  10. ElwoodPDowd

    ElwoodPDowd Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Middle England
    When Not Now released The Beach Boys first LP because it had slipped into public domain, they released it in a "deluxe" Mono/Stereo double LP. I wonder if they did their own duophonic for it? I don't know why i want to know...

    Serge Gainsbourg's Initials BB (red label canada) is fake stereo. I learned the hard way. It had a horrid reverb in one of it's channels. I found however if I put the other channel through both speakers it became listenable mono.
     
  11. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    It can not. All different, all dreadful.
     
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  12. rpd

    rpd Senior Member

    Location:
    Nashville
    All rechanneled records should be immediately removed from any reasonable record collection...
     
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  13. Wally Swift

    Wally Swift Yo-Yoing where I will...

    Location:
    Brooklyn New York
    Really, they should all be destroyed.
     
  14. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Do you guys know that STILL, all these years later, fake stereo versions of mono albums are still being pulled by record companies for licensing? The magic word "STEREO".
     
  15. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    I'm aware of this and this is awful. The record companies still put out fake stereo on CD as well due to the tape box labeling.
     
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  16. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Some companies (and movie productions) REQUEST fake stereo when possible. God knows why and he ain't telling.
     
  17. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    In fact, most people don't really care if something is true stereo, fake stereo or mono as long as they have a copy of the music, movie or whatsoever.
     
  18. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Fake stereo is actually how I got into mastering. I was working on catalog compilations (on paper) and the stuff would be released, I'd hear it for the first time when shipped. I did this one BING CROSBY compilation and it had two songs on it from 1937, both recorded on the same day, same studio. When I heard the album I'd compiled for the first time, the first song sounded OK, a nice, dry transfer of the metal part. The second song, same session was drenched in fake reverb and was in rechanneled stereo.

    That was the straw that broke my back, I marched over there and told them (making many enemies along the way) that it was impossible, same day, one with echo, one, no echo, blah, blah. The guy in charge told me, "Buddy, we just use what they give us to use".

    I paid more attention after that to sources. Makes a big difference.
     
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  19. BradOlson

    BradOlson Country/Christian Music Maven

    I know.
     
  20. auburn278

    auburn278 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Baltimore, MD, USA
    Fake Stereo = :(
     
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  21. JamieC

    JamieC Senior Member

    Location:
    Detroit Mi USA
    The Shizziling drits were the cheapo labels(Coronet, Crown etc), but they were not alone, When I finally replaced my copy of the Coasters(Atco 33-101) dear Lord I could only listen to one channel. Both at once made me ill.
     
  22. action pact

    action pact Music Omnivore

    Those MCA Jazz Heritage Series albums from around 1980 could have been amazing if they had taken some care with the source material. Some of them sound half-decent (I know that you did a few of them, Steve) but lots of them were cut from 1960s fake stereo tapes, most of which are drenched in reverb. Unlistenable!
     
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  23. getitgoin

    getitgoin Forum Resident

    Location:
    LA, CA, US
    I like that story.
    Did you like Bing back then? How old were you?
     
  24. LEONPROFF

    LEONPROFF Forum Resident

    Isn't that a song by Olivia Newton John:shh:
     
  25. zebop

    zebop Well Known Stranger

    Nope. I think Dave Clark Five Greatest Hits was "Electronically Re-Channeled" and it's one of the worst things I've ever heard.
     
    quadjoe likes this.

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