Genesis: "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway" first UK pressing

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by M_K, Sep 15, 2020.

  1. M_K

    M_K Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Finland
    I would be interested to know are these both UK first pressings that I have listed below? In Discogs both pressings are listed to be the first pressing, but I think t. But they have differences.

    Logically I would say that number one below is the first pressing because all matrix in four sides has -2U text. But Foxtrot and SEBTP first pressings have following text in the label "Manufactured and distributed by B&C Records Ltd." Same that number two has below. Confusing...

    There are several PORKY cuts in the UK and also in the US. The first UK pressings have famous hum or buzz. Later UK Phonogram (not B&C Records) Charisma Porky cuts don't have hum. According Discogs these two below pressings are the only ones where is written 2U in the matrix. Other and later UK Porky pressings has text A//4, B//2 ...

    1:
    Genesis - The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway

    "Marketed by B and C Records"

    Matrix / Runout (Runoff A): CG 1 A -2U Porky + Johnnie
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff B): CG 1 B -2U Pecko
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff C): CG 2 A -2U Pecko
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff D): CG 2 B -2U Porky

    2:
    Genesis - The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway

    "Manufactured and distributed by B&C Records Ltd."

    Matrix / Runout (Runoff A): CG 1 A-2U Porky + Johnnie
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff B): CG 1 B-3U Pecko (see B-3U here, not B-2U?)
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff C): CG 2 A-2U Pecko
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff D): CG 2 B-2U Porky
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  2. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    Matrix numbers are on the vinyl itself.
    The text you're quoting is on the label.
    That's two different things.

    Number Two could very well be a later pressing thant Number One, but with a label that came from an unused stock of "Ltd" labels they had left.
     
  3. M_K

    M_K Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Finland
    I found that there has been also faulty A-1U matrix. There is no mention about it on the Discogs or elsewhere....

    Notably when the LP was originally released in November 1974 with the 1st run A-1U matrix it was found to have a pressing fault resulting in skipping at the beginning and was subsequently quickly recalled and redistributed with the fault-free A-2U matrix issue
    Genesis The Lamb - 1st - B & C + Insert - EX UK 2-LP vinyl record set (Double Album) (644439)

     
  4. M_K

    M_K Active Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Finland
    Yes I know that.
     
  5. progmog

    progmog Senior Member

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Although the rule of thumb is that the lower the matrix number, the earlier the pressing, this is not true in all cases. Re-cuts can be made for various reasons; for example, because the the original stamper is worn, or even if there is a new cutting entirely. A typical example is 'Houses of the Holy' by Led Zeppelin. The first UK pressing of 'Houses...' was cut by Robert Ludwig and has A2/B2 matrix numbers. However, a later cut by George Peckham has A1/B1 matrix numbers.

    The first pressing of 'The Lamb...' is the one with "Manufactured and distributed by B&C Records Limited". I'm at work at the moment and can't recall what the matrix numbers are on my copy, but I will check tonight and confirm.
     
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  6. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    Then what are you confused about ?

     
  7. Keitheva

    Keitheva Well-Known Member

    Location:
    California
    I have the original UK pressing (with the hum):

    Record One
    Side One
    "Marketed by B & C Records"
    Label / Matrix / Runout: CG 1A -2U Porky + Johnnie
    Side Two
    Label / Matrix / Runout: CG 1B AND CG 2B -2U Pecko

    Record Two
    Side Three
    "Marketed by B & C Records"
    Label / Matrix / Runout: CG 2A -2U Pecko
    Side Four
    Label / Matrix / Runout: CG 1B AND CG 2B -2U Porky
     
    NunoBento likes this.
  8. Mikewest

    Mikewest Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Ive just acquired a nice Lamb B& C labels 1st , cleaned twice now but still sounds very click and the vinyls look perfect , my old Phonograph label sounds perfect , weird !
     
  9. From my limited experience UK Charisma is a hit-or-miss label re. quality of pressings (vinyl compound from those years?). And I do recall that my original UK copy (which included the Charisma ad paper or cardboard insert) had some problems in the quiet tracks.

    In Italy, original Charisma / Philips pressings seem much better. My "Nursery Crymes" slays!

    Yet I'm a little obsessed with re-acquiring that long-lost original "The Lamb", warts, hum and all... In fact, I was dead certain in 1974, and remained so for decades, that that hum was part of the sonic concept of the album, sort of like the Sgt. Pepper runout groove... or a musique concrète leitmotiv seguing side after side... So in a way, it's still for me the right way of listening to it! o_O
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2022
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  10. Mikewest

    Mikewest Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    Thats true the hum, isnt Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats ?
    Yes I bought a job lot of Genesis records , Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot, Selling England, The Lamb all B& C labels and one Pink Scroll Trespass all bought for £60 inc postage, not bad at all. Trespass and a few clicks although not too bad , Foxtrot has a scratch that last 2 mins but has the red flyer that you mentioned that wasn’t even advertised in the auction,but i realised I already have a B&C label with textured sleeve for Foxtrot , so I will sell that .The Lamb as I said looked perfect but cover torn at top where the records have torn it, Selling England a scratch which sounds through , I will sell that too ,now playing Nursery Cryme and that sounds excellent, this is on the Quartet label? But still B& C I believe, I will replace my old one with this !
     
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  11. NunoBento

    NunoBento Rock 'n' Roll Star

    Location:
    London
    The matrix numbers on 1st UK "hummy" press read as follows:
    A-2U PORKY + JOHNNIE / B-2U PECKO / A-2U PORKY / B-2U PECKO
     
    ParloFax likes this.
  12. Lightform

    Lightform Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I'm more than a little confused - I have option 1 as per the original poster of this thread:

    1:
    Genesis - The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway

    "Marketed by B and C Records"

    Matrix / Runout (Runoff A): CG 1 A -2U Porky + Johnnie
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff B): CG 1 B -2U Pecko
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff C): CG 2 A -2U Pecko
    Matrix / Runout (Runoff D): CG 2 B -2U Porky

    BUT - According to the 'Record Collector presents Genesis' magazine special from last year, the first pressing has 'Printed and made by Bruin BV Zaandam Holland' printed on the inner gatefold.
    My copy has 'Printed in England by Robor Limited' (also includes the 'Inside Story/Gold Chase' red insert).
    Can anyone shed any light on this? Some printed in UK, some in the Netherlands maybe from the first run?
     

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