The real end to Genesis was likely the BBC tapes they got near 2007 and resurfaced unheard Gabriel stuff that was missing by that point about 38 years Now, if only their is a copy of Wooden Mask in existence.
Yuk, this is awful. Genesis don't benefit from being 'produced' as evidenced here. There are outside players contributing - sorry Trevor Horn, Tony Banks is the keyboard player, and doesn't need his parts overdubbed by someone else, and if Phil Collins is involved he certainly needs no help with drums!! This is ridiculous, Steve Hackett mentioned that after hearing the final mix, he wondered why he bothered...some great and historic performances are here in this messy soup - I wonder if Nick Davis can do a more stripped down, 'authentic' mix of this someday.
TBH, as I mentioned above, this is a very cold-heated, commercial and "business" endeavor that is basically in the hands of a producer. It's closer to a remix than it is to a genuine studio creation (or even a re-recording with the proper band), as far as the process goes. They were not "produced" here, the relationship with the producer is more similar to the one session-men have with the recording engineer (or the producer itself). I don't know how many members were actually present during the mixing stage. If not Tony, hardly anyone else. It's quite different from the kind of organic relationship they had with Padgham, that shaped their sound to a form they would have not achieved by themselves (whether one likes it or not doesn't matter). They were all in the same room, they bounced ideas and grew things organically. It's a complete different process and taking this track as an example is pretty misleading. Even Mike recognized the lack of a real production behind CAS. EDIT. About Steve's complaint. Same old song, he put ideas in, they were discarded. BUT, it's in the nature of this kind of process. When you don't have a written arrangement and call musicians in, basically saying "do what you like, we'll sort it out later", it's obvious many things would be left behind and the final balance would be a compromise. It seems that he's still expecting 1/5 of the song being his parts, like in the old W&W times. But when you're called in as sessionman, you have to expect this. One might question if this was the right or better way to proceed, artistically. But considering the ultra busy schedules of some of them (hi Pete) and the quite likely lack of deep commitment from everyone else, it was probably the only way to get it done.
I know I heard some story from maybe Mike about the making of the track and some of them were together during the recording of the track. Maybe not all 5 at once though.
I would guess, if that happened, it was Mike and Tony. Pete and Steve did solo sessions, IIRC. And Phil's work seems to be pretty independent from the rest, somehing that can be done in a one man session. Maybe some ultra-archivist thread member will uncover some enlightening article/video later on.
Yeah, I wish I could remember the source of the interview where I heard this story. Or remember more specifics about it. It may have been more than just Mike and Tony as I remember being a little surprised by it.
The Carpet Crawlers Here's a news piece from Rolling Stone in 1999 saying it was "recorded piece by piece by the individual members at their own studios." Which is probably true, but as I mentioned, there was at least some working together. I'm trying to see if I can find anything about that.
Carpet Crawlers 99 - interesting, nice that they did it, haven't listened to it in a very long time and doubt I will. This wasn't ever one of my favorite tracks to begin with
Taken from: Tony Banks Says Genesis Are Probably Done for Good There's not much information out there about the sessions for "The Carpet Crawlers 1999," even though it has such significance in the history of Genesis. Peter's idea was to use [producer] Trevor Horn since he was neutral territory: None of us had ever worked with him. The vocal, the way it switches between Peter's voice to Phil's voice, is really strong on that. The arrangement I'm not 100 percent crazy about – the little, skippy drums all the way through it – and the chords are a bit unsubtle, but it wasn't bad at all. I haven't even listened to it since he we did it, actually. It was nice working with Trevor; I'm an admirer of his. He's a talented chap, so it was fun to have done that. We had a good time just getting together at Peter's studio at Real World. Good food. We ate a lot, as I remember – and played a lot of tennis. [We did] about an hour in the studio a day, which is the way Pete tends to work usually, which is the trouble. So, we moved into Peter's place, which was quite interesting. I don't know, though. It won't happen again
Yeah, that was probably what I was remembering. He only mentions Peter but says "we" which I assume is more than him and Peter.
Carpet Crawlers 1999 - I haven't listened to this track in long long while. This song has special meaning to me, more on that in a bit. The song is OK for what it is and a bit of a disappointment when you find out how it was put together. I seem to recall that they considered Ray to sing the third verse, thus linking the eras together. If that came to fruition, the song would of been epic. For what it is, it's a decent send off for the band. As for the special meaning; On December 17, 1999, it was the last song I played on my final shift at the college radio station. A good send off for me as I would graduate and head off into the real world.
I agree with Tony -- both that the arrangement is not amazing (I find it rather diffuse and unfocused), and that even though it's cool hearing Peter singing Genesis again, surprisingly the moment where Phil unexpectedly takes over the vocal is the peak of the song. It feels right for them to share the vocals -- after all, Phil must have sung it more than Peter did over the years. It's kind of a strange pick for a remake, though, given the weird Lamb lyrics that don't make any sense on their own (or, at all).
Latest Interview from Mike: Mike Rutherford on Reviving The Mechanics and the Future of Genesis – Rolling Stone
I read it earlier. Always the gentleman answering that tedious reunion question . Funny how he seems to be a little embarrassed about Over My Shoulder's reception.
Excerpts for those who want to skip to the Genesis Q's: I spoke to him a few years ago and he said he’d love to play in Genesis. Do you think that’s possible? I always say, “Never say never.” Look, if you asked me two or three years ago when Phil was retired, I would have said, “No.” But there’s no plans. Let’s establish that. I’m going to go on tour with Phil for six shows in June. That’s with the Mechanics. It’ll be quite fun for us. But never say never. The fact that he’s back on the road is quite interesting. Do you miss playing the songs? There are things like “Watcher of the Skies” and “The Musical Box” that you haven’t played in almost 40 years. Yeah. What’s interesting is that I used to do Genesis and the Mechanics alternating. I’ve just done Mechanics now for the last eight years. I rather miss the alternating part, the Genesis songs. How do you feel about Steve Hackett’s show where he goes out and does Genesis songs? It’s what he chooses to do, really. It wouldn’t work for me, if you know what I mean. He was in Genesis. He wanted a solo career. And now he’s playing Genesis. It’s his choice. I’m sure it’s good. But for me, I wouldn’t … I do three Genesis songs in a two-hour set. That’s enough for me, I think. That feels fine. I think of a band like Yes right now that’s just Steve Howe and other people, but they attract big crowds and they keep the music alive. There’s never been any thought about you and Tony and maybe other people doing shows, maybe not even calling it Genesis? That wouldn’t get me going, really. Why? I wouldn’t want to do it. Having done it with Phil, Peter and Tony, I wouldn’t want to do it with other people. Do you think the hardcore fans should let go of the dream of a reunion with Peter Gabriel? That’s a problem. They always talk about it, but I don’t know what we’d do, if you know what I mean. If Phil was drumming it might be a different story, but he’s not drumming. People love the idea, but they haven’t thought it out as to what we’d do. You never know, but that’s a harder one, I think.
Listening to that song again today, it definitely has that Trevor Horn production all over it. Seems out of place for Genesis.
I've always considered "Carpet Crawlers" to be an odd song for them to include in their live set for so long. It's pretty and has a nice dynamic, but the lyrics are another of Peter's dream stories that only works for me when he sings them, and really, only in the context of The Lamb. But what do I know? - seemed to always get good audience reception. I'm not very fond of CC1999. The rhythm track seems unnecessary and distracting. I do like the vocals, but I really miss the final verse.
I know I've read in one of the books that Tony and Peter used to play a lot of tennis in the younger days, and that they were pretty competitive with each other about it
