180 gram vinyl vs. original LPs

Repost. I deleted a word by mistake.

It is still very unusual that a 180g reissue surpasses the original (and best sounding) vinyl in most, if not all, aspects.
Out host's Everest reissues are the ones. (though you have to remember that Everest vinyl had poor quality even for the peroiod.)

 

I now have the two RCA albums by the Everly Brothers on Dynaflex. The Stories We Could Tell (bought years ago as a cutout) and Pass The Chicken And Listen (both yesterday as a cutout). Both are great pressings and wonderful albums!

 

For a variety of reasons I pretty much stopped buying 180 gram reissues years ago. But in the 1990s and first half of the 2000s, I bought quite a few warped 180 gram records. It is in fact harder to manufacture them flat because the cooling cycle is longer than for lower weights (basic physics). If the pressing plant skimps on cooling time, the record warps. There may have been a learning curve so maybe things have improved. I also encounter non fill issues way more frequently on modern pressings.

 

Not bothered by the weight! Some of my favourite LP's pressed in the 70's & 80's are on extremely thin vinyl and sound wonderful!

 

Unless you adjust the VTA to play 180gm records, the tonal balance will be affected to deemphasize the highs and accentuate the bass. Are you changing VTA for each record (few of us are)? Otherwise the comparison is useless. Set up your VTA for 120 and 180 sounds dull. Set up for 180 and 120 sounds lightweight.

 

I think a bigger myth being perpetuated is that the reason records are being sold for $24 and more is because they're being pressed on 180 grams. Wouldn't the cost be completely irrelevant to the weight of the vinyl and be more along the lines of what the record companies and record stores are just charging?

 

How do you figure that? It it weighs more it will cost more per unit. And what cost do you expect a new LP to be? $24 isnt bad - compared to the rest of the world, US prices are very cheap.

 

My understanding is that making 180g records is actually more difficult to do correctly. They must be pressed longer and cool longer. I think that's why they cost more, not merely the extra vinyl. I'm fine with boutique labels and high end plants doing well done 180g LP's. I just wish that your typical new album or reissue was done on thinner vinyl with the associated drop in price. I'd buy more vinyl. I promise. Instead, any new re-issue or album of new music cut by an unknown engineer from a questionable source costs just as much as a new MOFI record. Hello $10 compact disc.

 

Exactly. Pressing records is compression moulding (molding to you folk in the US) and depends on the flash extrusion to expel all the air from the groove structure. Now to do this in an ideal fashion; the final squeeze of the press needs to be s-l-o-w, the puck/biscuit of vinyl needs to be large enough to ensure the air is purged from the moulding. Finally a hard vinyl compound moulded slowly is better than all this nonsense about virgin vinyl!! BTW a heavier disc generates more flash. Should this be reground and reused or just discarded??

 

Several of my 180grs. were warped upon unsealing them. Can't point any fingers but judging from my wax alone I'd have to say they are more prone to warping than their lighter counterparts. OK, matter of fact I don't think so but don't see it helping either.

Moreover, all of my oil-crisis wafer-thin lps lay perfectly flat on my platter (if only because of gravity ?) and play flawlessly.

 

for me these reissues are for people that
a)dont want to pay 100 or 200 dollars for a mint 1st pressing of an old or rare album.
or
b)for people that just cant find a good sounding copy of the album and are ready to give the reissue a shot.

 

My understanding of heavy weight vinyl is simply that it will last longer. The grooves won't get worn out as easily on thicker vinyl and will last a lot more spins over its lifetime.

 

Yeah Wax, gravity can be your friend Same here with a few paper thin titles I have, love em, Especially those old UK Thompson Twin 12inchers!
I find that 180's are just pure marketing

 

In my case it was ELO's OOTB, couldn't find a descent copy, went through four over the years

 

A thicker cover doesn't make the artwork look better.

 

The grooves are exactly the same depth whether the disc is lightweight or heavyweight!!!

 

Asking which is better , original LPs or 180 g LPs is like asking which cars go faster, domestic cars or cars painted red.

 

Nah! A good pressing is a good pressing whatever the weight! My point is that there is nothing inherently "good" about a heavyweight record and in fact pressing a good heavy disc has it's own set of challenges

 

That was kind of my point. A fast car is a fast car no matter what the color.

It is some what gear dependent. On high end TTs that use platters made of acrylic, delron or other similar plastics and firmly couple the vinyl to the platter it really doesn't matter. In effect the platter and record become one. But with other TT designs the thickness can sometimes affect the sound.

 

Here's my take on this matter:

http://blog.vinylgourmet.com/2015/1...fits-heavyweight-vinyl-records-explained.html

 

Tell ME about it !!!Lps down here start at U$ 46 !

 

I always prefer thicker/heavier vinyl.

It doesn't sound any better than standard weight vinyl...it just feels better when placing it on the platter.

 

A flat disc is pretty much essential when listening to vinyl and I think possibly a lot of people think that a heavier disc is more likely to be so! Whilst this is true to a degree (I'm sure a lot of us have experienced warped lightweight discs, particularly in the 80s) the whole pressing cycle has to be optimised to get a decent moulding.

Compression moulding relies on the air being expelled by the "flash" this means a heavier disc starts off with a bigger "puck" or "biscuit" (whatever you wish to call it), this in turn means more flash and a longer slower pressing cycle.

Heavier discs will cost more for the above reasons. I take the points about the disc and the turntable being one, but a turntable clamp and maybe a different mat can help too!

I personally would love to see or even take part in a listening challenge where different weight pressings are played in a blind challenge!

I'm sure a 180g disc feels better in the hand, but is it audibly better than a 135 - 140g pressing?

 

No.

 

Speaking of lasting longer, what's the half-life of the PVC plastic used in making LPs? Could it be argued that heavier records are more wasteful of natural resources (or perhaps just bad or badly mastered ones are)? 95% of my vinyl collection is OG, so when I pick up a 180g reissue it feels like overkill.