200 W or 25 W amp in a 12x9 room?

Undecided between Luxman Cl-38uC pre + MQ-88uC power (25 W) and McIntosh MA 380 (200 W). Speakers are Heresy IV and the room is a small 12x9. I mostly listen to rock/metal so I want my system to be dynamic, alive and punchy with plenty of grunt and slam. In a word: headbanging!
While I’m sure that both can play loud because the Heresy are very efficient, I’m not sure if the Luxman combo can play as dynamic and exciting as the McIntosh.

 

I’d go with the Luxman. It just seems a better pairing. That speaker will sing pretty good with a few watts of sweet tube power.

 

Either would work with the right speaker but of those choices, I'd have the Luxman pair every time.

 

I was driving Heresy III and currently Forte IV with 40 watt Quicksilver amps and it is plenty of power.

 

Synergy is more important than power with a speaker like that.

 

"Macintosh" your speakers will thank you

 

The Klipsch's are very efficient. 200 w may be overkill.

 

I have not heard either amp, but, I have heard high-powered McIntosh amps on high efficiency speakers and the combination is horrible--lifeless and unengaging at reasonable loudness levels (i did not try "headbanging" levels. The Heresy is not that suited anyway to extreme volume levels--it becomes too harsh and shrill when pushed.

 

Feel free to ignore, but I currently have a 25 watt tube amp driving 86 db efficient full range speakers (my new ones haven't arrived yet). Plenty of power. Room is approximately 14.5 x 19.

 

I’ve driven more sensitive speakers with a 20w tube system. Personally I prefer substantially more power and drive capability. I suppose I’m in the minority in that respect.

 

Sorry, but I can't find any McIntosh labeled MA380. Which integrated are you thinking about?

 

I was looking for that one also.

 

How long will you be staying with your speakers and is there a chance you might upgrade to a less efficient speaker in the future? I know you are happy with the speakers now but soul search and if you might go one day in the not too distant future, prior to wanting to upgrade the amplifier again, would you go low or high efficiency speakers? That is how I would approach this question.

 

MA 352. My mistake, sorry.

 

Just bought them and they’re here to stay as I’m currently building my endgame system.

 

I’ve always preferred models with Autoformers for the sound.

 

@BLACKGOLGOTHA -- with the heresy iv, i don't think you need to go that far. the luxman sq-n150 is a fraction of the price of the (wonderful) luxman combo you listed, sounds great, and will work really well with the heresy iv.

 

Well then it seems the less powerful tube amp seems to be the majorities choice. I have not heard the speakers so will not make a recommendations, but tubes sound fantastic and solid state can really bring out the fullness and bass in a speaker so I see why this is a hard choice for you.

 

That’s why I chose tube pre /SS power.

 

Just like a Miata is always the suggestion on a car forum, I’ll add that an MC275 would fit the bill perfectly.

 

200 WPC is way overkill for Heresys. That much power will actually work to their detriment.

 

I'd go Luxman with the Heresy's. I use a 25w Luxman Class A with my Forte III's in a small room (10x11') and I can't turn my dial past 11am... Tubes and Heresy's are awesome. Just my opinion..

 

Yes. I agree that driving them at full power output might present a wee bit of a problem for everybody.

 

Even at lower levels 200 WPC on tap will sound terrible with Heresys.

 

Quite difficult to give a sharp answer to your question, but I would like to express my humble opinion.

The Luxman pre and power amp look gorgeous and very classy, 25W are more than enough to make the Heresys play loud and I understand they would be a better choice for the average audiophile.

But I understand you don't listen much to Diana Krall and string quartets, you want go headbanging with rock and metal, almost feeling the band playing live in your room. Now take this into account:

1) Klipsch states a sensitivity of 99dB @ 2.83V / 1m in average listening room, which is not the standard when measuring speakers efficiency. Independent measurement by Newport Test Labs reported sensitivity as being 93dBSPL @ 1m for a 2.83Veq input (confirmed by other testers). The difference is 6dB, meaning that you actually need an amplifier 4 times more powerful than what one estimate based on the Klipsch figure. Heresys are not very sensitive speakers, just medium/high.

2) Heresys can play loud, but they also can play VERY loud. Klipsch states a maximum SPL of 116dB (Continuous). A little math shows that 116dB-93dB = +23dB with respect to 1W needed from the amplifier, i.e. (guess what) 200W. Actually the official power handling of the Heresys is 100W (continuous) and 400W (peak). It is quite evident that 25W max cannot drive your speakers as loud as they can go.

3) As @mds and @Khorn said before, solid state can really bring out the fullness and bass in a speaker, while "grunt and slam" are not exactly what tube power amps are known for, mostly because of the output transformers.

4) The McIntosh has a 5-band equaliser, with the lowest frequency band centred at 30Hz. That knob is gold for the Heresys, whose FR starts sloping down around 50Hz in the bass region. Turning that knob +3dB or a bit more (it depends on your taste and the speakers placement in the room) can really extend the impact of bass guitar and kick drum. I cannot say it replaces a subwoofer, but it helps a lot living without one. The tone controls on the Luxman preamp cannot substitute for this kind of correction.

Of course an actual audition of both solutions at your place would be the only reliable way for you to choose, we all are trying to guess the right choice, but I'd place my bet on the McIntosh.

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