Advice on speaker upgrade, Dynaudio, Focal, B W etc

Hi there
I posted here a few weeks back asking about an amp upgrade, after living with my new mission qx2 speakers I have decided to upgrade them to something else.
They are excellent award winning speakers, I just want something a little better.
I’m interested in...

Dynaudio emit 10 or 20
B&W 606 or 606 s2
Focal chora 806
Klipsch rp-500m

Detail, the midrange and stereo image are most important to me, I’m wary of overly bright speakers however I am using a denon amplifier and the highs are pretty neutral so as long as the speakers aren’t too over the top bright then they should still pair well
Any recommendations not listed are welcome.

Thanks

 

I’ve never been happier than with ATC, went from SCM 11 to 19 to 40 (2), for me they are balanced, neutral and revealing, almost ‘flat’, seemingly without any artificial ‘sound’ of their own, YMMV.

 

Thanks but after looking they are a little out of my current price range unfortunately. My budget is around £400 to £550 :/

 

Got it. Maybe look at ProAc Tablette, if you can find a used pair around that price, would be good.

 

PSB Alpha 5's.

 

Here are some comments both as someone who was shopping a lot with a buddy (he bought Buchardt actives finally) and as a loudspeaker engineer:
- Dynaudio have consistently hewed to an engineering ethic of high quality dynamics. We felt their models (like $2k towers) were very nice but not quite as nice as other stuff.
- Focal Aria are great, I listen a lot to a setup of that. The cheaper, not so nice, though the dealer of those had a very poor shop setup.
- B&W I long admire for their engineering, though the cheaper models don't seem to get as much love.
- Klipsch have a reputation for sounding bright/hot. This is doubtless related to their horn tweeters. However, now-chief-engineer Roy Delgado has improved the horn designs quite a bit. I've heard 5.1 Klipsch setups at Magnolia and they didn't sound over-bright (and I'm sensitive to that).
- Presuming the Linton are out of your budget, the Wharfedale Diamond 11.2 was really nice, had a very open sound throughout Audio Element's open-plan shop. No glaring treble, no tubby boom in the bass. They are ported down at 40 Hz (see link) which is somewhat rare and important because it will keep the woofer from bottoming out with low notes.
Wharfedale Diamond 11.2 loudspeaker Measurements
I'm not sure pricing by you; here your budget would move up to 11.4 towers. Are you actually placing in a bookshelf? Or on stands?

 

I would love the buchardt! The S400’s would definitely be my first choice if I could afford it.

I did have some of the older 9.1 diamonds a while ago but they sounded very coloured, not enough detail in upper mids for me, I’m sure newer models have improved on that somewhat though.

Yeah, my current speakers are on filled stands. I’m glad you mentioned floorstanders.
Could I get away with floorstanders in my upstairs flat? It’s not a new building so the floors are a little better than average, still I do have to keep it down a bit obviously.
I have granite slabs so I could put floorstanders on those plus I’d be bunging up the ports which would tame the bass a little.
I’m wondering how good the fyne audio F303’s are? I’m guessing the extra woofer will give a larger overall sound than bookshelves? Really interested in these, I hope I can get away with something like that in my property

 

Anyone here know if floorstanders would be okay? Or should I stick to bookshelves?

 

I absolutely love my M20, and had M10 before these. I haven't heard more clear and dynamic speakers than these, at or around the price. They aren't bright, but they also won't hide a bright amp or recordings. Soundstage is very good, but I have had better honestly. The M20 is a far more robust speaker than the M10, so in your setup probably the way to go.
I have had Focals, I thought they were good, a touch too bright for my liking, but biggest complaint was I found them kind of boring how they presented the music.
Never have liked Klipsch other than the heritage stuff, that's fun stuff!
Never heard a B&W speaker at all! Weird....lol

 

A pair of secondhand Rega RS floor standers - depending on room size and air to shift either smaller 3, med 5, bigger 7 would all be within your budget. Side firing bass drivers and front port make for easy positioning. Very neutral detailed sound with oodles of soundstage. Don't need bi-wiring and easy to drive. Great speakers.

 

If you are truly wary of "bright" speakers, you may want to consider speakers other than those with hard dome tweeters - Focal, B&W, Klipsch. Unfortunately, with your amp, I'm not sure you'd get the most out of the Emit 20, as they are 4 ohm/86dB.

I'll have to admit my bias, though. I, too, do not like "bright" speakers, and every audio sales rep I spoke with advised me to avoid hard dome/metal tweeters. That led me to Dynaudio and ELAC, and I chose a pair of Dynaudio Evoke 10 bookshelf speakers. I upgraded my integrated amp (Onkyo TX-8555) to make sure I was giving the Evoke 10s what they needed as far as power (current), etc. I've never been happier.

Any chance you can audition the speakers on your list? I know showroom conditions will likely differ wildly from your listening area, but you can't mask "bright."

If you could upgrade your amp, I would certainly give the Dynaudio a try (and comparably priced ELACs). Those two companies make full-sounding speakers with lots of detail, separation, etc. I'm not as familiar with ELAC, but my Dynaudio speakers have an expansive and DEEP soundstage. They never cease to amaze me.

 

I had no idea that metal tweeters sounded brighter, thanks for that!
I will be upgrading the amplifier soon, I’ll probably be staying with denon though, I find them less bright than any other major brand I’ve used.

I can’t compare anything anywhere due to lockdown so yeah, sadly I’m buying blind. I’m trying hard to make an informed decision but yes, ultimately it would be far better to try a few out somewhere if I could.

I’m seriously considering floorstanders now, if I really can’t get away with it in my property though then it looks like I’ll be getting the dynaudio’s.
I looked up the wharfedale 12.3 which seem pretty good, so do the fyne audio f303’s.

I just can’t quite make up my mind! :/

 

I have Focal 726 Towers and those tweeters are not bright. They are crisp, airy, detailed and very musical. Bright is not a word I would ever use to describe them. A lot of this comes down to system synergy as well. I'm using a tube amp so that helps but I have them now hooked up to a solid state amp and they still sound sweet.

 

I checked them out and they are also out of my price range sadly.

 

There is "conventional wisdom" that big speakers can be "too big for the room" (i.e. too much bass). This is sometimes true and sometimes nonsense. It just really depends on "the room" (which often really includes connecting rooms and hallways etc etc) and possible speakers positions and then the tuning of the individual speakers. It's a synergistic thing. You noted you're open to plugging ports, that can make the speaker response "droop" which can fit the low frequency bass boost of rooms better and actually get a flatter in-room response than a speaker with a more typical "flat" response.
- The other thing about flat in-room response is good room correction software, like Dirac or Audyssey. When I ran Audyssey on a 5.1 Focal setup it was a bit astonishing how much it evened out a bass sweep tone before/after. Since most people can't change their room, can only put speakers in a given spot, and room treatments aren't effective down low, we're only left with DSP to help. I'd get a receiver even to run 2 channels, since I don't *think* you can get room EQ in any stereo integrated so far.

If you have a spouse, look up speakers in your price range, then get her/his opinion. Especially show the same speaker with different colors/finishes. Because while we preferred some speakers to others out of all the stuff we listened to, the good news is there are many many quite nice speakers out there, and a lot of them will make you happy. (Be sure you buy with a reasonable return policy in case not!)

 

What kind of music do you listen to most? Both the Klipsch rp-500m and the B & W 606 series speakers have a V curve frequency response at most reasonable volumes with Bass and Treble slightly/relatively more prominent than mids. Lots of people like this. The Focal sound is a divisive. People either seem to really love them, or completely the inverse. They are known for prominent, forward, and exceptionally clear treble. All of these options you listed can deliver good to excellent clarity & detail.

In my limited experience the B&W 600 series speakers presented a very deep and wide soundstage if you're on axis, with quite a bit of toe-in. However, their off-axis performance is noticeably less. Also, they're particular with placement to get the most out of and like power a bit more than they're listed specs might suggest.
Your Denon will drive the Klipsch speakers with no problem. Klipsch speakers have their own character, which lots of people like, but they're far from "neutral".
The Dynaudio's will sound laid-back in comparison to the others, especially in terms of treble. However, they are really versatile, present good sound-staging, will probably be a little less fussy with setup than the B&Ws and sound better off-axis. The downside with them again is power. The Emit's can give you pretty good dynamics, but they need plenty of current to do it, and your Denon won't get the most out of them.
I only heard Focal Choras in a show room once, and cannot comment fairly on their imaging.

If you have a dealer near you with even two or three of your options, try to go and listen to them. Bring some music you know really well to use for comparison. Definitely compare the sound of a metal tweeter vs soft dome tweeters (or even AMTs) if you can. Some people (including myself) can be sensitive to the tonal quality of metal tweeters.

Good Luck!

 

I listen to a pretty wide variety, mainly experimental music but everything from classical, jazz, electronic, rock, metal...

To be honest I want something that sounds thicker, I heard some floorstanders a few years ago which blew me away! I didn’t think I’d need to get anything quite so huge but the cellos through those floorstanders sounded outstanding and I’m wondering if it’s due to the fact they weren’t stand mounters? I always thought it was just the bass that was improved on floorstanders but I’m starting to wonder if they just sound bigger in general...?
I have bought over the last 9 months a pair of budget edifiers, some wharfedale diamond 9.1’s, mission 790’s and mission qx2’s. None of them have been able to produce quite what I’m after, both missions have come close in some respects but not close enough.
Will floorstanders be what I’m after? Is it just more low end usually or will everything sound bigger?

Please let me know if it’s better to start a new topic on floorstanders.

Thanks

 

Anybody know? I’d really appreciate it if anyone here can advise on whether floorstanders sound larger overall or if it’s literally just the bass that’s bigger.
Thanks

 

From my limited experience with floorstanders, I prefer stand mount, it's not always bigger bass either. From what I've heard, and by no means am I an expert, they can make the sound "bigger", although there are many factors at work here; room it's in, power feeding them, positioning of the speakers and you, the list goes on. There's no right or wrong answer for the most part. Sure a large open room usually requires a larger speaker, but it's ultimately a matter of preferences. Both floorstanders and stand mount have their own merits, you really have to try it and decide what you prefer, no one can answer that but you. I've found, and again by no means have I tried them all, but under $1k floorstanding speakers compromise too much in too many areas. Jack of all trades, masters of none. Again, just from the few I've tried in my room. YMMV.

 

I understand, I know it’s going to be hard to determine what I should go for, however I can’t try or compare anything due to the lockdown restrictions so I’m a little stuck :/
Maybe I’m asking the impossible here, but I was hoping that floorstanders could maybe offer a larger or thicker midrange than stand mounters.
If I really cannot figure that out then I guess I’ll have to buy from somewhere with a good returns policy.
If by chance anyone knows if the wharfedale 12.3 are any good, or any other sub £600 ish are worth trying out then I’d appreciate it.

 

Ya shopping for any gear with all the restrictions is really challenging. Larger and thicker midrange won't be inherent upon buying a floorstander, rather the design and voicing of the speaker, large or small. Definitely find somewhere that has a liberal return policy and try a few different shapes and sizes.

 

[I say all this as a B&W 802 owner.]

Since you are in the UK, have you considered Q Acoustics? I've not heard them, but their models regularly get excellent reviews (they are supposed to deliver a lot of bang for your buck):

Q Acoustics: Beautifully Engineered Speakers and Soundbars

Alternatively, you could look at the models Andrew Jones designed for Elac:

https://www.elac.com/

They too generally get excellent reviews. (I've heard the more costly models, but not the budget ones.)

I would add KEF to your search list.


Two What Hi-Fi links which may give you some other models to research:

Best budget hi-fi speakers 2021 | What Hi-Fi?

Best floorstanding speakers 2021: budget to premium | What Hi-Fi?

 

Your in a difficult position here as I would always advocate a listening test first and foremost as your ears will tell you exactly what you like or don't like....you've listed several well known and well respected makes none of which would be 'bad' buys, but as you can't listen to any you have to take a chance....here is a pair that may suit exactly what you want, although stand mounts they are a well known and respected speaker, if I didn't have my Totem floorstanders I would seriously consider buying these, read some reviews and see what you think...Totem Model 1 Speakers - Excellent | eBay Totem Acoustic Model 1 loudspeaker https://www.stereophile.com/standloudspeakers/820/index.html

Maybe just of of your price range but worth considering, the only drawback may be power needed to drive them. You need to investigate that with your amp...hope that helps.

 

If you get the chance to audition, I’d add Fyne bookshelf or floorstanders to your list, at your budget. Also seem some good deals on B&W at present.

 

I was going to recommend NHT C3

C 3 Bookshelf Loudspeaker

But in looking at your amp specs and comparing that to the NHT C3 speaker amplifier demands and also looking at your Mission QX-2 specs and and amp demands-I'd say you should upgrade your amp first!

Mission QX-2 power requirements
Nominal impedance 4 Ohms (Compatible 8 Ohms)
Minimum impedance 3.6 Ohms

Your Denon amp

• Rated output
  70 W + 70 W
  (4 ohms, 1 kHz, THD 0.7%)
  45 W + 45 W
  (8 ohms, 20 Hz - 20 kHz, THD 0.07%)