AI Genrated Art

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Jeff Kent, Aug 14, 2022.

  1. Evethingandnothing

    Evethingandnothing Forum Resident

    Location:
    Devon
    Another reason to not get off the sofa.
     
  2. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne
    Without an artist having created it (only a prompter) it's the opposite of art. It's simply imagery. An illusion of art. It's lavish junk. A sham. Worthless...and indiscernable from authentic human art.
     
  3. Old Fart At Play

    Old Fart At Play He won't eat it, he hates everything

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    That’s certainly a valid argument. Although it gets into the endless and unanswerable question of what constitutes art. But I still believe that there will be people (artists?) who end up using this technology in an exceptionally creative manner that stands above the way most other people are using it. Most likely the people who “throw away the manual,” as Frank Zappa would say.

    Is this technology tremendously different from software that allows a designer to color an entire section of an image with a click of a mouse, or to drag and drop an image? To me, it seems like more of a large evolution of existing technology rather than a revolution. It does allow for the possibility of images with almost no creative input, but it also allows for the creation of images with a new form of creative input. I can guarantee you that if everybody posting on this thread created an image using this software, some people’s would consistently be more interesting than other’s.
     
  4. the real pope ondine

    the real pope ondine Forum Resident

    Location:
    usa
    this! it actually hate seeing it, like it upsets me.
     
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  5. Plinko

    Plinko Forum Resident

    It’s not art
     
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  6. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical omnivore.

    Location:
    Victoria, Canada
    It may be an interesting experiment, the program being the 'art'. It neither bothers me nor particularly inspires but I'm sure it could come up with some striking images at times. Although it isn't human, it is very human in that it's created by humans. If you don't like it don't support it or patronize companies employing it I guess?

    When it takes an expert to spot the replicant most deep readers of science fiction will find themselves in a familiar world... it's a matter of opinion on if it's dystopian, utopian, or just the usual something inbetween. :D

    Didn't everyone else here find Raymond Scott's music generator machine way back interesting? From Warner Brothers cartoons music to 'the future' of music! He paved the way to sequencers and I haven't seen a lot of complaints about the uses of that over the last number of decades.
     
  7. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne
    That action isn't an artistic act. It is simply execution. Filling in. Of course the choice of the colour or the intensity of tone is creative. However, writing a prompt of "yellow" isn't.
    I imagine though that one can prompt "Pantone 116" to be included in the AI calculation, so there will be ways for the designer/marketing assistant/hairdresser to have a degree of creative input, but it is minimal. So prompting could be construed as "art direction" of course, like briefing an illustrator (which I did many times) but the final "art" is the illustrator's and not the art director's.
     
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  8. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Mt. Kisco, NY
    It works by specific prompts, this is exactly what I put in. no more no less..."record collection, speakers, stereo, room, music."
     
  9. That's interesting, because the result is so obviously reducing the stated criteria exclusively to their shapes and topographic forms. It's all furniture and room decor, to the algorithm. "Imagined" in ways that have noting to do with the functional utility of the "record collection" software, and the "speakers, stereo" hardware devices you requested. It also seems to be using those particular descriptive parameters for the purpose of comparison in order to locate the interior design principles in historical time; in this case, the 1950s-1970s. But as far as giving any indication that it knows what any of those material objects actually, are, how they operate, or what purpose they serve, you might as well have been talking to a wall.

    The "room" portion of the description seems to default to one particular template- like the interior of a cube, with a spatial arrangement that takes Earth gravity for granted. As for "music", the program just tossed away that input; it didn't compute.
     
  10. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Mt. Kisco, NY
    Let's not forget that with each use, AI learns...
     
  11. AI doesn't "learn", in any sense other than acquiring a bigger comparative database to inform its selections. I'm not sure there's a database big enough to acquaint it with the reasons why audio gear and vinyl records were invented. And the notion that AI has a subjective perspective is merely Faustean solipsism, anthromorphism. At least thus far. Without a subjective perspective, there may be something to be learned, but nobody is there to learn it. At least, not until the result of the inquiry gets to the second order, the level of processing by the human intelligences reviewing it. (To say that AI is Egoless is to understate the case. AI is as Egoless as a lawnmower. The interesting implication of the speculation that self-aware AI could be achieved is that- being neither mortal, material, or localized in its operations- it would also lack an Ego, as we humans know it.. Although I'm skeptical that the technology will ever advance to that point.)

    A human- or any sufficiently intelligent ET/UT with ears, and the ability to decode the aural bandwidth between 20 and 20,000 cycles per second- could watch a human operating a stereo system, and deduce its purpose (if not its technological workings) the moment silence is replaced with music. The entity would realize that something has happened. If there's an AI program out there that's been equipped with the ability to understand functional differences between silence and non-silence, I don't know about it. This program certainly doesn't possess that perceptual ability; it seems to be entirely visual.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
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  12. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Mt. Kisco, NY
    Methinks you're taking this a little too seriously. It's just a fun exercise, for now...
     
  13. This is what I call Fun!, in a big way. Pondering these questions is entertainment for me.
     
  14. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Mt. Kisco, NY
    Fair enough. I'd be willing to bet that at some point there will be context specific AI, including one for audiophile purposes.
     
  15. I suppose that's a task that AI could eventually sort, to some extent. Although not necessarily faster or more reliably than my own ears.

    If enough human users input enough measurement to provide a workable database for the program, it could probably rank releases in terms of various parameters correlated with high fidelity sound. Or it could simply scan 5 star Internet reviews and offer a list, because there's a rough critical consensus already in existence in that regard, to some extent.

    AI is just another form of computer aided design. As such, perhaps it's best relegated to realms where humans are overwhelmed by the sheer volume of data and have difficulty sorting it, like interactive effects between climactic seasons, geography, and hydrology. And leave matters of esthetics to the judgements of humans.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
  16. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    Commercial "art" is going to be affected by this, big time; in large part, because it's arguably much more commercial than art, Will AIs be able to generate logos, create graphic designs, illustrate, etc., in a manner that serve the same useful and functional purpose as the stuff people did, and which can be calibrated to be as aesthetically pleasing to test groups, at a fraction of the cost of having humans do it? I'm sure of it.
     
  17. Jeff Kent

    Jeff Kent Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Mt. Kisco, NY
    Easy to say that now. This kind of tech tends to escalate quickly. I'd expect to see top 4o type pop artists/producers using some kind of AI in their songwriting/recording...if they aren't already.
     
  18. The use of it tends to escalate. The actual ability of the technology to improve has a marked tendency to de-escalate, in my view.

    As assistance in composing, I'm sure it can save a lot of time. That's what computers do best, make things easier for humans. But what they also tend to do is to train humans to follow the instructions required to use the computer, thereby requiring human thought to run in the same narrow ways as a computer does. As long as musical creators don't get carried away, AI can probably help. But once it starts cranking out surefire formula pop for days, the result is liable to be that more people will eventually care less about music.

    That has, in fact, already happened to some extent. The most popular and marketable music may be appealing, but it's entirely on the surface. More akin to visual values. A slightly peppier and more electronic-sounding version of Muzak, the "easy listening" music of the 1960s that infused the background of office environments. Easy to listen to, easy to tune out.

    David Byrne has written about his experiments with AI composition. It has to be understood, the final choices are made by the person using the program. The AI is merely doing modeling: "what if it sounded like this?" Forecast modeling, of alternative directions for the course of the music. And I don't doubt that an AI program could sometimes surprise and delight me that way. But the decision about how boss the results are would still be mine. I'd be the one to say "okay, eight bars of this, and then snip" (or loop, etc.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023
  19. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne
    Me too - at most levels. However some companies will pride themselves on using human creations but it'll probably be a niche, elitist thing.
    I've already seen design studios, advertising agencies, photographic studios and illustrators throw in the towel, change careers simply because of the gradual democratisation of desktop publishing, web design etc. Why pay all those qualified experts when you do the whole thing with a young marketing manager and webmaster on relatively low-grade salaries? No-brainer. When I think of the hundreds of thousands of euros we used to bill clients for all that expert work 20 years ago.:rolleyes:
     
  20. Spaghettiows

    Spaghettiows Forum Resident

    Location:
    Silver Creek, NY
    It's been happening to many skilled working musicians over the last few decades. It is a sad state of affairs.
     
  21. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical omnivore.

    Location:
    Victoria, Canada
    Or as Philip K. Dick might have put things... "skim milk masquerades as cream".

    I usually prefer traditional hand-drawn and painted cel animation over computer animation... but I am open to exceptions. I've certainly enjoyed Finding Nemo, Toy Story and The Iron Giant, and also one of the Final Fantasy ones. I suspect they had many human hands (and minds) behind them versus some which I haven't liked.
     
  22. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne
  23. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne


    Beyond belief.
     
  24. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Senior Member

    Location:
    Bretagne

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