Alright, CD players, let's see what we can agree on.

For the OP, here's Paul's simple take on CDP vs CDT. In your case the pre has a decent DAC so I'd concentrate on a quality CDT & expect that over time you'll upgrade to a quality stand alone DAC.

CD players output analog, so why add a DAC?

 

Always have for my main cd player one with a reliable CD transport mechanisme now i have one with
the Philips CD 2 PRO for more than 10 years never had a problem with it.
Before i have one with th Philips CDM 1 MK2 (Marantz CD 80) sold it to a friend and works fine after more than 20 years,
have the same transport in my Marantz CD 60 works also still perfect.
These both transports are only for CD.
Imho a good cd transport make a lot on the quality of a player.

 

Same here, but you know this about me already
Actually found an old Denon DCD 1500 for a good price, hopefully have it next week. It added two more features that are important to me-
Variable out and indexing.
It does lack 3 inch cd capability, but I have ton's of adapters

 

Agree w your last line. If the transport craps out it doesn’t matter how good the player sounds.

 

I had no idea that there was such a thing as a CD player which didn't support gapless playback until today. I though that this issue was limited to streamers.

 

I spent a lot of time -- probably too much -- on this subject over the summer. I write and have a CD player nearby while I do my work, so I'm always on it, listening with my headphones. At first I tried several newer players, before venturing into some vintage machines that were more my speed (and which I couldn't afford when I was a teenager lol).

Quick thoughts on the newer machines I had:

1) Marantz 5005 - bought one that was DOA right out of the box. Seller said it "happens to him with Marantz all the time," got a refund and didn't try another.
2) Yamaha CD-S300 - nice machine, good sound, but I had intermittent disc errors and ended up returning it after a couple of weeks. Build quality was not particularly impressive for a $300 unit either.
3) Denon DNE-800 - I liked this and the sound was more dynamic than the Yamaha, build quality was a cut above too, but still seemed overpriced IMO.

In the interim I picked up a couple of cheap(er) vintage players after doing research on old message board posts about what were good deals -- and in all honesty, the sound for me was as good/better on these units:

1) Sony CDP-222ES -- this was a Japanese unit I picked up, made in '87 or '88 I believe. Got one off Ebay, fully cleaned, adjusted and tested. Twin PCM56-J DACs and it's just marvelous -- has a rich sound, and full "balance" that I felt were lacking on the newer Yamaha & Denon units. Plus, I haven't ever used a CD player as fast as this one. The "linear motor" or whatever it is results in lightning-fast read times that are incredible. I would recommend the Ebay seller I used as he seems to sell a bunch of refurbished vintage players, replacing belts and such along the way. I also bought a Squaretrade extended warranty so for $15, if it craps out fast, Ill get my money back, but this is REALLY well-built and has wonderful sound coming straight out of its headphone jack. I will be surprised if I don't have it for a while (fingers crossed).

2) Magnavox CDB582 -- the Philips players are renowned for the TDA1541 DAC's they have so I tried what looked like a pretty good condition unit. Unfortunately the build quality of the Philips/Magnavox Belgium-made units aren't on the level of, say, Sony's Japanese players and the one I bought had tray issues that I could tell would be a problem in the near future...as many do (either that or LED display problems). I sent it back for a refund.

3) JVC XL-V311 -- this was a really good backup I picked up, only cost about $50 shipped (you can probably do better). Great sound, twin DAC's, 18 bit "noise shaping" and a really nice, rich sound. Some of the early '90s JVC players have a good rep and are really well-built on top of it-- but because they aren't Sony, they don't carry as much value on the secondary market (making them a good buy!). I put this in my rack with my AV receiver. It was mint and was obviously taken care of.

Like anything, if you go the Ebay route, check the photos to see how used these are, consider the seller (some of them do clean them up ahead of time -- MANY obviously do not!), etc. I've found going the "vintage" route more satisfying (and frankly exciting) than buying the new stuff. I was surprised, especially, at how poorly made the new Marantz players apparently are -- having experienced it firsthand especially. For the money you're paying, I don't think it's crazy to expect them to be better made.

 

I hear you on a product that will last. If it’s not reliable then it’s all aggravation. I guess I’m jaded. I’d hate to count the number of decent players I’ve had that crapped out. Either it was a laser issue or a transport. I find the Tascam to be pretty robust as a transport into a DAC.

 

I’m not doubting this happened. But this is utterly ridiculous. Marantz has been a top of the line audio component company for decades. If this were truly the case that they sold products that were quote “dead on arrival out of box all the time.” It would be well known to people who frequent forums like this one. This is literally the first time I’ve ever read a suggestion that Marantz products regularly fail brand new. I think the lesson to be learned here is to by from reputable licensed dealers and not eBay sellers.

I’m disappointed for anyone who takes advice from this post.

 

you aren't close yet... but I guess a lot of high end companies don't even make CD players anymore.

 

my thoughts are:

-SACD? do you have any? if not don't bother. Very limited catalogue available, mostly mainstream and classical. Nothing new or interesting. Sound better than CD? -- Debatable

-If your analog setup has a loud hiss and you are an analog fan, why not spend the money to address that? CD playing is not necessary, just rip the discs. If you have all your discs rips, you can play whatever you see whenever you want. Spend the $4 on a DAC maybe.

-If you must, get a cheap disc spinner with coax out and use it with a DAC.

-gapless? Standalone player shoudl support. But is it a huge deal? Unless you listen to classical primarily, then there are like 2 albums that really depend on it. And they aren't even *good*. OK, there are more, but people make way to big a deal of this IMO.

-If you want high end, then these mass market players are not close. Probably need to check Esoteric or dCS or etc. for that.

-I still have 2 disc spinners in my rack, a nice old audio research and a denon sacd player. Neither have been turned on in at least a year...

 

It actually is well known to "people who frequent forums like this one" -- in fact, here's a post from Page 2 in this very thread:

For the record: I am well aware Marantz is a quality company. It's why I bought the player in the first place. And the vendor I purchased this from was talking about the specific CD player models they are currently selling, which are littered with problems, not every piece of equipment Marantz has ever made.

If it was an isolated case for me, I'd chalk it up to bad luck -- but the reality is there are plenty of terrible reviews about the 5005 and the 6006. You can go on Amazon or other sites and see the 1-star reviews from people who have run into the same experiences as I did, no matter where they got them.

 

The problem with any consumer online review is that generally speaking the people who take the time to complain are the ones dissatisfied.

Perhaps this series is particularly troublesome? Though I recall reading plenty of positive reviews here too. And reading your initial post I took it that you were describing marantz in general, So thank you for clarifying. If OP is still following, I wouldn’t be so quick to throw out a marantz product compared to comparable products from oppo, dennon and Sony. But obviously YMMV!

 

i went through this process about a year and half ago. Just wanted a decent cd player that sounded good but with good build quality. I ended up with the Emotiva ERC-3. So far I've had no issues with it. its built like a tank as well. I have an older Sony DVPS-7000 still in the box I was going to use but so far happy with the purchase.

 

I have 7 cd players but after reading this review and discussion on Audiokarma I am going for this: 6000CDT CD Transport From Audiolab - The Audiophile Man

 

I like my Marantz CD6006, have had going on 2 years and gets almost daily use, has performed flawlessly for me. Lots of options in your price range but if you want to stay under $500 that’d be my choice. Usually the price drops about $50 for Christmas if it matters to you.

 

I use an Onkyo C-7030 also, it has a Wolfson 8718 DAC. I also have a small collection of SACDs and Blu-Ray Audio CDs which I use my Sony UBP-X8OO which use my A/V receivers DAC for conversion to analog.
Both together just over 300$ and sound great !

 

This sounds really promising actually

 

I have a Marantz CD 6004 and absolutely love it.

 

“Build Quality.” Now there’s a term that I see often in this forum, even in this thread. But what does it mean, and what relationship if any does it have on sound quality and equipment longevity? I believe that the term is, for the most part, meaningless. When someone writes that they were not impressed by the “build quality” and therefore rejected or returned a unit, I question their powers of discrimination.

 

Second on this player. It replaced a dying Classe CDP 1.5, which sounded a lot smoother, but with limited parts I did not want to try and nurse it back. ERC3 is good for the money.

 

Good question! To me "build quality" refers to the unit's tangible features like casework, buttons, connections, heft, fit-n-finish, design, etc. These are purely aesthetic and have little-to-no impact on the sound performance. However, I desire to have more than a plastic appliance featured in my listening environment. So "build quality" is important to me for pride of ownership.

 

no matter how good something sounds- how are you going to use it if keeps breaking or certain pieces don't work. you know, because they are built cheaply.
Hence good build quality-parts that keep working, giving it equipment longevity. I've had cd players that sounded good but were built cheaply, like broken trays, tray belts, knobs etc.

 

Fair enough. But can one really predict whether or not a tray or knob will perform in the long run how “solid” it looks and heavy it feels? My hypothesis is that no, one cannot. Heavy equipment probably fails as often as light equipment. That has certainly been my experience. It’s the little details inside and the actual design that matters.

 

Build quality is part of the overall user experience and is therefore something I value. I would hate to buy an audiophile component and for it to look and feel like something from Walmart.

And chances are, if it's well made on the outside it will probably be well made on the inside. That's an assumption though.

Generally speaking, you get what you pay for. There are many components under $1K where money is saved on build quality. At that price the sound matters most and I would overlook cheap feeling buttons, knobs, trays, etc. But when you get to the $2k and up bracket, I think it's fair to expect more.