… and Now, A Message from Greg Lake.

( From the “Black Moon” sleeve )

 

Opinions vary

'g' not 'G'

More like 100's of g's

Stereo Lab - Acceleration limits of gramophone record grooves
and, if we substitute the values of 8.3kHz and 9.5μm in this equation it equates to a figure for maximum acceleration of nearly 26,000 m/s2 which is equivalent to about 2700 times the acceleration due to gravity.

 

He could have also mentioned the much larger problem of static on 180g LPs vs 120/140g.

 

From my own experience I don’t think he is necessarily wrong here. I have some great sounding yet super thin records.

 

imo the quality of the recording, mixing and production has much more to do with it than the weight.

The more mass the lower the resonant frequency, Does it make a difference when platter, etc., all factored in? The argument above is the lighter lp flexes more so absorbs or dampens better. The energy imparted to each is exactly the same, how they react to it is different.

I listened to American Beauty (180 gr Anniversary edition) and it sounded exceptional.

 

that is indeed a great recording, however we’ll never know what it might have sounded like on 110 g vinyl!

 

Or 200

sounded good on 140
It would sound great on a paper plate lol

maybe Workingman's Dead next

 

I’m waiting for my 50th anniversary copy of that to arrive as we speak!

 

it is worth the wait

The jacket is heavy like the original, but better quality

the music, nothing need be said
The pressing, dead (no pun intended) silent
Beautiful imo

 

The prominence of the 180g pressing spec as a new & improved! selling point for vinyl-revival LPs was always a somewhat dubious marketing proposition, but FWIW I've never bought (or not bought) a record based on pressing weight, and I can only assume that for most people it doesn't matter.

For audiophiles it's just another essentially trivial factor to bicker about in haughty, overconfident tech-speak.

I don't know the history of this debate but my guess might be that 180g pressings gained wide traction because it was a relatively easy way to emulate MFSL's vinyl presentation without doing all of the other much more crucial stuff MFSL does to create great-sounding records. And then Classic Records turned the dial up to 11 with their 200g monsters (which was mostly about the benefits of a flat profile I believe). And so here we are.

I love the handful of 200g pressings I own mostly because of the almost comically exaggerated heft and mass they offer, along with the retro overtones. But I also feel the same way about the ridiculously anorexic floppy-flimsy 1970's Dynaflex pressings. And both extremes sound great!

As always, my assumption if that it's the quality of the recording, the mastering, and the skill of the people doing the pressing that really matter, not the size of the biscuit they're squishing.

 

I'm disappointed. I thought the o.p. had gotten a message from the afterlife from the ELP star ...

 

He must have penned that right before he died.

 

Do you think with his life waning, what was really on his mind was the stupidity of heavy weight vinyl?

 

My import Who BBC record. If memory serves me it weighs 95 grams, I mean So thin it made my mind just shut down.
The fidelity, wonderful, I literally was dumbfounded by what was coming out of the speakers.
True story.
Beave

 

The best sounding records I have are also the thinnest.
Al Stewart, Year of the Cat notably.
Wafer thin due to the oil crisis of the time but exceptional sound.
Many others from the same period sound great.
The new 180g records I have just don't sound right.
I won't buy anymore as I have concluded its just a marketing gimmick

 

I have a recent 80g (!!!!) pressing which sounds as outstanding as you would want an “audiophile”pressing to sound.
You’d never guess it was ultra skinny vinyl.
(Admittedly, it was issued as a 10” “special”….)

Perversely, a Joni Mitchell’s “Blue” 180g which I bought roughly 15 years ago (so, fairly recent) is equally magical.
Also, I play my records unclamped and undamped which in theory should make things worse(!) for 180g
Go figure.

 

Just think how many more pressings the manufacturer could make with the material savings!

What I will say in favour of 180g is that it tends to be more stable and geometrically correct i.e. flatter.
Centre drilling can still be questionable but a minor quibble.

I’ve bought an awful lot of new vinyl in the last 15 years or so and my experience has been extremely positive (I know some others may have have had less pleasant experiences) so as far as I’m concerned 180g is fine.

 

I just play the records.

 

I've haven't had the best experience with most thick records. For years now I have avoided 200 gram, settled on 180 gram if I had too and loved the 160 gram stuff. But, hey that's just me your experience may differ.

 

The whole heavy weight vinyl thing is overplayed because in the end mastering trumps it.

We know it takes longer to correctly press it which giving the massively oversubscribed order book does put pressure to speed things up with issues such "stitching" and the resultant static.

The thing we didn't like in the past was recycled vinyl.

We are all aware just how much things have gone up in recent months and that includes the vinyl we buy so frankly I do feel it would be better all around to drop to around 140grams while keeping the improved presentation of the discs such as high quality sleeves, original inserts where included and lined inners.

 

I have a hunch that thicker vinyl is more likely to cup. I don't know why, but it may be to do with internal stresses and cooling. I prefer the bog standard 140g or less for this reason.

When you consider the effort that people put into azimuth accuracy despite the varying azimuth of every pressing, and the nonsense we all talk about record mats and clamps, cupping can put clear air between vinyl and platter, and a few degrees of azimuth error in between the two sides, and yet we listen happily, often unaware of the cupping problem.

Still, give me a flat 140g any day. That said, I'm a bit skeptical about the Brinkmann comments in the OP. You can be right for the wrong reasons.

 

So now with oil prices through the roof, do you think that the next big thing could be 80g records? Maybe that's the next big step on the dylan thingy.

 

Did anyone notice the deliberate mistake in the Brinkmann quote?
“Vinyl” is not “Acrylic”.

 

How do you know it was deliberate?

 

Ok..I own up…Brinkmann is undoubtedly referring to wave behaviour in a turntable he has designed which uses an acrylic platter that offers a better mechanical impedance match to vinyl.
…and my wife just tested positive for Covid (my daughter brought it back from Mexico and guess who was the chauffeur last week on the long drive back from the airport?)