Anyone quit tubes due to sound?

Yes they are, a high current amp that can operate at low impedances certainly helps.

With low power SET and SEP amps, it goes without saying.

But I run the Altec A7's with tube amps as powerful as the Rogue M-150 monoblocks.

Horn loaded speakers of any kind work well with tube amps of any power.

I have a pair of Zu, Omen Definitions that I ran with a PrimaLuna KT88 based prologue Five and that is a better match than running them with SS amps.

But, other than the Zu's, the Altec's and the legacy Klipsch La Scala's, I run all of my tower speakers with SS amps.

Modern day tower speakers were voiced with SS amps and the larger ones, need a good amount of power bass wise to properly pressurise a room.

While I can run any of them with tube amps, I just don't see any particular point in doing so, other than a higher cost of operation.

The amps sound excellent with SS operation and using tubes to drive them is a waste of time and money.

It is a complete fallacy that switching to tube amp amplification will improve any audio system, it won't.

If you have modern towers, save yourself some effort and a lot of money and run them with SS amps.

If you have monkey coffins with 8" direct radiator driver's or other specialty speakers, that is another totally different thing.

 

I think a distinction has to be made between Tube PRE amplification and Tube Power Amplifiers. The confoundment with power amplifiers is that they may be incompatible with the speakers. Tube vs SS pre amplification is a clearer test of preference. For myself I would never use SS preamplification but I am more agnostic with power amps.

 

Again, it all depends on your speakers.

Hybrid systems where you have a tube preamp and SS power amp don't in any way do what a tube power amp section will, with the correctly matched speakers, that is.

 

That is absolutely true when running a SS amp: You need a high-current SS amp when running electrostatics.

However, this is not true when running with tube amps. You just need high-power. Tube amps will naturally current limit when the impedance drops below the optimum impedance, and it doesn't bother them at all. And when you have at least 100 watts of tube-power to drive them with, the result can be truly glorious (at lower volumes). More power is better though.

I think that you are generalizing a bit far with your "Modern day towers don't work with tubes" comment. Many of these speakers are indeed voiced with SS amps. But not all of them!

Also, what exactly constitutes a "modern" tower in your book? Your preferred speakers mostly seem to be 60ish years old. I'm running Snell towers from the late 80s and these sound glorious with the right tube amp. But it would be hard to call these exactly "modern" anymore; except when compared to some of your vintage speakers.

 

Polk LSiM707's, next to the Zu, Omen Definitions. Front power amps is an Emotiva 250-Watt SS XPA-2, Generation I.



Polk RTiA9's.



Klipsch WF35's.



Polk Monitor 70's Series II (outside pair).



Boston Acoustic's M-350's (inside pair).

I have stacks of modern day tower speakers and stacks of SS and tube amps and I never use tube amps for sany of the modern day towers, with the noted exception of the Zu's.

 

What I see are stacks and stacks of Polk towers. So I can't help but think that you are generalizing your experience with a single brand as being true with all tower speakers.

I personally have no experience with Polk speakers. So they might sound like crap (or glorious) with tubes for all I know... But I can attest that (some at least) Snell towers can sound glorious with the right tube amp.

 

I always thought the Tubes sounded just fine-

 

What you are seeing are stacks and stacks of Polk and Klipsch, and Zu, and Boston Acoustics, clearly indicated in the photos.

Polk and Klipsch together probably sell more modern day tower speakers than all of the other manufacturer's of tower speakers combined.

I have more experience with brands other than these.

Modern day tower speakers are primarily designed and sold for HT applications. They are designed to sound their best with SS amps and they do.

Repeating what I did post for a 2nd time.

I never made the statement that it held true with ALL tower speakers

Consider you comment.

I never said that, did I? What I did say is...

Most speakers for the 70's forward were used and designed to be used with SS amps.

With those speakers, tubes bring little to the party.

Either purchase "audiophile" speakers that were designed to be used with tube amplifier's or use a good SS amp.

Many forum members have and use SS amps to drive their speakers.

Just switching out a ss amp with a tube amp is not necessarily going to give anyone the benefits of tube goodness.

I say this as a very pro tube amp individual.

Run you speakers with any type or class of amps that you wish.

There are those here that use powerful class "D" amplifiers and fee that that these powerful SS amps work best with their speakers.

I have class "D" amps also.

 

Ok, my apologies to you for not recognizing your other tower speakers. So I will hand the point to you that you have more varied experience in this department than I gave you credit for.

And yes I agree that virtually all speakers from the 70s on were designed with SS amps driving them. However where we disagree is that I have found that many modern speakers can be made to sound glorious with tube amplification, even if they were originally designed for use with SS amps.

Anyways, I think that beyond this point that we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

I love my tube amps. Only downside is when the air conditioner kicks in the bias on the four EL34 tubes goes off a bit. It'd be nice if these expensive amps had a regulated B+ supply. Everything else being equal the Cantabile tube amp is slightly more transparent sounding than my B&K ST2020. The Cantabile is a fet front end and tube outputs. Made locally here in Milwaukee.

 

Tubes until the weather turns sour.

 

One of the best designed amps, the one that I use, is the Butler Audio TDB 5150 amp. With this amp all sources will benefit because this hybrid amp uses tube magic on the output stage as its sent to the speaker. Everything else in my system is SS.

I tried this amp after trying the AR PH3 phono preamp and it could not unseat my Aragon 47k with IPS.

Butler Audio

 

Yes, that something is another person to help you move it!

 

No. I'm not prejudiced about solid state, used it happily for some time, but since the mid-nineties I've been tube all the way. I grew up with my Dad's Dynaco systems and I just prefer the sound. I've tried a few really good solid state and digital amps since. . . but none sounds better. I have two all tube systems.

 

I'm a combo girl myself.

SS amps with tube pre-amps.

The raw power of the SS amps combined with the glorious sound overlay of the tube pre-amps works extremely well in my listening space.

 

Oh, no...god no.

 

I'm conflicted between my MC30s and MC2105. With an MC2255 on the way. It all sounds good, so I'm not firmly in one camp or the other.

 

I quit tubes on my system only for the bottom end. My system is bi-amped with tubes on the top end, SS on the bottom end. SS for bass is tighter (punchier), and you don't get those annoying occasional weird spikes of pops that happen with tubes on the bottom end.

 

Tubes remind me of eyeglasses I have owned in my life.
Way back in the 50s and 60s glasses were made of fine quality high grade optical GLASS.
My vision was sharp as a tack with glass.
THEN they moved to PLASTIC lenses to cut the weight and make them "more comfortable."
Vision quality went out the window.
Does any high end camera company put PLASTIC lenses in their cameras?Nope.

Tubes are like that.
They are a pain, need maintenance, burn out, hum...etc etc.

But in general they CAN offer a clearer more musical picture of what is going on.
You just have to decide if they match your speakers, are worth the hassle and all the rest that has been written about them over and over...
It's YOUR choice.

 

I own both and switch back and forth based on mood and music choice.

 

Component matching is key! I used to be a sealed cabinet die-hard until I started using tubes about 15 years ago. I am pretty much stuck with (but very happy with!) bass reflex high efficiency speakers. Like the better Cerwin and Altec models.

 

I urge you to remember that I didn't say that they could not. Just that with the majority of them, it won't make that great of a discernible difference.

The importance of this is important to someone reading this who is getting all jazzed up reading about all those wonderful tube amps and is thinking on upgrading from SS to tube.

This is a lot like reading about how great sounding analog vinyl sounds. Well it only sounds "great" when you have a more than moderately priced turntable, a phono cartridge costing several hundred dollars, a phono preamp costing several hundred dollars more AND a high quality vinyl recording to start of with.

The most inexpensive digital system today is far batter sounding than a mediocre vinyl rig. It is one of those things where you either go big or go home. If you don't make the complete minimum investment that is necessary, then there is little point in bothering with vinyl.

For the unacquainted, getting into tubes requires a substantial investment. Better no tubes than poor tubes. It cost a lot more money to produce a quality tube amplifier, than a similar quality SS amp.

Any tube newbe considering moving over to tubes, make sure you demo the tube amp with YOUR speakers to see if they are going to be a worthwhile investment.

For most people with modern speakers (produced after 1970), you may be better off staying with SS and spending you upgrade dollars on something that is going to be a genuine upgrade to your present system.

 

I have a Line Magnetic 211IA amp that I really like. Sounds great, looks great, built to last.

But I've concluded that I prefer the sound of my old Rega Brio-R. At least with the speakers I'm using now. (Tannoy XT8F)

So the LM is sitting unused. I like it too much to want to sell it. Maybe it's time to put together a bedroom system.

 

No sir. Tubes are my life. The only time I use solid state is for my mixing board and home listening, reel to reels, unless it’s my TEAC A3340S or Akai X201D for home listening, are tube. If it’s a solid state reel to reel recorder, I run it through a tube preamp before the sound comes to the tape recorder, and out of it for playback. I like my Roberts 455, which is a tube, 3 motor, reel to reel deck with solid state playback amp (ugh.) Getting in another tube deck for studio use, Akai 1710W. Believe it or not, these little Akai/Roberts tube decks kick butt in a small recording studio.
Ryan

 

I didn't quit tubes because of the sound, but now that I'm running class D components. I won't be going back (said he).

M~