Are the 2011 Pink Floyd Remasters considered 'definitive'?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by AnyColourYouLike, Oct 13, 2011.

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  1. robertawillisjr

    robertawillisjr Music Lover

    Location:
    Hampton, VA
    I would like to know this also. In some ways I like this better than DSOTM and WYWH.
     
  2. kevin5brown

    kevin5brown Analog or bust.

    :wave:
     
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  3. th0m

    th0m Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    I'm not a huge PF fan, and the only albums I really care about is Meddle, TDSOTM, WYWH, Animals and The Wall. On the other hand I've listened to a LOT of versions of these five and the only case where I don't find the 2011 remaster to be the greatest is The Wall, of which I prefer the old Harvest releases (I know there's a ton of them, but everyone I've heard so far has been great).
     
  4. bonjo

    bonjo Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    Here we go again. What exactly is wrong with it? Who knows? Who cares! It sucks!

    And no I don't expect therockman to actually back up his comments with real world examples of what's wrong. Even though that should be extremely easy since the 2011 is absolute rubbish. He won't do it, he can't do it, and he's wrong anyway.

    This place is so stupid sometimes it make my head hurt.
     
  5. The Hud

    The Hud Breath of the Kingdom, Tears of the Wild

    To me, they are the best cd versions, but I prefer my sacds of DSOTM and WYWH.
     
  6. Raf

    Raf Senior Member

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    The thread title and the poll question are entirely different things.
     
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  7. Norm Apter

    Norm Apter Well-Known Member In Memoriam

    Location:
    Worcester, MA
    Definitive?.... that's tough to say. But the following 2011 issues are might fine (and better than the Sax remasters to these ears):

    Saucerful of Secrets
    Atom Heart Mother
    Obscured by Clouds
    Wish You Were Here
    (SACD)
    Animals

    I also like sound of The Wall but the 2011 remaster is the only version I own (one of my least favorite Floyd albums along with The Final Cut).

    Finally, I also purchased The Division Bell, but still haven't gotten around to removing the shrinkwrap to compare it to the 1994 original.
     
  8. Doctor Flang

    Doctor Flang Forum Resident

    Location:
    Helsinki, Finland
    In my opinion The Wall is too bassy, making it sound bloated. I personally like the previous remaster, and the one before that - better. But no, it's not "absolute rubbish" at all.

    From the new remasters i like the following:
    -Saucerful of Secrets
    -Meddle
    -Obscured by Clouds
    -Wish You Were Here
    -Animals
     
  9. whaiyun

    whaiyun Forum Resident

    Location:
    Windsor/Detroit
    Listened to WYWH the other night. Wow. It is good.
    Most of PF's music requires really clean vinyl. If it's dirty or scratched, it really ruins the experience.
     
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  10. Motoman

    Motoman New Member

    One factor that appears to be overlooked in comparing versions is the quality of the audio equipment on which it is played. My system, which I modestly consider to be relatively "high end," exposes the subtleties of imaging, sound stage, punch of the low end, etc. Other systems may not expose those subtleties and skew an opinion one way or another. In DSOTM, I actually like some aspects of the 2011 remaster, and wish some things had been done a little better. However, it seems to have a more "black" background, against which the music is arrayed. Very subjective, I guess. On the other hand, I really enjoyed the 5.1 DTS version, which to me brought out amazing detail that had originally been crammed into 2 channels. Not a purist's version, as it is 5.1, but a very interesting example of what can be done with good remastering of the source material!
     
  11. SeventhTime

    SeventhTime Well-Known Member

    I have the 1986 Pressing (same catalogue number as the original black triangle), from 1986. I think it sounds great, I am thinking its just the first pressing minus pre-emphasis and volume shifted, yes?
     
  12. SeventhTime

    SeventhTime Well-Known Member

    I have a converted SACD to PCM of WYWH, would this be considered better than the holy grail black triangle 2 track?
     
  13. The Hud

    The Hud Breath of the Kingdom, Tears of the Wild

    I wouldn't know, I have never heard the 2 track version. I am sure someone around here has heard both.
     
  14. HiFi Guy 008

    HiFi Guy 008 Forum Resident

    Location:
    New England
    Unless you're going to limit voting to people who have heard multiple versions of each release, and have all of the 2011 remasters, this poll is radically skewed.

    I don't have all of the 2011 remasters.
    But I prefer the 2011 Animals - and I've heard just about every cd mastering of Animals.
    This is, by far, the one.
     
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  15. grandegi

    grandegi Blind test maniac

    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    On this board we recently made blind tests on DSOTM, WYWH and Animals. The 2011 release of Animals was the clear winner amongst the different versions of that album. The winner for DSOTM was the Sax remaster (I prefer the Sony japanese mastering), the winner for WYWH was the SBM Mastersound mastering (I prefer the EMI Sonopress mastering). Personally, I think the 2011 Discovery versions of both DSOTM and WYWH are nice, smooth, well balanced, still not THE definitive versions of those albums; the 2011 version of Animals is not totally convincing to me, but I admit it's clearly the best for the vast majority of listeners. Ears and equipment matter though: the concept of "best sounding version" is far from being absolute.

    P.S. A blind test on The Final Cut is currently going on.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
    Billy Infinity and HiFi Guy 008 like this.
  16. SeventhTime

    SeventhTime Well-Known Member

    Interesting the lauded black triangle versions didn't win any of the tests.

    I have heard the 2011 Animals is the best version and maybe the best of the 2011 set, the DSOTM and WYWH seem to have very wide ranging views of what is the best pressing.

    Funny thing is with so many different pressings it would seem there aren't many poor ones, from what I have personally heard and also read.
    I guess for a band which appeals so much to audiophiles they know they would get killed if they tried to compress anything too much.
     
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  17. Andersoncouncil

    Andersoncouncil Forum Resident

    Location:
    upstate NY
    Here's your answer. Buy the Oh by the Way box instead of the Discovery box. The best masters IMO are used for OBTW
     
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  18. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    I bought the 'Oh By the Way' box set about a year after it was released, and a few years after just getting into Pink Floyd. I had a few of the prior individual CDs(DSOTM-30th Anniversary SACD-that plays on a regular CD Player, so even though not getting the benefits of the SACD layer, the CD itself sound good, WYWH-I think it is a 1992-EMI Edition, but bought it at Circuit City back in the early 2000s, and bought the 40th Anniversary Edition-2-CD, Stereo/Mono & the 3-Disc Hardback Bookcase-why have all of their CDs been released in similar packages?).

    Anyways, I did not open the 'OBTW' Box Set thinking about sitting on it for awhile to see how it would increase in value, but I should open that Box Set up soon, just to see if I also the messed up printing on the 2nd Wall CD, that several other people received and were able to get replaced.

    When the 2011 Guthrie Remasters were released, I heard by most people, who bought either the individual CDs or the Discovery Box Set, that 'Animals' and 'Saucerful of Secrets' were by far the best those albums ever sounded on CD(although no idea if they also included editions from Japan). So hard for me to believe that those 2 albums sound better than the versions from the 'OBTW' Box Set. I think it was also mentioned by several people, that 'More', 'Atom Heart Mother, 'Meddle' & 'Obscured by Clouds' also sounded better than at least the prior 'OBTW' editions on CD. Not sure about 'Ummagumma'. I also did not see the need to but 'Pipers' in the 2011 Guthrie Remaster, since the 40th Edition(Stereo Version) sounds great to me, but if anyone thinks that the 2011 Pipers provides a quality sound even if just different, I might pick it up to complete my Collection.

    I never owned 'The Wall' prior to the 2011 Edition, as I had a copy burned for me by a person owning the Shine On Box Set, and thought it was too bloated and Waters dominated, but I was curious about the 'Experience' Edition, and have to admit that I found some of the alternate cuts interesting, and because I also wanted the 'Experience' Editions to DSOTM' & 'WYWH', I never intended to buy the Discovery Box Set, as it would not provide those editions. Since, I found 'The Wall' too bloated and heard that 'The Final Cut' was leftover tracks from 'The Wall' it is the only Pink Floyd album that I do not own on CD(except in my unopened 'OBTW' Box Set), and if I ever do buy the 2011 Edition for 'The Final Cut, it will be more for a Completist perspective, but will listen to it several times on YouTube first before making the decision to buy it(same for 'Amused to Death'-Waters Solo album that was just remastered- and I am not all anti-Waters, as 'Animals' still ranks in my top 3 PF albums, and Waters was the main writer for those songs, although Gilmour still contributed more there than on 'The Wall'. Actually, Waters wrote one of my favorite PF songs, 'The Embryo'-although it is only a great song, as the 10+ minutes live version on the BBC Recordings, not the short version on 'Works').

    So back to your opinion, do you really think that the versions of at least 'Animals' & 'Saucerful of Secrets' sound better on the 'OBTW' Box Set, or have you just not heard the 2011 Guthrie Versions to make a fair comparison? I did hear that the Japan Version of the 'OBTW' Box Set had a better sound, and wish I wold have known about it at the time, but seems to be very expensive now on the secondary market. Although, I was interested in the Mini Vinyl Replica CDs for this Set, even though I have yet to open it, probably at the point, that I will just keep it, as the value has not seemed to increase too much overall, and worth just keeping now. Or I can swap in the better 2011 CDs in the Mini Vinyl Packaging and have the best of both worlds(Packaging & Sound Quality).

    Out of all my 2011 Guthrie CDs, I probably play the Live CD on 'UmmaGumma' the most, but those 4 Live Songs are the Ultimate Pink Floyd Sound to me, as it represents all 5 Members within those 4 Songs, even though 'Echoes' is most likely my favorite PF song, as I love the Space-Rock Sound, and that would have been a perfect addition to the Live CD on 'Ummagumma' along with 'Interstellar Overdrive', 'The Embryo', 'One of These Days' & 'Atom Heart Mother'(with live orchestra) & maybe include 'Remember that Day' from the 'SOS' album.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2015
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  19. grandegi

    grandegi Blind test maniac

    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    This is highly debatable. The Oh By The Way box set is actually "hit and miss", in my opinion.
    Some examples. A Saucerful Of Secrets has an edit in Set The Controls and sounds muddy throughout, it's generally considered much inferior to the Sax remaster and the 2011 remaster. Dark Side Of The Moon is the Guthrie 2003, that's usually considered to be one of the worst masterings of that album. Animals has the European mastering ("muffled" on some equipments) which some people like but that's usually considered inferior to the other 3 available masterings, whilst the 2011 mastering is considered the best by the majority of people.
    But it's not all that grey. The masterings of Meddle and Wish You Were Here are highly regarded instead, the former being the original Japanese mastering and the latter being a level-shifted version of the "EMI Sonopress" mastering.
    In my humble opinion, globally speaking the Discovery box set is much more worth having than the Oh By The Way box set.
     
  20. Meddle

    Meddle Forum Resident

    Location:
    waxahachie TX USA
    All of them
     
  21. sathvyre

    sathvyre formerly known as ABBAmaniac

    Location:
    Europe
    The edit in "Set The Controls For The Heart Of The Sun" seems to be on the original mastertape I think. I own several pressings of the album, for example a UK Parlophone (-3 / -3) and a german first pressing on the Odeon label and it's on both versions.
     
  22. PH416156

    PH416156 Alea Iacta Est

    Location:
    Europe
    Another nice test indeed; link here for those interested.
     
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  23. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident

    Location:
    Poland
    Guys like that do not understand how subjective sound esxpirience is and for each pair of ears completly different masterings may sound "best". I think the 2011 CDs may be considered definitive in the way that they are newest masterings and accepted by band members as "best". I heard most of them and all sound fine for me (although i don't have super high end set). In fact for me music matters more than sound. If the music is beautiful the listening experience will be pleasant regardless of mastering/version/source :)
     
  24. c-eling

    c-eling They're made of light,We never would have guessed

    Um, not necessarily :sigh: I find no enjoyment whatsoever from this horrid remaster
    As for Floyd 2011's not a fan, something seemed off on them... For my tastes however :)
    [​IMG]
     
  25. Rael

    Rael Forum Resident

    Location:
    Poland
    Well I can enjoy good music even played from cellphone speaker :D My main point was, however, that it is totally subjective when it comes to "preffered version"
     
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