AT-VMN95ML keeps collecting crud no matter what

Hey all, long time/first time.

I upgraded my needle to an AT-VMN95ML a few months back and immediately heard the difference. It sounded incredible! I took care of it, cleaned the needle with the Zerodust and a gentle brush, cleaned my records with a Discwasher before playing them (really dirty ones go in the SpinClean), always put the dust cover down, etc etc etc. Two months later, totally out of nowhere, the thing started sounding muffled. Cleaned it over and over to no avail, took a look with a magnifying glass and could barely make out the shape of the needle.

I figured I must have done something to it by accident, maybe cleaned it too hard or something, so I ordered another one, tried to be gentler with the cleaning, and added MoFi stylus cleaner into the mix every few days. But about a month later, the same thing happened.

What is going on here?? I know the needle is notorious for scooping up dust from the grooves, but with regular cleaning and good record care this shouldn't be an issue.

 

Havnt had this issue, yet. Does the stylus look clean? Do you remove the stylus assembly at all?

Im also curious what MFSL cleaner you got and why not the manufacturer recommend AT cleaner?

 

It might be your cleaner or some very tiny residue coming off the Zerodust that's clinging to small bits of dust balling it up over time. Maybe even some stuff in the grooves that somehow didn't get cleaned out.

My VM95ML is clean and all I do is lightly brush it after a record or every two sides. No cleaner, just a Magic eraser every once in a while.

 

My VM95ML would dredge my records that weren't clean. It would actually leave tracks of debris in it's wake after playing a side. My stylus never needed more than a dab to the Zerodust to keep it clean. I guess I'd be suspicious of the stylus cleaner you're using? Have you ever washed your Zerodust?

 

A spin clean is better than nothing but will never get your records completely clean. This is especially true if you clean large amounts of records in one batch of solution.

The reason the stylus is dredging up filth is because your records are full of dust and dirt.

 

The needle looks dirty as hell, and nothing I do will get it clean. And it's not a gradual process, it stays perfectly clean until suddenly it just starts collecting schmutz. I clean the Zerodust regularly, so it isn't that, and was using it after every record, sometimes every side. And I'm sorry, but there's no way the needle will only stay usable if you shell out for a VPI - there has to be something else at play here.

 

Well, if its visibly dirty that is no good. The first issue is being able to clean that off the stylus.

The second issue is figuring out why its getting dirty so often. It doesnt mean you have to buy a VPI, even RCMs dont do the job on their own, its also about the method of it all. I had a friend with the new Project RCM and I took one of his records home once. After a minute of play I checked the stylus because I was hearing some noise, but there was no stylus to be seen, only a glob of muck. Even with the Project, his methods left a lot to be desired, it made his records dirtier if anything.
So maybe go over all the steps in detail with us.

 

Weird.

Some used records are absolutely full of crap, and some new ones are surprisingly the same way, for different reasons. Are you playing mostly old LPs or new?

 

Nothing seems to work to get the stylus clean - dry stylus brush, Zerodust, MoFi LP#9. Any other suggestions?

Dirty records go in the SpinClean after every few plays, or if they seem particularly dirty. I never clean more than 30 records in one go there. Before most plays, I use the Discwasher brush on the record, play it, and then use a dry brush on the record and dip the needle on the Zerodust at the end of the side. It seems like something is making the needle sticky - could it be the Discwasher cleaning fluid? Or the Zerodust, somehow?

 

Mostly old records, but I clean them thoroughly. But even if there's some dust left that collects on the needle, it shouldn't be this hard to remove.

 

I use a carbon fiber stylus brush with a couple drops of uncut alcohol on it. Cleans the stylus superbly.

To clean my records, I use uncut alcohol on an Audio Technica 6012 pad or equivalent. I do this on a lazy Susan.

It can take 2-3 cleaning/playing iterations but eventually even stubborn records cannot resist the method. Only records with hardwater deposits (from previous owners cleaning them with tap water I suspect) require additional attention.

I rarely get anything on my stylus. Mostly when playing vinyl that belongs to someone else.

 

I had the same problem with my ML stylus. Magic eraser was the only thing that got it clean. At one point I had to get the needle wet with stylus cleanr, then drop it on the magic eraser several times. But it did finally clean it to a tee!
I then realized I had to change my record cleaning process.
Added to my spin clean was a KAB vaccum system with my own vaccum.
That was my ticket to my stylus "staying" clean.
Well that and I still use the magic eraser every 4-5 record sides i play.

 

You should stop any wet cleaning. At this point i'd carefully try a dab of alcohol on a stiffer stylus brush and see if that cleans if off. After that, try using the stiffer stylus brush with one or 2 pulls after EACH side on the stylus.

Then consider a better record cleaner.

 

Maybe some Green Paper Stylus Cleaner?

Well thats a bit unusual, to clean an LP every few plays, once should be enough.
So you are using the Discwasher fluid after the LP has been cleaned? That is a big red flag right there. If you put something on like fluid after every play or so, and you dont get it all off, it will naturally start to accumulate.

 

FWIW, I own a couple of the VM95ML carts installed on two tables. I don't have a record cleaning machines. I wet preen my albums with an AT6012 or one of two vintage Parastat brushes. I use a mist of 99% alcohol and distilled water with a ratio of about 75/25 spraying the leading edge of whichever brush I'm using and preen the record with a rolling motion of wet to dry.

I use a dry stylus brush after most sides. Many of my albums go back to the 60's and I've owned them since new. When I clean a stylus, I use straight 99% alcohol regardless of what some audiophile wags might say. I had two old Stanton carts that came with some turntables bought some years ago. A few weeks ago, I inspected the stylus (Stanton made) with a 10x loupe and could see how cruded up they were. A few dips with a Magic Eraser didn't do the trick but a stylus brush slightly wetted with alcohol did and both styli look lovely now. More importantly, they both sound good.

The OP's problem is interesting. Tracking force issues? Really grunged up records? I have not seen this issue with my 95ML styli.

 

Inspecting styli under a microscope after cleaning with soft brushes, several manufacturers have found (as did I) that this does clean the crud off the stylus.

The first two minutes of this video is a good watch regardless of which turntable, arm and cartridge you use. I used the Linn "green paper" for 20 odd years alongside an Audio Technica AT637, used dry. It works.

 

I wonder why in that video they say to not use the liquid with the ultrasonic stylus cleaner, directly after saying to follow the directions by the manufacturer of it: which states to use one drop on the contact pad...

A very thin wisp of Magic Eraser would seem to be as effective as the green paper, although I don't know about the polishing aspect.

 

As Green Paper is effectively sandpaper I doubt the Eraser does as good a job.

 

You can get a manual vac based rcm for 200 dollars or less. Having been through most of the other cleaning methods, I think they're a waste of time.

Get a 30x loupe and inspect the stylus carefully to see what's on it. Microfiber and other crap people like to use will shed fibers that wrap around advanced styli and cause the tip to become caked with crap. When that happens the only way to remove it is very carefully with a plastic toothpick. Then you can take whatever is shedding the fibers and throw it in the trash.

 

That's absolutely what I'm seeing under a magnifying glass - little fibers that won't come off the needle. How does one get them off with a toothpick?

 

I think he’s correct. When this continues to occur, as it once happened to me, I found out my records needed rinsed. The cleaner loosened the debris in the groves, but there was so much dirt that I needed a stronger more powerful rinse. Not only was debris on the stylus, but some had prob fallen off the stylus and lined some of the groves.

So, after cleaning I held the records over my kitchen sink and used the spray to rinse them. I found with the spray I could more easily control direction.

After that “power” rinse, I then rinse again with distilled water that I put in a spray bottle. I saturate the record protecting the label as best as poss. I then dry them.

This process have given me decent success with both the new and used vinyl I purchase. Very little if any debris us picked up by the stylus.

 

When I started cleaning records with only a Spin Clean, I got lots of crackle and pops, and my styluses become gucked up quite often. I do remember a few times that it felt like the tip would never become clean. One the positive side, eventually your needle will clean out the record. But at the expense of a prematurely worn needle and record groove, and quite a few unacceptably noisy plays.

What many of us suspect is that the Spin Clean does a really good job of getting dirt and grime and dust off the groove walls - but without some method of really getting the dirt solution out of the grooves, it just settles back on another part of the groove wall, and dries there.

Since I have started vacuum drying my records, after a Spin Cleaning, with a crevice tool covered with a soft microfibre cloth attached with a rubber band, on my wet/dry shop vac, records are almost as silent as they can be, and my needles rarely get "gucked up" like they used to (they can still grab airborn dust that lands on my record - I don't generally use my inconvenient dust covers).

Have you tried lowering your stylus onto a tiny, featherweight bit f Blutac? That was a good method of getting stubborn guck that seemed baked onto my needles.

 

As been said before, you need to add a vacuum step to your spin clean regimen. It doesn't have to cost much, buy a cheap dry/wet shop vac and make some adaptions to the mouth. Search online how to adapt a shopvac for record vacuuming.
Had the same experience with a 540ML, before I started to vacuum off my records. I was just wet cleaning them and air dry or microfibre dry them. Crud and stuff everywhere even after one or two songs of an album. After using the vacuum method, clean as a whistle !

 

If they are wrapped around the diamond like a donut, you'll have to carefully pry the donut off with a plastic toothpick. Start at the base of the diamond and move towards the tip. You have to be extremely careful when you do this.

Once you are done find the source of those shedding fibers and keep that away from your records.

 

Fancy cut diamonds like a MicroLine or Shibata seem to grab way more guck than conical stylus, just FYI.