ATLANTIC / ATCO vinyl labels and deadwax - what do the codes mean?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by TLMusic, May 5, 2012.

  1. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    W.B. is the deadwax and label typography genius.
     
  2. All Rights

    All Rights Senior Member

    Credit: It should be noted that that website also contains information contributed by WB.
     
  3. All Rights

    All Rights Senior Member

    Dont forget for the label codes, RS-Rolling Stones Records (1971-1984)
    and plant codes, BW-Bestway Plastics, Mountainside NJ and SO-Southern Plastics, Nashville TN which still operates today as United Record Pressing.

    See above.
     
  4. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    The SO suffix in this context would actually be Sonic Recording Products in Holbrook, NY, which pressed a handful of Sticky Fingers copies at the point of original release.
     
    McLover likes this.
  5. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    UPDATED SUMMARY

    LABELS

    Record company codes (the letters after "ST")

    A = Atlantic Records
    C = Atco
    CAP = Capricorn
    CT = Cotillion
    FC = Famous Charisma
    SS = Swan Song
    AS = Asylum
    MC = Manticore
    RS = Rolling Stones Records


    Pressing plant codes for LPs:

    PR = Presswell Records Mfg. Co., Ancora, NJ (they handled most of Atlantic's LP's during much of this period)
    LY = Shelley Products, Huntington Station, NY
    SP = Specialty Records Corp., Olyphant, PA
    MO = Monarch Record Mfg. Co., Los Angeles, CA
    PL = Plastic Products, Inc., Memphis, TN
    RI = Philips Recording Co., Richmond, IN
    AR = Allied Record Co., Inc., Los Angeles, CA
    CT or CTH = Columbia, Terra Haute, IN
    CP = Columbia (Pitman, NJ)
    CS or CSM = Columbia (Santa Maria, CA; very infrequently)
    BW = Bestway Plastics, Mountainside NJ
    SO = Sonic Recording Products, Holbrook, N
    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division, Bloomfield, NJ (a brief period in late 1968)

    LP label example (Led Zeppelin I)
    ST-A-681461-MO

    ST = stereo
    A = Atlantic Records label
    68 = last two digits of the year Atlantic first received source (tape) and started working on mastering
    1461 = tape master number (for side one in this example)
    MO = Monarch Records pressing plant


    DEADWAX

    CUTTING LETTERS (following the tape master number in the deadwax):
    These letters indicate the lacquer cutting for that particular pressing, with A being the first, and B the second, and so on.

    An additional letter, always the same letter as the first cutting letter (but usually fainter) sometimes appears on Monarch pressings. Two additional letters, always the same letters as the first (usually fainter) may appear on RI pressings. These extra letters indicate an additional metal part made from the lacquer.

    Also on "AR" pressings, the cutting letter is replaced with a handwritten delta symbol.

    For some promotional cuts with different banding and mastering, the cutting letter is replaced by "DJ"

    OTHER SCRIBINGS IN THE DEADWAX

    AT = Mastered by/for Atlantic

    AT/GP (handwritten) = mastered by George Piros at Atlantic

    AT/DK (handwritten) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ATLANTIC STUDIOS DK (stamped) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ab = Abbey Record Mfg. Co.

    PR or PRC or (PR) = Philips Recording Co. (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    LW or LWP = LongWear Plating (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division in Bloomfield, NJ
    AMP = ABC-Paramount
    M = Mercury
    RCA = RCA Victor (on some contract pressings of Elvis' 1956 smash hits)

    Lastly, records made by Monarch will have a stamped circle with "MR" in it, and numbers preceded by a delta sign. As for numbers with the delta symbol on the deadwax - this apparently originated with the company that did plating on the West Coast (Alco Research & Engineering in Los Angeles), and their system was used by a host of L.A.-area plants including their own, plus Monarch and another plant called AFM Engineering.


    UNKNOWN DEADWAX CODES:

    RG
    REPL
    W (or is it M?) sometimes with dots near it.




    :wave: Again, many thanks to everyone who has contributed. Special thanks to W.B., who knows all the answers, it's brilliant!



    Everyone please feel free to make corrections and add information.
     
    whohadd, dee and marcfeld69 like this.
  6. motorcitydave

    motorcitydave Enlightened Rogue In Memoriam

    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV, USA
    Sounds accurate so far.
     
  7. James Glennon

    James Glennon Senior Member

    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    I'll hold back on the comments that W.B. is a genius until my above query is answered!

    JG
     
  8. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    Sounds like it could be an interlinked "AB" which was on some early to mid-1970's LP and 45 lacquers on such records as James Taylor's "You've Got a Friend" and many War records during their time on United Artists. Some have suggested that Crystal Sound on the West Coast may have been the mastering house, but I can't say one way or another.
     
  9. James Glennon

    James Glennon Senior Member

    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    Thanks for that W.B. I never knew of Crystal Sound, but now I do, as usual you come up trumps!

    JG
     
  10. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    Correction

    The label code for Cotillion is 'CTN'



    An example, a White Label DJ promo of ELP - Tarkus. Side one is banded for radio airplay.


    The 1841 Broadway side one label has
    ST-CTN-712253 SP

    meaning
    ST = stereo
    CTN = Cotillion Records
    71 = 1971, year when master tapes were received
    2253 = master tape number
    SP = record pressed at Specialty Records Corp.



    Deadwax side one:
    ST-CTN-712153-DJ
    (SRC stamped logo)
    ST-CTN-712253-DJ [this time the '2' is written over the letter '1']
    5-27-71

    meaning
    First series of numbers is probably a mistake
    The stamped 'SRC' logo means the record was pressed at Specialty Records Corp.
    ST = stereo
    CTN = Cotillion Records
    71 = 1971, year master was received
    2253 = master tape number
    DJ = special DJ cut
    5-27-71 = May 27, 1971 (what else could it be?)
     
  11. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    UPDATED Label and Deadwax codes

    LABELS

    Record company codes (the letters after "ST")

    A = Atlantic Records
    C = Atco
    CAP = Capricorn
    CTN = Cotillion Records
    FC = Famous Charisma
    SS = Swan Song
    AS = Asylum
    MC = Manticore
    RS = Rolling Stones Records


    Pressing plant codes for LPs:

    PR = Presswell Records Mfg. Co., Ancora, NJ (they handled most of Atlantic's LP's during much of this period)
    LY = Shelley Products, Huntington Station, NY
    SP = Specialty Records Corp., Olyphant, PA
    MO = Monarch Record Mfg. Co., Los Angeles, CA
    PL = Plastic Products, Inc., Memphis, TN
    RI = Philips Recording Co., Richmond, IN
    AR = Allied Record Co., Inc., Los Angeles, CA
    CT or CTH = Columbia, Terra Haute, IN
    CP = Columbia (Pitman, NJ)
    CS or CSM = Columbia (Santa Maria, CA; very infrequently)
    BW = Bestway Plastics, Mountainside NJ
    SO = Sonic Recording Products, Holbrook, N
    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division, Bloomfield, NJ (a brief period in late 1968)

    LP label example (Led Zeppelin I)
    ST-A-681461-MO

    ST = stereo
    A = Atlantic Records label
    68 = last two digits of the year Atlantic first received source (tape) and started working on mastering
    1461 = tape master number (for side one in this example)
    MO = Monarch Records pressing plant


    DEADWAX

    CUTTING LETTERS (following the tape master number in the deadwax):
    These letters indicate the lacquer cutting for that particular pressing, with A being the first, and B the second, and so on.

    An additional letter, always the same letter as the first cutting letter (but usually fainter) sometimes appears on Monarch pressings. Two additional letters, always the same letters as the first (usually fainter) may appear on RI pressings. These extra letters indicate an additional metal part made from the lacquer.

    Also, on "AR" pressings, the cutting letter is replaced with a handwritten delta symbol.

    For some promotional cuts with different banding and mastering, the cutting letter is replaced by "DJ"

    OTHER SCRIBINGS IN THE DEADWAX

    AT = Mastered by/for Atlantic

    AT/GP (handwritten) = mastered by George Piros at Atlantic

    AT/DK (handwritten) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ATLANTIC STUDIOS DK (stamped) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ab = Abbey Record Mfg. Co. (? we still don't know the exact meaning)

    PR or PRC or (PR) = Philips Recording Co. (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    LW or LWP = LongWear Plating (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division in Bloomfield, NJ
    AMP = ABC-Paramount
    M = Mercury
    RCA = RCA Victor (on some contract pressings of Elvis' 1956 smash hits)

    Records pressed by Specialty Records Corp. will have a stamped logo in the deadwax, consisting of a 'R' and 'C' intertwined in a larger letter 'S'

    Lastly, records made by Monarch will have a stamped circle with "MR" in it, and numbers preceded by a delta sign. As for numbers with the delta symbol on the deadwax - this apparently originated with the company that did plating on the West Coast (Alco Research & Engineering in Los Angeles), and their system was used by a host of L.A.-area plants including their own, plus Monarch and another plant called AFM Engineering.


    UNKNOWN DEADWAX CODES:

    RG
    REPL
    W sometimes with dots near it.




    :wave: Again, many thanks to everyone who has contributed. More special thanks to W.B., who knows all the answers, it's brilliant!



    Everyone please feel free to make corrections and add information.
     
    Brian Tomala likes this.
  12. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    In the first place, the "CTN" was the code on albums; the matrix prefix on Cotillion 45's was "CO" (i.e. my Specialty-pressed copy of Brook Benton's "Rainy Night in Georgia," 45-44057, was matrixed CO-18173 SP as indicated on the label). Secondly, the "5-27-71" was apparently the date the record was either plated at Specialty, or the date they received the lacquer from the mastering studio (there was a time in the 1971-72 period when that plant wrote dates on the deadwax of many a lacquer, both on LP's and 45's; this practice apparently didn't last all that long).
     
  13. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    Wow! Thanks!:righton:
     
  14. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    UPDATED CORRECTIONS

    LABELS

    Record company codes (the letters after "ST")

    A = Atlantic Records
    C = Atco
    CAP = Capricorn
    CTN = Cotillion Records LPs
    CO = Cotillion Records 45s
    FC = Famous Charisma
    SS = Swan Song
    AS = Asylum
    MC = Manticore
    RS = Rolling Stones Records


    Pressing plant codes for LPs:

    PR = Presswell Records Mfg. Co., Ancora, NJ (they handled most of Atlantic's LP's during much of this period)
    LY = Shelley Products, Huntington Station, NY
    SP = Specialty Records Corp., Olyphant, PA
    MO = Monarch Record Mfg. Co., Los Angeles, CA
    PL = Plastic Products, Inc., Memphis, TN
    RI = Philips Recording Co., Richmond, IN
    AR = Allied Record Co., Inc., Los Angeles, CA
    CT or CTH = Columbia, Terra Haute, IN
    CP = Columbia (Pitman, NJ)
    CS or CSM = Columbia (Santa Maria, CA; very infrequently)
    BW = Bestway Plastics, Mountainside NJ
    SO = Sonic Recording Products, Holbrook, N
    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division, Bloomfield, NJ (a brief period in late 1968)

    LP label example (Led Zeppelin I)
    ST-A-681461-MO

    ST = stereo
    A = Atlantic Records label
    68 = last two digits of the year Atlantic first received source (tape) and started working on mastering
    1461 = tape master number (for side one in this example)
    MO = Monarch Records pressing plant


    DEADWAX

    CUTTING LETTERS (following the tape master number in the deadwax):
    These letters indicate the lacquer cutting for that particular pressing, with A being the first, and B the second, and so on.

    An additional letter, always the same letter as the first cutting letter (but usually fainter) sometimes appears on Monarch pressings. Two additional letters, always the same letters as the first (usually fainter) may appear on RI pressings. These extra letters indicate an additional metal part made from the lacquer.

    Also, on "AR" pressings, the cutting letter is replaced with a handwritten delta symbol.

    For some promotional cuts with different banding and mastering, the cutting letter is replaced by "DJ"

    OTHER SCRIBINGS IN THE DEADWAX

    AT = Mastered by/for Atlantic

    AT/GP (handwritten) = mastered by George Piros at Atlantic

    AT/DK (handwritten) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ATLANTIC STUDIOS DK (stamped) = mastered by Dennis King at Atlantic

    ab = Abbey Record Mfg. Co. (? we still don't know the exact meaning)

    PR or PRC or (PR) = Philips Recording Co. (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    LW or LWP = LongWear Plating (maker of metal parts from lacquers)

    MG = MGM Record Mfg. Division in Bloomfield, NJ
    AMP = ABC-Paramount
    M = Mercury
    RCA = RCA Victor (on some contract pressings of Elvis' 1956 smash hits)

    Records pressed by Specialty Records Corp. will have a stamped logo in the deadwax, consisting of a 'R' and 'C' intertwined in a larger letter 'S'. Also, records pressed at Specialty may contain a hand etched date in the deadwax. The date represents when the record was either plated at Specialty, or the date they received the lacquer from the mastering studio (there was a time in the 1971-72 period when that plant wrote dates on the deadwax of many a lacquer, both on LP's and 45's; this practice apparently didn't last all that long).

    Lastly, records made by Monarch will have a stamped circle with "MR" in it, and numbers preceded by a delta sign. As for numbers with the delta symbol on the deadwax - this apparently originated with the company that did plating on the West Coast (Alco Research & Engineering in Los Angeles), and their system was used by a host of L.A.-area plants including their own, plus Monarch and another plant called AFM Engineering.


    UNKNOWN DEADWAX CODES:

    RG
    REPL
    W sometimes with dots near it.







    Everyone please feel free to make corrections and add information.
     
    Brian Tomala and Giorgio like this.
  15. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    OK, a new question.

    What pressing plant is "FT"?


    I found a copy of Led Zeppelin IV with "FT" on the label as the pressing plant code. The deadwax has markings like a Monarch pressing, with a delta code and the "MR" in a circle stamp. I would expect it to have "MO" on the label instead of "FT".

    Anyone know?
     
  16. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    FT and F.T. ?

    Still wondering about the initials "FT". In addition to seeing "FT" on a label as the pressing plant code, I also found "F.T." in the deadwax of my Monarch pressed Physical Graffiti. In the deadwax "F.T." Is hand scribed on sides two and three.


    Who or what could "FT" be?
     
  17. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    My best advice would be to check vintage Billboard International Buyer's Guides of the 1960's / '70's period to check pressing plants in the L.A. area which would have initials that would correspond with "FT." I know that besides Monarch, there was Rainbo Records, Research Craft, H.V. Waddell, and AFM Engineering Corp., as well as the Cadet/Superior pressing plant (all of which had pressed LP's with a 2.875" diameter circular indent in the label area). AFM was distinguished by pressing 45's on vinyl with the same delta codes as on Monarch styrene pressings, only with Alco's insignia stamped on the deadwax rather than Monarch's "MR" logo. Unless, like Atlantic's code for Shelley Products being "LY," "FT" was a shorthand for Research Craft.

    I saw a Led Zeppelin II pressing from one of Decca's plants, with yet another code: DCE. I presume that would have been Gloversville, NY, but I'm not 100% sure.
     
  18. Stark

    Stark Member

    Location:
    Ontario
    First off, fantastic thread. I hope this can add some info to the mix...

    My 1841 Broadway, ELP "Pictures At An Exhibition" has the following info:

    Deadwax
    Side 1: ST-CTN-712415C AT/GP PR (SP)
    Side 2: ST-CTN-712416-C PR-SP-1

    Label
    Side 1: (ST-CTN-712415-SP)
    Side 2: (ST-CTN-712415-SP)

    I don't know if this is correct but it seems to read that Philips Recording Co. indicated on the plate that they were destined for Specialty Records Corp. with the "PR (SP)" and "PR-SP-1".

    Also interesting is one side is stated as being Piros and the other isn't, and the written code is different in the way each side deals with the "C" after the tape master number for each side. Each side handles the PR & Sp combination differently. Finally the handwriting on these two sides is different as well, especially the manner the "T" is written, GP's is a capital "T" whereas anonymous' is a lowercase "t". So we can assume side 2 was cut by a different person by the lack of initials, the different handwriting, and this different handling of the "C" designator and the PR & SP codes.

    Also, this "C" would represent 3rd plate cut?
     
  19. TLMusic

    TLMusic Musician & record collector Thread Starter

    What pressing plant is "ME"?

    I found a Crosby Stills Nash LP today. The inner sleeve looked to be from the mid 1970s. The labels had the suffix "ME" for the pressing plant indication. The label font was unlike any Atlantic LP I've seen.
     
  20. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    Actually, 'PR' was Presswell Records Mfg., not Philips / PRC whose pressings of Atlantic and affiliated product were distinguished by an -RI suffix (for Richmond, IN where the plant was located).
     
  21. Stark

    Stark Member

    Location:
    Ontario
    OK, but that is the complete opposite to this information listed above:

    confused as to which it actually is...
     
  22. W.B.

    W.B. The Collector's Collector

    Location:
    New York, NY, USA
    That would be only the deadwax; 'PR' on the labels was Presswell, while PRC pressings were shown on the labels as 'RI'. (However, 'PRC' was shown on labels of pressings of Elektra/Asylum product.)
     
  23. All Rights

    All Rights Senior Member

    A few forgotten record company label codes :
    VR-Virgin records early 1970s (Mike Oldfield) Virgin later switched from Atlantic to CBS and then back to Atlantic.
    VA -Virgin late 70 (XTC, The Motors, The Flying Lizards etc.) Not sure why they switched to VA, maybe it meant Virgin-Atlantic or Virgin-America
    VR- Virgin mid 80s (Steve Winwood, Paula Abdul)

    BT- Big Tree records Doug Morris' (current head of Sony Music) label which he followed to Atlantic from Ampex and Bell.
     
  24. Stark

    Stark Member

    Location:
    Ontario
    I was talking about the Deadwax 'PR' in that post you corrected me on actually. I stated the labels said SP for SP = Specialty Records Corp., Olyphant, PA.

    :)
     
  25. marcelrecords

    marcelrecords Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Netherlands
    At the moment there is a discussion on ''Discogs'', due to conflicting information.
    While this forum states Terra Haute to belong to ''CT'', another site says Bridgeport. See here:
    http://45-sleeves.com/USA/atco/atco-us.htm
    second grey bar from the top.
    Who is right? Is there anyone who knows for sure and can offer definitive arguments?
    Would be very much appreciated!
     

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