Audio Technica ART9 MC Cartridge- The Real Deal?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by avanti1960, Dec 26, 2016.

  1. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict ___The Enforcer___

    With that method, we turn a cartridge (the ART 9) that has an 18cu @100Hz dynamic compliance into a cartridge with 17cu @10Hz? Meaning now the 10Hz number is LESS than 100Hz number? See the problem?

    So if I don't like the numbers the conventional method gives, invent a new rule of thumb that makes the result better...... LOL gotta love the internet... I did a search on "cartridge static compliance divided by 2" and saw a few hits, so as always there is something out there for any case one wants to make.

    The "sliding scale" method of using a multiplier of 1.5 to 2.0 is also not perfect, and an estimation, but at least it doesn't result in the 10Hz number being less than the 100Hz number.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  2. 5-String

    5-String Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    I thought you liked the Blue more than the ART9, no?
     
  3. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Using the aux weight would increase the effective mass by a small amount, so the wisdom depends on what you are trying to accomplish.
     
  4. KlausK

    KlausK Member

    Location:
    Copenhagen
    I understand that I am already pushing the limits for traditional good behavior, so I guess that I will go for a little less effective mass. It definitely sounds terrific to me.
     
  5. Gibsonian

    Gibsonian Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa, USA
    Increasing the mass of the CW requires that you move the weight closer to the pivot to balance the arm and this decreases effective weight. Not increasing it.
     
  6. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Well, sure, but that's not what he asked about, the aux weight goes at end of arm.
     
  7. KlausK

    KlausK Member

    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Yes, it does
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  8. KlausK

    KlausK Member

    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Understood. The math used here is a simplified model that amongst other does not take damping, materials and surface treatments into account. And it is not exactly know how to convert compliance from 100 to 10 hz - it has to be measured. Not saying you are wrong at all - just saying it actually sounds really good and that the HIFI News test LP shows a verifiable outcome that seams ok.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2019
  9. Gibsonian

    Gibsonian Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa, USA
    So if aux weight is added you will have to move main weight towards pivot to balance the arm, correct?
     
  10. KlausK

    KlausK Member

    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Correct
     
  11. TheVinylAddict

    TheVinylAddict ___The Enforcer___

    LOL OK then.............. all the best. Not the first time I have seen the "real life" argument implying just throw away all the proven theory on compliance matching, with the argument being just trust me it sounds really good, or trust my measurements!

    I am sure you know what you are doing, but it doesn't change the fact that the ART9 is a high compliance cartridge and the SL-1200 is a medium mass tonearm. Cheers.
     
  12. Gibsonian

    Gibsonian Forum Resident

    Location:
    Iowa, USA
    Damping likely the key here to the fine sound on the mismatch of parts.
     
  13. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    Definition aside, did you find the Cadenza blue to have noticeable louder bass than the ART9? Thanks!
     
  14. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    yes but i miss some things the ART 9 does.
     
    5-String likes this.
  15. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    no. the opposite.
     
  16. bajaed

    bajaed Forum Resident

    I'm guessing you still think highly of the Art9's bang for the buck?

    How do you think it would do on a 9C arm?
     
  17. Thx1326

    Thx1326 New Member

    Location:
    Midwest USA
    I have a question for the experts: According to AT, the ARR9 wants to see an impedance of 100 ohms. My preamp has a phono input impedance of 47K ohms. I'm using an AT-650 step up transformer as the SUT. It has selectable impedance settings of 3, 20, 40 and "Pass Through" and a load impedence of 47K ohms.

    What would be the best setting for the SUT and how do these relate to the 100 ohm that the Art9 recommends.

    What would be the effects of the different settings on the SUT?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  18. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    The 100 is probably related to the use of a head amp or phono stage only not related to SUT. In my view with a SUT you have to match the closest setting or higher than the cartridge coil's resistance, not sure what the ART9 is. However nothing is set in stone and you might find that for some records it helps to use a diferent setting. In my Denon SUT a higher resistance (40) means less bass but much more precise and more high end with more detail. In the lower setting (3 I think) the bass seem to be much more loose, louder and the high end is a tiny bit more subdue but it works better on some records.
     
  19. Davey

    Davey very clever with maracas

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Actually, AT specs the recommended load at a minimum of 100 ohm. If you want to load the cartridge close to 100 ohms, then you would use the 3 setting, which has a gain of 20, so the load would be around 47K divided by 400. I'd probably go with the 20 setting with a gain of 8 and a load around 700 ohms. Depends on your phono preamp to a certain extent, you want to stay well under the input overload margin.
     
  20. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    the 9C's effective mass of 11g will be a good match for the ART9. my old VPI had an 11g effective mass tonearm and the ART9 sounded incredible on it. expect it to sound a little on the rich side yet fully detailed and transparent.
     
    HiFi Guy likes this.
  21. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    your SUT was designed for AT's range of moving coil cartidges with .4mv output, e.g. the AT33E. those cartridges had internal coil impedances of 10-17 ohms and the ART9 is 12 ohms~
    the ART9 has a slightly higher output (.5mv vs. .4mv) but this should not matter. basically the ART9 is a derivitive of the AT cartridges that your SUT was designed for. pick the input impedance that sounds the best.
     
    HiFi Guy likes this.
  22. wbass

    wbass Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    I've got an ART-9 coming my way. Taking a chance on a gently used (or so I hope) cart, from a dealer. I'll be running it on an SL-1200GR. Right now I've got a Graham Slee Era Gold V (MM only) phono pre. Considering either a SUT or a new phono stage and curious what folks are using.

    I see a poster above is using an AT-650 SUT....

    I'm also considering adding a DL103R at some point, so something that can do double duty would be interesting. Very intrigued by SUTs, but, truthfully, still learning about the science (or art) of matching/loading.
     
  23. gillcup

    gillcup Senior Member

    Location:
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    I got an ART9 last week and have been using it on my Pioneer PLX-1000 and I'm very happy with the results. It's still too early to make a definitive statement, but I feel like this cartridge is doing everything right and nothing wrong. I'm hearing no IGD, plenty of detail and great soundstage.
     
    Heckto35 and avanti1960 like this.
  24. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    I've been tempted to play the SUT game but haven't found a need to and the results seem to be mixed. Not sure what your budget is but the Art 9 sounded excellent running through the Lehmann Black Cube SE II.
     
    wbass likes this.
  25. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    soundstage is one thing it does very well. you should try it with a tube amp! but the biggest thing it does well IMHO is deliver a rich, highly refined, completely clean sound that never offends the senses- plus some kick ass bass!
     
    plastico, gillcup and 5-String like this.

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