Audio-Technica launches new entry-level VM95 cartridge series

On my JVC it hit 90um with a very tiny amount of buzzing. I haven't tested it on my 1200. HFW tested 90um as the threshold for tracking (before losing groove contact) as well.

 

Oh good grief, you're missing my point.

My point is, some people are confused because the higher price commanded for Shibata styli implies superior design/performance, when the more likely explanation is one of licensing.

"Shibata" is a registered trademark. Trademarks never expire. If you want to make identical styli and call them something else (LPGear's Vivid Line), no problem. If you want to call it "Shibata," you have to pony-up to JVC or their suppliers.

Victor Company of Japan, Limited Trademarks :: Justia Trademarks
SHIBATA

Filed: May 2, 1974
DIAMOND STYLUS SOLD AS A COMPONENT PART OF A STEREO CARTRIDGE
Owned by: Victor Company of Japan, Limited
Serial Number: 73020446​

I have and use them all. I like my Shibata styli. I actually like most a 4x7 elliptical or 7 conical.

 

Which Shibata we be talking about? There are two of them, at least. Or does it matter? The Jico version is nearly impossible to see the facets even under an m'scope, whereas the facets on an original AT 15SA can be seen with the naked eye. There has to be some difference in sound if the visual is so strikingly different. One would think...?

 

Do you know the radii of the AT15SA?

The shape offered by LP Gear is the 6 x 75um, which is the "larger."

Though I can't see the facets w/o a scope and even then I have a crappy scope, so it isn't easy.

 

I don't know how this topic came up here, but Jico Shibatas (and a lot of the "Vivid Lines" LPG sells) are almost always bonded while current production AT are nude diamonds.

 

I have three AT450 carts (universal mount but were bought for my Technics SL-QL1) that were made years ago but purchased for their nude elliptical stylus. So it's not just current AT carts that offered this feature.

 

Right, AT has always offered some nude styli. Many years ago they did have some bonded line contact models but we are talking a LONG time ago, so I have no idea how the Jico bonded stylus conversation got muddled into this thread.

 

Yep, but I don't think I can see without magnification the facets of any Shibata, nude or otherwise.

Not doubting others can see. Maybe I never really tried.

Oh and the topic came up because some were suggesting 95SH over 95ML, and a tangent erupted.

 

Nude or bonded doesn't matter (for this discussion) as the tip geometry that contacts the groove wall is always diamond.

Yeah, sorry about that. There are 2 Shibata cuts but only one is mostly used now, so I guess the Jico and the current AT use the same one. The earlier type has a larger bearing radius. I brought it up because people here are saying the Shibata is warmer than Microline, which is opposite to my experience, largely due to the more radical cuts on the earlier AT cartridges I have. I finds these shine a spotlight in the upper mids, lending a bite to brasses that initially sounds very exciting.

More reading here.

 

Ciao Danilo!

As you have a Project Tube Box DS2 I'm curious if you can really hear a difference when switching from 100pf to 320pf.

I think you can switch it while spinning a record, can't you?

I bought a new Marantz PM 6006 two month ago. The EU version has most likely 440pf (US most likely 220pf) capacity.

I switched from my Art Dj Pre II (100pf or 200pf setting) to the phono stage of my new Marantz and could not hear a difference between 100pf and 440pf. That's still a mystery to me because before I had the AT-VM95ML I used for over a year a Nagaoka MP 110 and the difference there with my sold Pioneer A-30 (also 440pf) was obvious: with 440pf it sounded bright and harsh.

Bye Andrea

 

Who makes a 4X7 elliptical except Nagaoka?

 

The MP-110 has significantly higher inductance than the VM95 series, so it's going to be affected by capacitance a bit differently. Below I have pasted a chart of an electrical model which shows each cart at a different load and what the electrical peak would be.

This doesn't take into account mechanical resonance of the cantilever + stylus assembly, so the actual peak at each load may be different - likely further down into the audible band.

To know the actual frequency response we would need to a take a measurement using a test LP with an accurate frequency sweep.

It is also important to note that depending on where one's hearing maxes out in the high frequencies (this diminishes as we age), one may not hear a difference with different loading.

In general, I think it is a good idea to follow the manufacturer's suggestions for loading, at least as a starting point.

 

I have a bunch NOS AT Shibata needles that are quite old, the ATS12S, ATN14, ATN15 and ATN20. All of them are good, with the ATN20 possibly the best. Don´t know what dimensions they have, but they have a very tiny diamond. I have some mounted on separate HS, so I can easily swap between them.
Funnily enough I mostly prefer the needle from an ATS13 or ATN15XE to the Shibatas. Which are nude 0.2x0.7 cut, which nowadays can be found on the AT7V.

 

Hi patient_ot!

Thanks, we have just discused that in another thread, haven't we?

I know this site from you and I know that the inductance of the AT-VM95ML will shift the drop by 1,5kHz (the drop starts at 7,2kHz for the Nagaoka MP 110 and at 8,8kHz for the AT-VM95ML as you have posted above).

But still: this should be audible.

I did some hearing tests (on Android and YT). I know they are not very accurate but I can hear up to 14kHz.

So far the following is possible:

1) the capacity of the Marantz PM 6006 is not 440pf but lower (very unlikely)

2) I do always put the loudness button on, which boosts the bass and trebble by about +6dB. This will compensate in a way the dB dropping in the higher frequency.

3) My hearing is not as sensitive as it has been some years ago...

Bye Andrea

 

Yes, I'm sure we've talked about this before and I've discussed it many times with various people on various forums .

Without measurements it is hard to say.

If you can get your hands on an accurate test LP and make a . WAV digital recording from your amp's REC OUT/TAPE OUT, then I can try to analyze the results for you. It is very possible that loudness button is altering the frequency response a bit. We could try to compare the results with and without the loudness button engaged.

The other thing you have to keep in mind is that chart with the electrical models is going to differ from what happens in actuality. That is because the cantilever and stylus resonates like a tuning fork and helps extend the frequency response beyond the electrical peak (cart designers account for this). I have seen this with my own measurements of the 95ML and other carts, as well as professional measurements. The overall response of the 95ML will go out to 20kHz or a little beyond with ~200pf even though the natural electrical peak is around 15kHz.

If you have a Rega tonearm with Rega wiring I would guess that the capacitance is around 80-100pf, plus whatever your Marantz phono has.

RE: hearing, there is more than one dimension. We have to consider where your hearing ability cuts off but also how many dB down it is at a given frequency. You can only know that with a test from an audiologist.

Then you have to consider that not everyone is going to have the same ability to hear changes in frequency response by a given amount. Harman has done a lot of research in this area with their "How to Listen" software including some tests and experiments that are very difficult to pass.

Other than that, we have to take into account that most headphones and speakers do not have a flat frequency response.

 

Thanks!

Very interesting and nice that you wanna help me out.

But for now it is too much for me with all the different aspects to keep in mind...

As long as I'm pleased with the sound of the AT-VM95ML over the Rega RB 300 into the Marantz PM 6006, I'm fine.

But I appreciate your deep insight. I'm still learning a lot here.

Bye Andrea

 

I would not worry about it, enjoy your records

 

Hope I can jump back in and ask. I bought the AT-VM95ML. I can't spend much on a head shell so can anyone tell me if it's wise to go any cheaper than this AT-HS6?

https://www.amazon.co.jp/オーディオテクニカ-...&keywords=headshells+AT&qid=1596167176&sr=8-5

 

That one is fine. Are these carts not sold as a premounted package with that headshell in Japan? They are in the US.

 

Tx. Sometimes, but after I got one pre-mounted once from Turntable Needles, I was shocked at how the head shell was twisted. Not impressed. Prefer to do it myself.

 

I'm looking to replace the AT440MLA on my U-Turn Orbit. Would you recommend any of these VM carts? I'm also considering Ortofon 2M Red or Nagaoka MP-110. Educated recommendations appreciated.

 

The closest to the AT440MLA is the current VM540ML. Or if you only need a replacement stylus, you can fit the current VNM40ML stylus to the AT440MLA.

 

I'm taking a break from the VM with an Ortofon Super OM5E (I'm awaiting delivery of an OM20 stylus). The AT carts are great but maybe I feel they're just a little too clinical sometimes. The OM5E obviously sounds a bit rough but I can hear things that I really like, vocals for example. I'm looking forward to hearing the OM20.

 

I hear you. If I could get a cart that sounds full and romantic like the Nagaoka MP-110 but with the tracking and surface-noise reduction of the VM95ML, that would make me very happy

 

Why don't we have any budget H-O MCs or MIs? I suspect they would take the market. I also bet AT has cornered the market on the high-end cuts.