Beach Boys Hybrid SACD (Acoustic Sounds)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Jason Manley, Feb 25, 2015.

  1. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus

    Yes, and there's something peculiar about Today!

    Chuck Britz's stereo mixes of the earlier albums are pretty basic: usually mono instrumental tracked, hard left/right vocals, which actually suits the Beach Boys' sound...but Linnett couldn't even repeat that with Today! because of the way it was recorded.

    Summer Days! sounds fantastic. "Amusement Parks USA" "Help Me Rhonda" and "Girl Don't Tell Me" are extraction mixes, and the first two sounds pretty good but the third definitely sounds a little off; otherwise, the songs are great, though.
    Ryan Lux and Brodnation like this.
  2. Spencer R

    Spencer R Forum Resident

    Oxford, MS
    I think the original stereo mix of All Summer Long is pretty darn good. I wish Britz had taken a shot at mixing Today! into stereo at the time. It is what it is, though. I’m happy with the presentation of the mono mix of Today! on SACD. Regardless of the technical limitations of the recording process, it is an unbelievable collection of songs.
    Lance LaSalle likes this.
  3. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus

    Yes, those simple mixes actually really work well.

    I think Brian banned stereo mixes between 65-67.

    I've also seen it speculated that some of the multi-tracks might be missing for Today, which would make sense.
    Brodnation and Spencer R like this.
  4. Spencer R

    Spencer R Forum Resident

    Oxford, MS
    I listened to the SACD in stereo with headphones and I agree that it is interesting on an analytical level to try to pick out parts that may be lost or buried in the mono mix. But I didn’t find it a satisfying headphone listening experience. The mono mix presents a better, more musical, more cohesive whole. By contrast, since the stereo mix of Pet Sounds came out, that has been my go-to mix for Pet Sounds. But the mono mix of Today will remain my go-to mix for that album.
  5. Brodnation

    Brodnation They say that Brian is Back

    IIRC it was the first album made after he quit touring, was it ‘All Summer Long’ or ‘Today!’ (I can’t remember.) either way from that album forward Brian only mixed in Mono. But as the story goes: we all know what happened and Brian took a backseat in production, and Carl started mixing in Stereo again.
  6. Lance LaSalle

    Lance LaSalle Prince of Swollen Sinus

    Yeah, Today! was the first album after he quit touring.
    Brodnation likes this.
  7. supermd

    supermd Senior Member

    San Jose, CA
    I think the vintage stereo mixes are a lot of fun. I love them. The remixes of Today and Summer Days are very hit and miss. Luckily, Pet Sounds sounds great, as does Smiley and Wild Honey. I really wish they kept making stereo mixes through their entire career, as those albums with a vintage stereo mix would have likely been better than the newer mixes we got. I love the sound of the vintage mixes.
    vivresavie, Spencer R and Brodnation like this.
  8. DRM

    DRM Forum Resident

    Very informative.
  9. Pants Party

    Pants Party One Leg At A Time

    Washington, DC
    Great to revisit those Desper remarks. Are his mixes/matrixes (forgive me if I misuse the terminology) available? YouTube? I know he mentions his site, but is it down?

    I mean... seriously. Sunflower and Surf's Up are engineering masterpieces. Even a hack like me can pick that up on even a cursory listen. Finger snaps and syllables dance around the stereo field the whole damn record. A snare drum starts in the center and its crack bounces from left to right -- don't tell me this isn't deliberate. There's such a delicate spacing to the mix and stage -- clearly, something crazy brilliant was going on here. Can we get something done about this!?
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2020
  10. Al Smith

    Al Smith Forum Resident

    The Stephen Desper video tutorials are being progressively released at Endless Harmony Forum - Stephen and Mike Connor are moderating sign up and join the discussion.

    Home | EH

    Cool, Cool Water is first cab or uber.
  11. Fox67

    Fox67 Bad as Can

    Isle of Rhodes
    Thanks for that link!:righton:
  12. John Manning

    John Manning #FreeFeelFlows

    Yorkshire Dales
    S’great to have the Desper series back (and to have it at the best of the Beach Boards is just sweet!) – absolutely essential listening/viewing/reading for anyone who takes their Beach Boys even part-seriously.
  13. Cam Mott

    Cam Mott Forum Resident

    Paola, KS
    Steve has done fans a solid.
    Al Smith and drbeachboy like this.
  14. Pretty.Odd.

    Pretty.Odd. Guess I'm Dumb

    Montclair, NJ
    Read through most of these and you all convinced me!! I have all of the AP LP's (mono and stereo where applicable) and I just ordered the Today, Summer Days, Pet Sounds, Smiley Smile and Sunflower SACDs. I figured it's worth it to have some of my favorite records of all time on the best possible versions on CD.
  15. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    I think Surf's Up has a great stereo spread and a wonderful mix. Sunflower is an odd-sounding mix, but bloomy in it's own good way (if you get the right pressing/mastering).

    "The design philosophy of the “matrix” is based upon a neural processing model. It is not an HRTF device, nor does it use DTF, IACC or PCA functions or formulas. The bases of the design rests on “perceptual Precedence” as a means of biasing the brain’s auditory spatial perception. Perceptual precedence is a reflex action wherein the mind is nudged to realize an entire auditory pattern by presentation of partial information only, similar to our ability to recognize familiar shapes even if most of the shape may be blocked from view.

    These techniques are based on an understanding of labeled line code, discharge patterns of rapidly and slowly receptor adaptation encoding and frequency and population codes, etc. used by the brain to overcome its big problem, latencies of action-potentials as each synaptic connection is made to the next level of neural processing."

    These comments I quote don't really address the issue in a practical way to the listener. Especially when he refers to Reprise not issuing his virtual surround mix cut to LP in 3D. I got lost and do not know what a 3D cut slab of an LP is?

    "The encoded signals have always been embedded within the stereo release. I figured out how to put the decoded signals on to the LP itself. Here-to-fore thought impossible. Putting so-called "3D sound" right on the Sunflower LP would have made it listenable by anyone over a two-speaker system NO DECODER NEEDED. Alternately, as the record company decided to do, the stereo with encoded signals unresolved, was released. What they failed to capitalize on was making cheap decoders and selling them. I just wanted the LP to have the 3D sound already decoded, but the record company was not willing to try something new. That's OK, what was released was good stereo."

    I guess this mystery 3D cutting of an LP (that was rejected) is water long under the bridge now, don't go near that water. And I am not sure I can read 100 pages of this thread, but maybe I'll give it a try.
    Shawn likes this.
  16. quicksrt

    quicksrt Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    Tell me about the 3D cutting of an LP side, the thing that got rejected. I missed it in that long post.
  17. FJFP

    FJFP Host for the 'Mixology' Mix Differences Podcast

    I have Safari they PS, but for some reason never completed the set. It’s certainly worth having the cream of the crop though!
    Pretty.Odd. likes this.
  18. nick99nack

    nick99nack Forum Resident

    Spotswood, NJ
    The gross oversimplification (at least of my understanding) of how it works is by adjusting the phase of certain frequencies in a way that your brain interprets the stereo sound as though it's coming from different locations. Of course, this involves also mixing the material with this system in mind in order to obtain the best possible results. (It can be used with regular stereo albums, but to varying degrees of success)

    At one time, Mr. Desper had samples up on his website of what could be done with the system. I took the AP SACD and ran it through a Spatializer and it sounded very similar to (though not exactly the same as) the samples on his website.

    I believe what he said about it being "encoded" is that it is mixed in a way designed to take full advantage of a spatializer-like device. It could have been run through the device before cutting to disc, but the record company opted not to do this.

    Maybe @Stephen W. Desper could confirm or deny what I'm saying.
    Al Smith likes this.
  19. Al Smith

    Al Smith Forum Resident

    That’s a pretty good summary.
    nick99nack likes this.
  20. Al Smith

    Al Smith Forum Resident

    There was a time when SD offered to provide handsome young fans with a “decoded” digital copy of Sunflower if you sent him a copy of your own official/store bought Sunflower/S’UP twofer and a blank CD-R, and return postage.

    Unfortunately, some hall monitor type at SmileySmile screamed “Copyright Infringement” which promptly nixed the offer.

    If you are able to playback the tutorials over a stereo they sound great! The AP SACD is also fantastic, buy it if you can.

    Keep an eye on Endless Harmony Forum - when SD completes a seperate project he’s working on, the tutorials will be available to members of - Home | EH
    Shawn, Fox67 and John Manning like this.
  21. Pretty.Odd.

    Pretty.Odd. Guess I'm Dumb

    Montclair, NJ
    Having just gotten my first five of these on CD is incredible. I AB'd these with the 2012 discs and was in total horror at what I have been listening to for 9 years. I'm gonna have to pick all of these up for sure. The Summer Days disc is even making me dig the stereo mix.
  22. khronikos

    khronikos Forum Resident

    Surf's Up seems out everywhere on SACD, but appears on backorder and not out of print. Anywhere to still get this? I am only missing this SACD from my collection.
    yesstiles and Pretty.Odd. like this.
  23. khronikos

    khronikos Forum Resident

    Bro I know what you mean. These AP SACDS kick the living **** out of anything done previously.

    They had BEST keep this mothers in print, because they are literally definitive.
    MarkusGermany and Pretty.Odd. like this.
  24. Pretty.Odd.

    Pretty.Odd. Guess I'm Dumb

    Montclair, NJ
    I've since purchased all of them. I doubt they will ever be topped. I just wish they did all of the albums!
  25. Pretty.Odd.

    Pretty.Odd. Guess I'm Dumb

    Montclair, NJ
    That was the only one I couldn't get either. I posted in the WTB section of this forum a few days ago and someone hooked me up with a copy.

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