BlackkKlansman (new Spike Lee film)

Speak for yourself - I just came here to discuss the editing!

 

I've heard that take on the film elsewhere, too. I simply do not think Green Book, which was a film based on a true story about basically two people and to some extent about one of those two's family, was roundly experienced in the way you say. What you say sounds like a rather categorical put down by people who wanted it to be a different film, not really about the film itself.

 

I didn't really "want" anything from it other than for it to be a good movie.

And it was entertaining - no doubt about that. I'm not "hating" on it.

But it's definitely a "safe" production. It's light and fuzzy like "Daisy".

Nothing inherently wrong with that, but I do think aspects of the film feel self-congratulatory...

 

I saw this yesterday at home, frankly I thought it was an unbelievable plot, with the usual Spike Lee heavy hand .
Look here, here's my message, here it is again, and again and so on.
The word deft does not spring to mind ever.

 

Again, this is a true story.

To paraphrase Mark Twain "Truth is stranger than fiction because truth doesn't have to make sense."

More often than not, stuff has to be left out of true stories because those things were so unbelievable that they would pull the audience out of the story. For instance, in the book Charlie Wilson's War, Aaron Sorkin had to eliminate a character for the movie who had been cowboy star Tom Mix's stunt double. The audience wouldn't buy that this person wound up smuggling arms to the Afghans.

 

I've been trying to cobble together the details from my memory and I think I've now got it.

Terry David Mulligan was creator, host and producer of "MuchWest" on MuchMusic, which aired from 1986 to 1998.
While promoting his then-recent film Crooklyn (1994), Mr. Lee was interviewed by TDM (Mr. Mulligan).
Talk got around to the great scene when the kids are singing along to The Partridge Family's "I Woke Up in Love This Morning".
TDM (phrasing here) asked, "It's such a great scene, so why didn't you include the song on the official soundtrack for the film?"
The question was followed by a lot of squirming and cheek-shifting by Mr. Lee, ending with a non-answer to an epic query.

 

Keeping in mind that Green Book is based on things that did happen, how should it have been different in order to avoid your perception that it was self-congratulatory?

 

More of a focus on Dr. Shirley. Showing the story through Tony's eyes softens it and rubs off the rougher edges to make it safe - it allows the audience to maintain a distance from Dr. Shirley's experiences...

 

Based on a true story. I gather that what actually happened doesn't match too closely with what Spike did to the premise.

 

Do you have a breakdown of the differences?

 

You earlier complained that Green Book simplified race issues. So if the focus was on Dr. Shirley's character, and the film was otherwise still about his relationship with Tony, how does that make it more complex?

I think you are saying one of two things. Either you think Dr. Shirley's point of view on their relationship and the racial aspects of it has more value, would be more perceptive, or you are saying you really think the film should have been about something else.

If the former, I don't think that is at all clear. How would their developing relationship be understood to be more complex merely because we see it from Dr. Shirley's point of view?

And if the latter, it is like I said earlier - you are really saying you wanted Green Book to be a different film entirely.

 

Here's a discussion:

BlacKkKlansman Movie vs. the True Story of Ron Stallworth

 

Is 'BlacKkKlansman' Accurate? Spike Lee Stays Pretty True to the True Story

 

Because it takes away the distance the focus on Tony affords. If we see through Dr. Shirley's eyes, we get a more impactful view of the impact of racism, not just drive-by observations...

You seem to think I disliked the movie or felt it was a failure - neither is true.

My comments address ways it'd be less "safe" and self-congratulatory. It can be exactly the film it is and still be warm 'n' fuzzy - which it is...

 

I don't, but put "blackkklansman vs reality" in Google and several pages outlining the differences come up. Apparently the basic premise is maintained but a lot of liberties are taken along the way, particularly with the ending.

Edit: Ah, I see this has already been addressed!

 

I was reminded of just how much more bizarre real life can be than fiction of this bit from Lester Maddox's Wikipedia article:

With his political career seemingly over and with massive debts stemming from his 1974 gubernatorial bid, Maddox began a short-lived nightclub comedy career in 1977 with an African American musician, Bobby Lee Sears, who had worked as a busboy in his restaurant. Sears had served time in prison for a drug offense before Maddox, as lieutenant governor, was able to assist him in obtaining a pardon. Calling themselves "The Governor and the Dishwasher," the duo performed comedy bits built around musical numbers with Maddox on harmonica and Sears on guitar.
​

Just to remind those who may not be familiar with this particular bit of history, Maddox was mentioned in Randy Newman's song Rednecks "He may be a fool, but he's our fool."

 

Yeah - get with the program, binky!

 

It's an important topic for American film, though. Bringing the thread back somewhat to the film arena, there *are* (mostly) bright-line distinctions between race-related films made for a white audience to feel good about itself (stuff like Driving Miss Daisy), and films that deal with the issue in more unsettling/controversial/realistic ways. The latter couldn't even have been made by a major studio in the US until probably the 1980s, a movement that Spike Lee was a forerunner of. Again, speaking purely to the film world, that to me is the real sign of progress.

On the subject of Lee, I think Clockers (1995) is very underrated.

 

Green Book is a White Hero film. I understand the backlash.

 

Don't understand that, either. I think Dr. Shirley was at least as heroic as Tony in the film. Really more so.

 

Of the films dealing with race relations in the US released in 2018, the two that really matter were The Hate U Give and Sorry to Bother You.

Sorry, forgot to mention the best one - Bodied.

None of these were nominated for squat.

 

I think NettleBed meant more than "GB" is in the "white savior" vein: movies that treat black subjects at a distance and make white characters the heroes...

 

I liked "Blindspotting" better than either of those. It's all over the place but it's interesting...

 

First of all we DO see Dr. Shirley's take on much of what goes on, including on the way racism affects the dynamic with Tony. But yeah it's not like that the whole film.

Personally I liked that it showed both men learning by experience from the other, with on the racism angle Tony not being a hero so much as showing he could, and did, learn something important from Dr. Shirley. And that is a good thing.

 

Didn't get to see that one. My wife hates the term "Oscar bait" but it really does describe Green Book, and BlacKKKlansman really does seem to be Spike trying to get one.