BOB DYLAN: Outtakes, Alternates & Live Recordings, 1965-1966

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by HominyRhodes, Jun 1, 2015.

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  1. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    Including Dylan's personal reel-to-reels and cassettes.

    Maybe a DVD tie-in set of the raw Pennebaker footage from both 1965 and '66.
     
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  2. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    What?! It's Dylan's best album.
     
  3. DeeThomaz

    DeeThomaz Senior Member

    Location:
    In The Felony Room
    You seem to be reading my mind. The BS12 news has had me diving back into my '66 tour recordings. Sheffield seems to be my early favorite, if I had to choose just one of them to add to the official catalog (particularly if the uncirculating electric tracks live up to the two we already have access to).

    I know you use your terminology carefully, so I find it interesting that it's the mastering of Live 1966 that you call out, and not the new mix (which many fans seem to single out for criticism). Can't wait to hear you explain your thinking in more depth.
     
  4. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
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    18 CDs could be anything. Hopefully it includes all the studio outtakes recorded under the aegis of CBS, wherever and whenever during 1965-1966 for the three albums that were recorded then. Plus live recordings of decent sound quality - including the rumored Forest Hills '65 soundboard. Home and hotel demos, again, very welcome. Plus, of course, any and all audio-visual footage from the time period - including Pennebaker's 'Something's Happening' would be great (the concerts supposedly broadcast/taped by French and Australian TV stations would be a nice find). Blonde On Blonde outtakes (any/all) need serious inclusion here, completed songs or not.

    It's good that Dylan's Bootleg Series team is recognizing that '65-'66 Dylan is a 'High Water' mark in Dylan's career, no matter how it's sliced, diced, or measured and meted out - whether his work saw the light of day back then or was even considered a 'track' - everything he played or recorded back then is worth hearing.

    Is this '18CDs' thing even serious?
     
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  5. DeeThomaz

    DeeThomaz Senior Member

    Location:
    In The Felony Room
    At this point, it seems to be about as credible as the whole 1965/66 news, as the two sources of this information were consistent on both points. Still a long way from confirmed though.

    Just for the sake of argument, it's seems possible the 18CD could be something a bit different from what has been speculated about. Assuming it's not a Copyright Extension set, what if not simply a more wide-ranging version of the 5CD set, but rather the long-discussed "Superfan" Blonde on Blonde set that focuses entirely on material from those sessions? It would have the advantage of laser focus, but would (of course) annoy people to no end, as they'd also have to buy the 5CD box to get the BIABH/H61 material.

    I'm not saying it's a likely approach. But it seems at least a bit plausible.
     
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  6. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
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    18 Cds sounds about right if they're doing all the 1965-1966 studio outtakes and the best-recorded live shows.
     
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  7. Interestingly, I just got my hands on the 8-CD Scorpio compilation mentioned earlier in the thread and am currently working my way through it - Liverpool sounds incredible here - the best I've heard anywhere - (the notes say it's from a nagra recording), and the entire performance is - as you say - "cataclysmic"...
     
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  8. olsen

    olsen Forum Resident

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    los angeles
    Michael O here. If a lack of ambience is what differentiates Guitars Kissing from the final version, I can see why some may prefer GK. The 'ambience' is what made Tell Me Momma sound buried and less than persuasive upon first listen, for me.
     
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  9. LonesomeDayBlues

    LonesomeDayBlues Forum Resident

    Location:
    Long Beach, CA
    Geoff gans designed a cover for tempest it wasn't selected. They went with coco instead. Bummer
     
  10. subtr

    subtr Forum Resident

    It could be anything, true. And if it's not the copyright collection then I presume that will take most of the circulating audience material, which still could mean anything. This next two years will be interesting for sure with the copyright material supplementing this set (or however it might work).
     
  11. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    Alright, we hear from the man himself. :righton:

    I've never heard the entire show in the GK mix, but I believe the "ambience" issue is what most people are concerned about. Maybe GetRhythm could describe the differences, but I imagine that the sound of the Liverpool show (I posted Tell Me Momma from the show at the top of this thread) is what people prefer, although that concert was captured in mono only, I believe, by the film crew and their Nagra recorders. The B-side version of Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues was from that same show, and both tracks, remastered, were included on the recent retrospective set of The Band.

    This link is for a page devoted to Guitars Kissing, including the observations of Dylan expert Roger Ford, although it hasn't been updated since 1998.
    http://www.edlis.org/twice/threads/guitars_kissing.html#edlis_notes
     
  12. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    I was just looking at Dylan's U.K. tour schedule, and he had a night off before the Liverpool show (5/14), but Manchester (5/17) was his fourth one-nighter in row, and he may have been a little more burned-out. By the time he played Albert Hall ten days later, his exhaustion seems fairly apparent. But like many other people, I think his weariness added another dimension to his performances.

    Also, about the "ambience" issues on the Manchester tape: Ballad of a Thin Man, on the official CD, is one track where the room sound adds some atmospheric color, with Dylan's vocal slightly buried in the mix (he was at the piano for that song), and Garth's organ sounding like some sort of demented circus calliope. I like it.
     
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  13. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    "Biograph" fully sub
    What can you say about perfection? :)
     
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  14. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
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    Except for Rainy Day Women, of course.

    EDIT: And don't you want to hang this on your wall?
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2015
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  15. notesfrom

    notesfrom Forum Resident

    Location:
    NC USA
    Exactly. It's about the poster as well and the time period the album came out (both of which, I suppose, have nothing to do with owning this album on CD, when I think about it).

    It's about walking into a record store and buying your first Dylan album - one with 'Postively 4th Street' on it (heck, the only one with 'Positively 4th Street' on it). And the bottom line is that 'everybody must get stoned'? Right? :fly:

    I do like Biograph, tho.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2015
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  16. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    Thank you for finishing my thought that I apparently never finished typing. Yes, I meant to say "Biograph" subsumes GH1, minus RDW12&35 - but if you own BOB (and who wouldn't), there's no reason to own GH1.
     
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  17. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    GH1 was my first Dylan vinyl album - inherited from my older brother. By the CD era there just seemed to be no point in buying it. I was busy spending $35 a disc on those early copyright gap live CDs (Royal Albert Hall, All Hallow's Eve) that were just needle drops of albums I already owned. :)
     
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  18. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    Yeah, I never bought the CD of GH1, either, although my 1970s-vintage vinyl copy is certainly worn out.
     
  19. Nightswimmer

    Nightswimmer Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    I agree that 18 CDs had to be studio outtakes and live stuff. It will not be just studio recordings.

    By the way: who would have thought that this EU-law would force artists like Dylan to release their previously unreleased recordings. :)
     
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  20. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    Does anyone think that Dylan's pal, Bob Neuwirth, may have planted a seed that turned into Like A Rolling Stone? (skip ahead to around 1:10 in the video) The scene is from Don't Look Back, filmed shortly before Dylan wrote his song.


    BTW: This Tuesday, June 16th, is the 50th anniversary of Dylan's recording session for Like A Rolling Stone, although in my book, it's timeless.
     
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  21. NaturalD

    NaturalD The King of Pop

    Location:
    Boston, Mass., USA
    Hard to say; seems like Neuwirth is shouting for Lost Highway (calling it Rolling Stone) but Bob D clearly knows Lost Highway already. Great clip though.
     
  22. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    Dylan starts the song, but then Neuwirth prompts him with the "I'm a rolling stone" line.
     
  23. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    I'm not saying he deserves credit, or anything, I just found it interesting. (Although I think Neuwirth did once claim to have given Dylan the opening line to Tom Thumb's Blues: "When you're lost in the rain in Juarez and it's Eastertime, too..")
     
  24. RayS

    RayS A Little Bit Older and a Little Bit Slower

    Location:
    Out of My Element
    I've hypothesized that "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues" was inspired in part by the portion of "On the Road" where Sal and Dean visit Mexico. After much debauchery (burgundy, and the harder stuff), Sal gets sick. Rather than standing behind him, his friend Dean leaves, returning to the States. After recovering, Sal goes back to New York City, having had enough.

    or not
     
  25. HominyRhodes

    HominyRhodes Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Chicago
    Excellent hypothesis, IMO. I haven't read that book in many years, but it rings true. I did recently watch the movie version, which was loud and fast, and full of wildly-overactive libidos (is that a word?), but failed to capture any of Kerouac's mythological prose.
     
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