Bob Dylan – The Bootleg Series Vol.16: Springtime In New York (1980–1985) (Content & Sound Quality)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by DeeThomaz, Sep 19, 2019.

  1. Country Rocker

    Country Rocker Forum Resident

    I disagree. This is the one Bootleg Series entry that Dylan die-hards like myself have been waiting on for years. It's a very well respected period of Dylan's career, when organised correctly. I'm very much looking forward to this release.
     
  2. masswriter

    masswriter Minister At Large

    Location:
    New England
    It'll be so nice to listen to those 80s albums in different configurations ... they're just ripe for reevaluation.
     
  3. musicaner

    musicaner Forum Resident

    half an hour ago it was not the Infidels now we are back to it being Infidels.
     
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  4. windfall

    windfall Senior Member

    Location:
    UK
    Infidels outfidels shakeitallaboutfidels.
     
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  5. I'm not trying to be contrary for the sake of it, I'm genuinely curious but when you say it's well respected I'm wondering by whom? Critically speaking the contemporary reviews ran from fair to middling at best but its never been re-evaluated or reclaimed as a masterpiece by anyone to my knowledge. I'm a Dylan diehard by most people's standards but I don't rate Infidels at all. The material left off it is easily better than most of the material on it. We've heard nothing yet to make us believe they have much more material at least as good as the released outtakes.
     
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  6. Floater

    Floater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Germany
    Yes mate, you are so right!
     
  7. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    Keef's original post just said "'80s stuff," and you vouched for that, so just to be absolutely clear ... you're saying now that BS16 is All Infidels, Nothing But Infidels?
    I don't doubt that five CDs of Infidels sessions would have some amazing stuff on it; I just think it's a massive missed opportunity to reevaluate the entire period. Being able to trace the evolution of the overlapping songs alone seems like a slam dunk. Oh well.
     
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  8. Mbd77

    Mbd77 Collect ‘Em All!

    Location:
    London
    Who said it wasn’t an Infidels set?
     
  9. Mbd77

    Mbd77 Collect ‘Em All!

    Location:
    London
    Oh…ok. ‘80s stuff’ - my understanding is that does not include pre or post Infidels era material.

    I might be wrong but I don’t believe so.

    I think people might be reading too much into the phrasing there and thinking this is some decade wide retrospective with Oh Mercy tracks. That’s not my understanding, though I haven’t seen a tracklist.

    I don’t necessarily think it will be called “Infidels sessions” or framed in that way though. Wait and see…
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2021
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  10. StingRay5

    StingRay5 Important Impresario

    Location:
    California
    Rolling Stone gave Infidels four and a half stars at the time and called it his best album since Blood on the Tracks. (Oddly, the reviewer doesn't seem to realize that the "Neighborhood Bully" Dylan is defending is Israel.) Of course, this is around the same time that RS gave The Who's It's Hard five stars; it's since been re-evaluated and is now widely considered a weak album. This was a period where Jann Wenner was forcing five-star reviews for many of his heroes from the '60s, perhaps as an emotional reaction to the murder of John Lennon.

    Dylan's subsequent albums of the '80s generally did not receive strongly favorable reviews, at least not until Oh Mercy.
     
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  11. Bink

    Bink Forum Resident

    I think I had hoped for something similar to what @Sean Murdock has described. When I imagined what this set might look like I wasn't expecting any pre-Infidels tracks or any Oh Mercy material but had thought it might incorporate Empire Burlesque, Knocked Out Loaded and Down in the Groove sessions as the Infidels story continued into those albums.
     
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  12. LonesomeDayBlues

    LonesomeDayBlues Forum Resident

    Location:
    Long Beach, CA
    I agree as well. I was hoping for a deep dive on those albums. On the bright side, there might be a bootleg series in the future that focuses solely on the Empire-Knocked-Down albums. Perhaps, Rosen/Legacy learned with the 70s archival releases that they probably should have released one expansive set instead of the forced piecemeal releases we got?
     
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  13. Mbd77

    Mbd77 Collect ‘Em All!

    Location:
    London
    Are you talking about stuff like “Death Is Not The End?”

    As I said I haven’t seen a tracklist and I’ve got things incorrect in the past as well but the various bits I’ve heard all relate to Infidels in one way or another. All of them. Literally nothing else has been mentioned. I think it might be slightly wider than that in the way it’s ‘sold’ - like a period of time after the gospel stuff rather than ‘Infidels sessions’, and I suppose from there there might be some cross-over ‘before or after’, but I’ve not heard it described as some sort of multi-album retrospective going into the late 80s if that’s what people are thinking.

    As stated, maybe I’m wrong but if so they’ve kept that extremely on the down low.
    I’d point out however that similar things were said about the “More Blood” set - with people saying they thought it would have Planet Waves and Desire and even Pat Garrett and 1974 live stuff on it…I said it was just BOTT and it turned out to be correct.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2021
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  14. Bink

    Bink Forum Resident

    Yes, I was thinking of Death is not the end and Brownsville Girl etc, but also hoped that a slightly expanded set might present an opportunity to mix out some of the 80's production from the Empire Burlesque sessions for example.

    Nevertheless I have always enjoyed all the Bootleg Series editions and I am sure this will be no exception, however they decide to present it.
     
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  15. Mbd77

    Mbd77 Collect ‘Em All!

    Location:
    London
    Nobody seems to pick up on the fact that he sings the bootleg version in the “Nashville Skyline” voice.
     
  16. warewolf95

    warewolf95 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Greenville, SC
    In a perfect/realistic world, I could go with a 3cd set.

    Discs 1 and 2 covering Infidels and Empire and then disc 3 covering KOL and DITG
     
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  17. Sean Murdock

    Sean Murdock Forum Intruder

    Location:
    Bergenfield, NJ
    Interesting. I suppose it's a relief (for people like me) who are hoping for a wider scope to BS16 that you haven't seen a track list ... that means there's still hope. I'm reminded that BS10 was talked about and rumored to be ALL about Self Portrait (and titled as such), but it was really about the entire "Country Bob" era. There have been other recent whispers "out there" that the Infidels sessions would only be about one-third of BS16, so any assumptions I made weren't just because of @keef285's post.
    Not only that, but multiple songs that evolved over two albums. "Clean Cut Kid," "Someone's Got A Hold Of The Tight Connection To My Heart," and of course "New Danville Girl"/"Brownsville Girl." Honestly, any mid-80s Bootleg Series that doesn't address that pair of songs is committing some level of archival malpractice.
    As always, thank you for whatever scraps of info you're able to share. Perhaps those near the team refer to it as the "Infidels box" as a kind of shorthand, and it will still somehow turn out to be something bigger (and better) than that. I'll never turn down a "kitchen sink" box set, but I do find the curated "themed" ones more fun to listen to.
     
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  18. Have you read "Just A Personal Tendency" by Dave Percival? It makes a compelling case for Empire Burlesque being one of Dylan's all time best albums, if not his best. For perspective, it was written in the late 80s before Oh Mercy came out. I don't know what the author thinks today but I mention it because it also had a supplementary booklet with it containing about 100 contemporary reviews from all over the world including the US, UK and Australia. Many professional reviewers gave EB 5 stars and claimed it was his best since BOTT or even Blonde On Blonde!

    That would suit me too!
     
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  19. musicaner

    musicaner Forum Resident

    there has been a glimpse of the artwork, I forget where, and its infidels but 6 discs worth LOL i dont know.
    maybe a 84 multi track.
     
  20. Dave Gilmour's Cat

    Dave Gilmour's Cat Forum Resident

    Happy to hear this. Thanks. The deeper the dive, the better.
     
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  21. warewolf95

    warewolf95 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Greenville, SC
    I mean, I love Jokerman and Sweetheart Like You, but I really don't need 7 versions that are identical except for a vocal inferior to the released album, ya dig? :p

    Give me what we got on BS1 plus the cream of the rest of the crop :)
     
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  22. Dave Gilmour's Cat

    Dave Gilmour's Cat Forum Resident

    What makes you think they’ll be identical? Was ‘Too Late’ identical to ‘Foot of Pride’?
     
  23. musicaner

    musicaner Forum Resident

    well its 6 cds at 75 min.
     
  24. President_dudley

    President_dudley Forum Resident

    oddly, or not, i no longer care
     
    SteveM likes this.
  25. LonesomeDayBlues

    LonesomeDayBlues Forum Resident

    Location:
    Long Beach, CA
    I haven’t heard about any leaked artwork. Last time that happened it was the Rolling Thunder box. Let us know if you find a link.
     

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