Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by zwolo, Jun 14, 2017.
I agree with you 100%.
Wow! Reading that entire thread was an undertaking. I searched these releases on here because I preorderd all the 45's 2 years ago and my Daughter was born shortly after and I got so backlogged on listening that I literally just took the shrink off of TTM and played it 2 days ago. Ouch! There HAS to be more than one master for these, because I can't imagine anyone missing the glaring amount of dropouts my copy has. I have had my fair chair of pressing issues with non fill and dish warping etc, but this isn't that. I can't imagine any engineer worth their salt wanting to release these and have their name attached. Obviously way to late for a return so I'll have to enjoy the downloads.
Quoting myself which is a selfie type drag sorry, but since writing the above a couple of years ago, I saw a recent filmed interview with Bauhaus / Tones on Tail member Daniel Ash, and he's still enamoured about early Eno all these years after Bauhaus were influenced by him. When recently asked, Ash picks Warm Jets as the one album more than any other that he'd like to go back in time and witness the recording of.
Don't have the interview link sorry, but there you go FWIW
Out of curiosity bought BAAS yesterday at a slightly reduced price. Fairaintfair says it perfectly. BAAS does sound better than my first UK. It does have better and better defined low end and perhaps a little more clarity, and really like the "browning" description. I have always been a little underwhelmed by the sonics of AGW and BAAS, they sound fine with beautiful sounds and production, but have never really left out of the speakers. May consider the first two which are still available at an ok price and may be able to track down a not so expensive AGW.
Was that the 2x45rpm version or the 1xLP version?
Sorry. 2x45. Am sure the single LP releases are decent (have AGW) just don't expect them to better my UK originals. Funny I've had a hard a hard time tracking down a proper UK first of AGW, I have the Poloydor second press.
How does the single disc version AGW compare against the second polydor pressing?
I can't yet say that I've heard a truly great sounding AGW. Have two UK Polydors, the recent Astralwerks, the Heyworth DSD CD and a first press Kendun Canadian. My favourite of those is the Kendun. It has a little more energy and clarity. A lot of good mid 70s art rock on the Polygor label and can't say that any are especially good and are often noisy enough. Several have posted saying the Astralwerks is a little bloated in the low end, I think that's a fair assessment, and would also suggest that it sounds a little sterile. Would still like to hear an Island first press, don't think I've ever seen one in my many years of collecting.
I recently played a Polydor UK second pressing a few days ago that was beautiful. No surface noise or IGD to speak of (especially noteworthy on a album as quiet as AGW.) But as you said, there doesn't seem to be a truly great one. I always put that down to no noise reduction on the tapes, as well as the intentionally haphazard creative process. It's hard enough to get everything just right so you can get a good clean sound in a studio, but when the rule book is thrown out as enthusiastically as it was with AGW it's a miracle that it sounds as good as it does. Besides, Rhett Davies has too many beautifully recorded projects under his belt for me to think it was some kind of lapse in judgement.
Given the comments I've seen here and elsewhere, there HAVE to be several different cuts of the Abbey Road 45 reissues. I didn't keep mine because of glaringly obvious dropouts, but a lot of people (sometimes angrily) have insisted that they had no such issues. Unless a whole bunch of people had spontaneous hearing loss, there'd have to be different cuts out there.
I've posted this before, but since I mentioned it again I'm gonna post it again.
It might not stick out on your average computer speakers, but try it with headphones. There's just no getting around it.
Great post. Yeah, I think the relentless tinkering in the studio perhaps took its tool on a "good clean sound". Apparently hundreds of bits of music demos around the time of the album and he was really searching for something different. Overdubs, manipulation, multiple takes for the non musician can take a toll on the sound. It was obviously worth it.
Thanks for posting the sample. Played it loud enough on good speakers. Not sure what you're referring to as a drop out, the only thing I can detect is the wonky guitar loosing energy in one channel for a bit. This doesn't really bother me too much. Or maybe I'm not hearing what you're hearing.
I do like the way those first two sound on the original UK pressings though, warts and all. But I'll probably spring for the first two as they're long favourite records.
What am I supposed to be looking at here?
Sorry, should've explained that. That's the waveform for the clip I posted. The top channel is the left channel, where the dropouts happen. It's supposed to look more or less the same as the bottom/right channel, but it's visibly smaller in the two darkened areas. The lighter areas are where there's no issue, and they're more similar.
I'm admittedly pretty OCD (literally, in fact) about stuff like this, and it jumped out at me. It's also that it's not just one patch, but there were several scattered throughout the four. I'm one of those guys that stops everything and sits in the sweet spot with the lights out for the whole album, so maybe that's it?
Maybe I got defective pressings? Is there anything in terms of the pressing process that could cause that? It's weird. Outside of myself, an engineer friend, and a handful of others people don't seem to notice it. Maybe I'm just oversensitive to that particular frequency.
Huh. Ah well, thanks for checking it out.
Yeah the dropouts are pretty apparent on the Taking Tiger Mountaon 45, particularly on this song. I didn't notice as much on the other LPs. This was pretty extensively discussed here when these were being released.
Aside from this issue, the Abbey Road 45s were a big win IMO.
loss of energy might be a better way to describe it than dropout.
Drove me nuts when the first abbey road versions came out though, I thought my tt was having a problem
Yeah, that was confusing me. "Dropouts" are usually short, sub-second dropouts where there's no sound at all (typically tape damage). Now that I know what to look for, I can see the volume drop clearly.
At least one of the dropouts on the 1LP 33rpm Another Green World reissue I had was more than minor, it was an almost total loss of sound in one channel. On “The Big Ship” IIRC. Only for a second but infuriating on headphones and unmissable. It was definitely the very first pressing of the EU Abbey Road 33rpm because I got it before release date in London. I gave it away.
FWIW etc. Apologies for the repetition as I wrote this at the time somewhere here but don’t feel like checking.
Oh good (?) it's not just me.
I've always thought of those as dropouts, all the way back to cassette days. Maybe it's regional. Maybe I've just been totally clueless for 30+ years (a definite possibility.)
I played the clip I posted up there for an engineer friend at the time, he said it was because there was some kind of glop on the tape head that took a few seconds to clear out. He was borderline angry at how something that otherwise sounded so beautiful could be handled with such sloppiness.
The single disc reissues fixed this issue, or at least they did on Tiger Mountain. Presumably digital correction.
I was working at a record store when these came out, and I played that particular one for the buyer (who reasonably enough wanted to hear for himself before he returned them for defects.) I had him do it on headphones, and the look of shock on his face when he heard it was telling
I was in on those discussions, and IIRC that's where I got a lot of the anger/pushback. It was considerably worse on Facebook, where I had to block a guy who angrily insisted that I had to be making it up. Weird.
Now that’s interesting. Do you have more details on this? Were the other album releases also corrected?
I must admit that my fingers were burning to fire an order for the first 4 albums.I stayed away from these releases because of the drop outs and other issues.
I'm afraid that all I did was check Tiger Mountain to see if they had fixed the glitch I posted before. They did, and I haven't seen any complaints about the single discs, so I'd have to assume they got it together.
You could maybe get Here Come the Warm Jets with confidence, just in case they disappear? I don’t recall reading anybody here experiencing dropout problems with that one. The 1LP reissue of that I thought sounded terrific. A bit fatter and fuller than an Island UK original, which is a matter of taste.
Personally I’d avoid the Warm Jets 2LP if you must have it on vinyl, purely because the original side 1 / side 2 track sequencing and splits are so IMO a part of the album.
But the 1LP was
Currently $16.69 on Amazon.
The 2lp has dropouts.
The HCTWM double 45 did indeed have some glitches, but they were faint enough (and that record's noisy enough) that I only noticed them when I sat down with it to check. I had played it a couple of times before that while doing other stuff, I only checked because the other issues on TTM and AGW jumped out at me.
That said, Blue Speedway is right: the sequencing is best uninterrupted. And the single discs are (so far as I know) fixed, and sound great.
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