Spot on Jimmy B and chickendinna The clock is running He’s 70 His time is limited I’m not justifying what’s happening with the inferior archive sound as a whole just trying to make sense of it I don’t see any evidence that Springsteen, at his age, wants to spend time and energy personally ensuring that high fidelity sounding “archive” concerts are released. I’m not saying there is no evidence and I’m not saying he couldn’t decide to make that a priority (like he did back in the day) but with the plethora of sub standard sounding archive releases discussed, almost to death here and elsewhere, Springsteen is obviously ok with the sound quality or doesn’t care. I don’t see a persuasive argument to the contrary It is too bad
Nothing will change. Too many are dismissive of the concerns of those who want to be able to enjoy music without any issues. No one has been more supportive of this series as I have purchased literally ALL of the releases to date, even shows I am not a fan of and will never listen to because I wanted to show my support of the series as a whole and trying to do my very small part in keeping it going. I am now at the point where several of my Holy Grail shows have now been released, shows I have wanted officially released for decades and I am unable to listen to them for any length of time let alone a whole show. I never would have expected this nor anticipated my current feelings or situation. I don't know if I will buy any future releases even if it is a long awaited show or how good the performance is if I am unable to enjoy it. Slight hyperbole and definitely first world problems, but I have come to the realization that I am heartbroken about this and I no longer have the same level of interest or excitement that I did previously. I will say that I am on the poor side of things financially. I have extremely limited funds and over the past few years one of the few things I looked forward to and happily spent my money on was these releases. I was even late paying a bill one time so I could buy a show. It was worth it to me because listening to that show allowed me to briefly forget my life and get carried away on the joy that is Bruce live. Sadly this is being taken from me due to the mastering choices they are making. I seem to be more sensitive to it as I age. I would think the opposite would be true but it isn't. Oh well life goes on, just with a little less enjoyment for me at least.
The problem is people find out the show sounds bad, complain, and then buy the shows anyway. How does that show Bruce Inc your displeasure? You aren’t hurting sales so there’s no incentive for a better product. I didn’t buy Winterland and won’t based on what I’m hearing. That’s my -probably meaningless- comment as to quality.
I received my Winterland shows today. I decided to listen to 12/16 as I don't recall hearing it unless it was as a crappy bootleg. It wasn't the worst thing I ever heard, but I'm by no means an audiophile. There are plenty of Hoffmanites who have hearing that would make a German Shepard proud. I'm not one of them. For what it's worth, I enjoyed it. I didn't crank it either.
Agreed. Prior to Winterland while I haven't been happy with the mastering, the only one that was unbearable for me was Roxy 78. Even other shows mastered at similiar levels didn't affect me as bad. I know others had issues with Tower 75, Agora, NYE 80 for example but I was able to enjoy them albeit still being aware of the compression. More of an annoyance personally that the outright ear and head pain that Roxy 78 and now Winterland have caused. So I kept buying hoping the next one would be better plus I do suffer from the collector OCD issue where I still wanted the show even though I wouldn't listen. That didn't bother me for shows I am not that much of a fan of. For example if an 88 or later show comes out highly compressed, it doesn't bother me as much because I wouldn't be listening to it often anyway. But now that we have more 78 shows than any other tour yet multiple ones for me are either unlistenable or annoying to listen to at length for some, it has reached a point for me where I doubt I will be buying any more shows as a sign of support. I can no longer support a product that I cannot enjoy. I am done. If any future shows are mastered reasonably I will of course purchase those.
I may be done with the Live Archive Series too. The sound quality is not the deciding factor. I'm not sure what else will be released that I'll be interested in. My primary interest is in 70's and 80's Bruce. Who knows where it will go from here. I have about a dozen LAS shows and for the most part, I enjoy them. I think of the LAS as a missed opportunity. It should've been so much better than it is. However, I reserve my right to change my mind if some mind-blowing show(s) are released.
I don’t believe for a second that he doesn’t care what they sound like. He may not agonize over them, but I’ll bet anything with his name gets his okay - and they sound similarly crappy to much of his recent catalog which he certainly agonizes over. It’s the sound he likes these days. Even the better ones in the series are just okay from a fidelity standpoint.
My Winterland 1978 CDs (both nights) have shipped. I'm happy. I don't get too concerned by or caught up in the sound-quality discussions. Let it rock.
Working as an archivist for a musician, one thing it has taught me, fans tend to be more obsessive about their past work than they are.
Ha ha! Well, inevitably, it is a negotiation. At least, that's what I've found. In the end, if they want to have the final say over what the public gets to hear and what they don't, I don't feel the archivist is in a position to contradict. But we can certainly have a good argument beforehand!
There was an official announcement, reported here a page or two back, that they were taking time out until February, but that a full slate is planned for 2020.
Not sure if this is the right forum for this, but came across this Garry Tallent interview he did for Musicians Hall of Fame Nashville. You get the feeling he wasn't too happy in the E Street Band. He kind of almost goes out of way to not mention anything positive about Bruce or the experience, and says they were so poor after the 78 tour that they almost went on Unemployment Insurance, but were afraid that Rolling Stone would find out and the publicity would be bad. I found the interview unsettling, he seems to exude no joy from the experience, (which of course is his right). He does talk about being flush after BITUSA, and seems to be honest about the misperceptions people have when you have been in a famous band. I wonder if he is the band member Bruce mentions in his book about being upset that he wasn't being compensated enough.
He is a fantastic bass player . I recall years ago he was saying he wasn't happy with the tunnel if love era. He said the magic was gone. Bruce says in his book a few of the band were miffed at Scialfa joining the E Streeters
We know about Clemons, Federici and Tallent not being happy with the pay. Springsteen always seemed to like the Big Man so that wasn't really a problem I guess. The other two, I'm not so sure. Springsteen wrote in his book that Federici always had money problems. I don't remember anything about Tallent from the book so they problably don't like each other much..? Weinberg and Bittan are on good terms with Springsteen as far as I know.
Yes, I believe the issue you mention in your last sentence was addressed by Peter Ames Carlin in his Springsteen biography, Bruce. When The E Street Band was reformed in '99 for the Reunion tour, Tallent indicated he was offered the same pay he received on the original The River tour of '80-'81.
I could be wrong, but I thought the band was pretty well compensated. I had heard they split the live show revenue equally while Bruce got the lion's share of the record money. Which until BITUSA was pretty meager at both ends. In the book Bruce claims to be pretty much broke until the River tour or so. So it makes sense that the band wasn't getting rich if the boss wasn't getting rich. These days it's a different story, of course and I have no idea how the band is being paid.
I would much rather 1-2 releases per year a la Dylan that have the sound these shows deserve over a monthly release that tends to not get repeated listens. Neil Young also does a great job with his archives.
I’d agree with you on Bittan since he was the only E Streeter heavily involved in the 90-93 Other Band era.
I read years ago Nils was amazed when he joined for the BITUSA tour that the money was split equally for live shows. I guess Neil Young had a different system...
This is an excellent post. It sums up my feelings on how they have essentially botched many of these classic shows. If it is difficult to listen to a Roxy 78, Nassau 12/31/80 or Winterland 12/16 something is wrong. It is stunning that this team has remained steadfast in presenting these shows with the level of compression they have. I truly believe that the Springsteen team is clueless and behind the curve on many issues. Good god, forty years to get Winterland right and they have blown it. I will never again listen to the 12/16 show.
I like Garry because he’s the only guy in the band who speaks up. He doesn’t kiss up. I would love it if he wrote a book. SVZ speaks up, but it’s all bulls— that comes out of his mouth.
In Bruce’s book he mentions how a certain band member was unhappy about pay and that he took that certain band member to the bathroom and made him look in the mirror or something. It was so lame that he couldn’t just say who it was. It happened 40 years ago.
Despite their fame, they were all barely keeping their heads above water until the mid 80's. At one point in 1977, it got so bad that everybody was paid in IOU's. By his own admission, Bruce was a control freak and tough guy to be around in those days. I know some people on the crew from that time, and they don't paint a particularly happy picture. However, Garry has always seemed like a low-key, straight shooter kind of guy. I think he was being honest as opposed to expressing unhappiness. One thing is for sure...he's a helluva great bass player.
