Building a System based on Music Preference

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to build a system (kind of from scratch) based on my music preference, and would like your guidance on where to start and on what components will help in achieving a good sound and long listening sessions with my music choice...

About 65% of the type of music that I listen it is Trip Hop/Downtempo/Acid Jazz/Relaxed electronic music (like Air, Nightmares on Wax, Massive Attack, Morcheeba, Zero 7), 10% Rock music (like mainstream 70's Rock, Classic Rock), 10-15% Deep Funk Revival/Soul music (like The Bamboos, Cookin' on 3 Burners, Quantic, Alice Russell), and 5-10% Pop music and Jazz music.

In terms of components want to have in the system:
Source: Turntable, CD and streaming (Spotify for now and potentially go to hi-res music)... I don't think SACD/DVD-A/Blu-ray Audio will be needed since most of the music I listen to isn't released in these formats
Amplification: Not sure here, separates or integrated, full solid state or tube or go hybrid, with internal or external phono stage and DAC
Speakers: Floorstanding or Bookshelfs with Sub

Regarding sound characteristics , what should I be looking for, something that is more dynamic/fun/warmer sounding or something that is more analytical/accurate

The system will be placed in an open concept apartment living room/dining room area which is about 23x18 with about 10' ceiling.

What I would like to spend is 10k for everything. What I currently have in terms of components are:
Pro-ject Carbon Debut Esprit SB with Ortofon 2M Blue, Cambridge Audio CXC CD transport, Bluesound Node 2i, Schiit Freya+ Preamp, Schitt Bifrost 2 Multibit DAC, Mies P50 Phono stage, and a REL T/7i sub... So if any of these components are good enough to keep that would help in lowering the spending or better off selling them off and using the money towards the new stuff

Sorry for the long post and thank you for your help.

 

Seems to me that everything you (currently?) have is good. Looks like you need an amp and speakers? $10k for just those or total? If so how much is the current running total?

PS/Edit: OK seems you have amp and speakers too. Never heard of either but that doesn’t mean anything or that they’re not great. Disclaimer: I have not heard any of your components ... but that won’t stop me from commenting!

Maybe just new more conventional speakers that can be placed out from the walls? and still reproduce full range?

 

Maybe move up the Pro-ject and Ortofon lines if you like those brands? Seems like your power amp is 4 channels, but specs certainly seem like it could drive about anything ... probably best to get some new speakers then see how things sound, maybe upgrade the amp later?

I would guess based on your music tastes to remain in the accurate camp. The Freya+ (which seems to me to be excellent, no need to upgrade at this time) can be tweaked with different tubes to get a little more or less warmth if that's desirable (later, after settling in with new speakers and/or amp(s)). Various tubes sound different, from clear/accurate to warm/creamy ... but to me this is a subtle thing, usually not in-your-face different. Which IMHO is where you want to remain.

Speakers? Ay, there's the rub. Hundreds to choose from. Given the bass demands of some of your music, a full range speaker seems best, unless you want to have nearfield monitors with a sub (which is the way I fly, driven by 300B SETs). Actually I also have a SS amp and semi-full range towers too as an alternate. Use the sub with both.

Not to toot my own horn too much, but my MA Silver 8s (actually their new version Silver 300) has been praised by hard rock/metal/funk aficionados in other threads ... SO maybe if you want to spend more $$$ something from their Gold or Platinum line? Not 100% sure, but IIUC the MA's bass is full and decently deep, accurate, and not boomy (of course room placement has a lot to do with this as well). I still like the sub to plumb the deepest notes when needed, and flesh out the room sound/ambience ...

Having this response will benefit all music, as a lot of (venue) room sound is manifested in the lower octaves. So even for non-bass heavy music, it's good to have a solid foundation.

Then for amps, just because I'm intrigued with them, some PS Audio Stellar amps? Stellar M700 Power Amplifier or even Stellar M1200 Power Amplifier which also has a tube driver stage which can possibly be tweaked as well for flavoring.

Maybe an ever newer Purifi based amp(s)? VTV AMPLIFIER Stereo Purifi Audio 1ET400A Dual Mono (Two Power Supplies) Amplifier | VTV Amplifier or NAD Intros C 298 Power Amplifier With Purifi Eigentakt Amplification - NAD Electronics ...

I actually wish I'd have considered the PS Audio amp(s) before buying the 60# beast (Parasound A 21) I have now, but it's there ensconced in the lower shelf in my rack, so will remain.

If you want to stick with Class A/AB, Parasound is always a good choice, but yes, a lot heavier.

 

Thanks for the reply Rick58

My current amp and speakers are being used for double duty with my HT setup. That's why I'm considering a more stereo oriented amp and speakers.
For the TT I'm looking to upgrade it later on (considering a Thorens or Technics), but I'm considering of trying an MC cartridge first, so would need a new phono stage as my current one is MM only... I did try some tube tube rolling with the Freya and I'm happy with it so far... Would it be better to go with a ss amp or a tube amp to mate with the Freya? Not sure about going Class A or A/B, well I guess how efficient the speakers would be, did look into PS Audio Stellar line for amp, but wasn't too sure if they match my music...
Speaker wise I was considering Sonus Faber Sonetto line or would they be too warm for my needs, also I'm not looking for near field listening, more on something that will fill the room, but I don't listen at high volumes (usually mid 70's dB).

 

Sorry I can't address your specifics ... but think probably SS with the Freya+ would be good. Class A/AB or switching, D, whatever seems to be more of a toss up these days? I think most power amps would match your music, assuming good power and current delivery. Of course I"m NOT an "all amps sound the same" guy! but in general, many should be very satisfying, if somewhat/subtly different in their presentations.

I don't know about SF, certainly extremely well regarded, lots of McIntosh folks like to use SF. I don't know though ... may not be the best match for your heavier music? For 70s rock, jazz, etc., would more likely be excellent, I think. McIntosh tends to be smooth too, maybe a PS Audio + SF combo? I don't really know what the PS Audio amps 'are' ... neutral, I'd expect but could be wrong.

IIUC McIntosh SS (as well as Parasound) amps tend to be neutral with just a 'skoch' of smoothness. Maybe that's OK with the SF, maybe they're actually more transparent/neutral than I'm thinking. Hopefully more folks with experience will chime in. I don't think any of these would sound 'bad' in the least ... just maybe a little leaning toward one way or the other. I don't think you'd get super-creamy ultra-warm mush from anything discussed so far!

PS: I'm sitting here behind/off to the side of my Silver 8s in my 'office' niche, listening to them being driven by the A 21 thru a P 7 preamp (Cambridge 840C CD player, and lashed together with Analysis Plus cables). <i>All We Are Saying</i> is sublime. May be something similar to what you like ...

Make sure you get GOOD cables with all this. My current fave is Analysis Plus for about everything ... have some Shunyata Venom PCs on the SS gear. I can't justify/get away with spending >$500 per cable/type, but what I have sounds damn good to me. $150 PCs, $300/pair AP ICs, $400 (when I bought them 20 years ago) AP Oval 9 speaker cables. Yep, good stuff.

Forgot about the 840C to P 7 cables: White Zombie $120 balanced ICs, all silver with teflon insulation. I'd recommend balanced connections where possible, the Freya+ has them, might as well use them.

 

Personally, I'd consider doing it in stages.

I'd keep the turntable/arm and CD transport. For now.

I'd consider a new class D amp with a built-in DAC. There are exceptional mosfet-based ones, which should supply the 'tone' you are used to but with very high quality, like the Gato Audio DIA-250S (250w/500w). Free delivery to your door from Denmark, duty paid! c. US$3,500.

To this I would try something like JBL L100 Classics. c. US$4,000 (though you may get a deal).

With the balance, I'd get a decent phono stage for US$1,500 - maybe a Dynavector P75 mk4.

And then a great cartridge, like a Dynavector DV 20X2 Low.

I anticipate that this would produce lots of solid grins and boogie factor, plenty of dynamics and insight and tremendous speed (for cone drivers) with great solidity of tones and sound. It would also look good.

Even with the same transport and deck, you'll notice a tremendous change and hopefully upgrade. The next item to save for would be a better deck and arm, keeping the new cartridge.

Just my opinion. It's nice problem to have!

 

Yeah I agree, I think doing it in stages would be right way. I think looking into the speakers first as they would be more critical to getting the music to sound right. Not sure which speakers would give a more accurate sound and a good soundstage to fill the room, but not something that requires critical listening to really appreciate them.

 

It seems as though we share a lot of similarities in our tastes. My journey led me to Klipsch Cornwalls with EL34 tubes driving them. When I pop on something like Massive Attack - Angel, it just sounds perfect.

 

I think most of your equipment is excellent for the music you are into (I'm into a lot of the same stuff). I'd say you should strongly consider going with a Technics DD turntable in place of the Pro-Ject, it will have a more muscular presentation of beat-heavy music and withstand feedback much better than a belt drive if you crank it up. IMO there's not really a need to get into MC carts with these styles of music, the subtle musical details that MC reveals aren't really there in electronic based music, or in deep funk which tends to be on the low-fi side anyhow (remember, ****ty is pretty when it comes to funk!). Stick with the Blue if you like it, or try another flavor of MM if you just want to change it up.

There are probably hundreds of ways you can go as far as amplification and speakers go, I'd say pick an amp with the features that you like and then try to match speakers that will compliment the amp, rather than buying speakers first. Have fun, you have a great budget to work with. don't spend it all at once!

 

I’d simplify, go with a DAC pre amp & active speakers. Streamer is fine. Suggestion of Technics deck is a sound one. I have an ATC CDA2 into Active 40’s, LP12 TT. Plays everything I throw at it, had upper end naim set up before & prefer this.

 

If I were in your position, I would consider something like the Dutch & Dutch 8c speaker system.
This is an active speaker which subsume the DACs, subs, amps, room correction and can participate in
multi-room streaming.

Well, these are around $12K so a bit over your target... but I think this would be a great direction. Kal
Rubinson did a nice review on these a few years ago. Soundshapers carries the brand in Canada.

The Kii Three system is similar in spirit but a bit more costly.

 

Interesting. I haven’t thought of going to active speakers. Wonder how they would sound from a 10’ listening position. I’m thinking of having the speakers placed 10’ apart as well. Not sure if I need to go with full range floorstanding ones or will bookshelf will do

 

Get the best speakers and amp you can in the first instance.

Look for speakers with a large woofer 8inch - 12inch this will get you those low tones without having to worry about subs, this will fill your room with sound nicely.

The suggestion of the JBL L100 is a good one, they would suit your music preferences well and have good sensitivity, they have been measured at 90db+ @ 1m so will sound good at low volumes.

For an amp a good quality class D is the way to go IMHO, Marantz PM-KI Ruby is a great amp and works well with JBL. The Ruby also has a wonderful phono stage.

 

Whatever you do, keep your sub !!!
Especially with the kind of music you prefer.

 

Active speakers would be on my list if I were taking a fresh start today. Do read up on them in this moment when you have cash in pocket. Note that the Stereophile review measured the Dutch & Dutch to have a "...response [that] extends at full level to 20Hz." I really got the feeling from their write-up that this stand-mounted system is a real monster... and easily fits in your room. Because of the DSP, it's just as likely to work in all future rooms as well.

Also worth noting: these things are fully digital. The output of your turntable will be digitized, sent through the speaker's on-board processor and then converted back to analog. Personally I have no problem with this idea, but it won't suit everyone, for sure.

 

The Dutch & Dutch 8C look interesting indeed, will need to check them out. Although the whole A/D conversion is a bit worrying, but if they sound good then it wouldn't matter... I'm liking the look of the JBL L100's, has anyone tried them with a tube power amp or do these speakers require an ss amp to get their full potential?

 

Has anybody compared the JBL L100 Classics vs Sonus Faber Sonetto V? I know they are different kinds of speakers but they seem to some similar specs and are both 3 way speakers. Also, they are similarly priced... Which would be better suited to my music preference.

 

Being in an apartment style residence, I hope your neighbors have similar musical tastes!

 

I don't listen at high volumes, mostly mid 70's dB. So far I haven't gotten any complaints from neighbours... That's why I'm asking which speaker would firstly sound better with my music choice and secondly sound good at lower volumes

 

In one of the last paragraphs of John Marks' review of the L100 there is a suggestion that they may not do as well at low volumes. I don't think he's saying they fail, but simply they aren't the same jackpot you get when played louder. He does think they are a terrific value.

If you get them, I'm voting for the orange grill.

 

Although the orange grilles look good, I would be going for the blue ones, better matches with the colours in my living room... Has anyone tried them with tube amps, I've read somewhere that they might be on the bright side

 

OP, JBL 4429's and Parasound 2.1 P6 Preamplifier and HALO Power Amp. About $8000. This will get you effortless detail at low volume, as well as black as coal backgrounds at high volume. The adjustable high and low pass filters on Preamp will manage bass to your subwoofer to perfection at any listening level.

 

Will looking into them as well... but aren't going more towards the JBL sound means the speakers are more party type of speakers, which isn't what I'm looking for.

 

The fact that you listen at such low average levels opens up your choice of speakers greatly. I’d want a high current amp that can flesh out lower frequencies of the speakers at lower levels. Powerful high current amplification is about a lot more than just “loudness” and can bring speakers to life at lower SPLs.

 

Exactly, that’s why I’m confused on the speaker options. I don’t have enough experience with speakers to know what will be a good fit for me. Amps wise, I’m still debating of going full tube setup, Freya+ preamp and a tube power amp that will complement it. Or best to go with ss amp to better ‘control’ the bass