Burning SACD iso's to DVD-R's - how is that even possible?

Here's an older list of players:

sacd-ripper/sacd-ripper .

 

No, this list you provided in a link if I am correct is a list of players that can rip SACD discs to ISOs. The players being discussed are players that can play back a DVD-R with an SACD ISO burned to it. A different (and rare task).

 

From which I would conclude that it makes much more sense to have (get) a player capable of ripping SACDs, and then play the ripped tracks (from a server / hard drive / stick) using that same player, rather than ripping an ISO file, and then burning it to a disc and playing the disc.

Jeff

 

I prefer burning the ISO's to DVD disc and play them on a Denon DVD-2910 they sound wonderful and yes my ears do hear a big difference between standard CD and SACD-R I also have a Sony BDP-S370 both work and sound good my setup is a Kenwood Basic C2 a Kenwood Basic M2a connected to a pair of Infinity Kappa 7.1 I have no complaints about sound quality of the SACD-R's

 

It’s just fun to clone an SACD and drop it into a player and see it work perfect - because it was designed to not let anyone ever be able to do this.

To do the impossible is worth doing just to do it.

 

Call me crazy but I always thought SACD-Rs sounded a little better than their pressed siblings.

 

I have recorded some of my SACD's to Reel tape and it sounds wonderful the warmth that seems to have gone missing came back in a real nice way the bass tightens up and the highs (due to my age anything above 16,000 Khz I can't hear) are clear clean not sterile just clean

 

Is an SACD-R the iso copied exactly the same?, or is the information extracted like a DVD video R is please ie, Vob and Audio after the extraction, then burned to disc?.

 

Only when ultra high-end cables are fully broken in and used can one hear this difference.

 

Call me crazy but I've always thought that all my CD's and SACD's sound better ripped, on the case of CD's to FLAC and SACD's as DFF, sound better played from my Toshiba SSD than the discs themselves. This may be a jitter issue (I think reading from a SSD may be less jittery than reading from an optical disc) or who know what.

 

possibly crazy, but there are 2 different transports (SSD vs optical) in your example, so there could be differences there

definitely crazy if they're both being played in the same player- sacd's are DVD media, so it's even the the same laser in the transport reading both discs!

 

though I guess the people at universal japan would say the dvd-r sounds better because it's single layer lol (assuming hybrid pressed sacds and single layer blank dvd-r)

 

Doesn't the laser pick up have to work harder to read hybrid SACD's? There's an in between layer that the pick up has to pass through to read the DSD layer, or is it the other way around? All Iknow by reading these forums and others is that when a SACD player starts to fail hybrid SACD's are the first ones to have issues with.

 

yeah, the shm-sacd people in japan argue that the diffusion of the laser beam caused by traveling through the extra layer in a hybrid disc can affect sound. that's also why shm-sacds and shm-cd's use different plastic that's supposed to be more optically clear- less diffusion of the laser beam and supposedly better accuracy reading the pits and lands on the disc.

 

And who's making SHM-SACD's for Universal Music Japan? The discs, I have several of them, look like regular DADC Japan made to me. Do you think if this is the case Sony's DADC Japan is its manufacturing specs just for a "special" kind of SACD disc for Universal? I don't think so.
Universal Music Japan also boasts on its literature about SHM-SACD that they're not using data compression on their releases, but they don't need to use Direct Stream Transfer to compress DSD data on their SHM-SACD's as all of them as far as I know are stereo only releases that don't need DST.

 

Oh I'm not saying I believe ANY of the SHM claims, just saying that's what Universal says!

 

I've been using the app MirethMusic (mirethMusic - macOS Rip, Convert, Burn | Mireth Technology ) for Mac to burn DVD-Audio discs from FLAC files downloaded from HDtracks and it works great. There were some bumps in the road in terms of configuration choices, but not bad and the DVD-A's sound great. I'm happy to answer any questions that might come up for new users.

 

Hi, guys (and girls, if any). Many thanks to those who had contributed. Interesting posts. I didn't have enough time to read everything, but still... What is rather striking is how civil it is. Not a single outburst or slap on the face. You are all a credit to the audiophile race.
I am somewhat technical. My main digital rig is a JRiver 25 running on a MediaServer PC hidden in a special bedroom where it sadly always sleeps by itself. How it connects to the audio rig (a USB cable) and what the rig consists of is not important.
When I read this thread I immediately got a Marantz UD5005 , which is on the list. Got a test SACD (Telarc Classical Sampler 6) to make sure the player works. I tried burning DSOTM SACD ISO using ImgBurn on a DVD+R. The Marantz doesnt recognize it. Says "Unknown Disk". I wasted 5 disks. Then I realized my mistake and got a short spindle of DVD-R's instead. Same story.
Please understand this. I have no problem playing the ISO's in JRiver player. It plays them just fine. With a couple of mastering and broadcasting VST plugins JRiver makes any bad recordings sound like they were engineered by Alan Parsons (of course, the VST plugins do nothing for really good or really bad recordings).
You may ask "then why do you even bother with physical media, it is expensive, prone to failures, requires space, not to mention is hopelessly obsolete?"
The answer is just because of this thread. I love technical challenges. Chances are even if it worked, I would have probably burned just 10 SACD ISO's out of a thousand I have on an external drive and then, as always, would have lost interest and turned to another worthless challenge to eventually abandon. But this business of the Marantz - which is on the list - not being able to read the DVD-R SACD's bothers me.
Why doesn't the Marantz work? Are there certain DVD-R or DVD+R brands I should have used? Or may be I should have picked another player? Or some firmware in another player?
Who has done this successfully, not just posted his/her opinion (however informed or even expert) , but has actually burned a SACD-R ISO to a disk and played it not in a PS3 but in a real SACD player ?
Thanks a lot and please stay home. Boy, will this "stay home" part will raise questions in 5-10 years when all this craziness is forgotten and one of the surviving 500mln COVID survivors on this planet will read this thread.

 

Damn you’ve been workin on this for a bit!
SACD-R | Audiogon Discussion Forum
that post is from 2017!
Also found your thread here when I googled your question
AVS Marantz UD5005 Owner's Thread: All questions...

Sounds like a couple people there had actual success so I’m not sure why it refuses to work on yours. If any of them are still responding i would check what firmware is on their players compared to yours.
Good luck, I admire your persistence and I hope you meet success!

 

I don't have a Marantz but I have a Pioneer combo player that plays SACD-Rs and have used various brands of DVD-R and DVD+R discs with no issues. It sounds like you're doing everything right. I also use ImgBurn to create my discs. The one difference I notice from one of your AVS forum posts is that I cannot see any file structure on the burned discs on my PC. They just show as a blank disc for me. Have you tried different ISO files in your tests?

 

I am afraid you are giving credit when no credit is due. You are confusing persistence with simple short attention span (or forgetfulness). I totally forgot I ever posted that question on AVS three years ago! Couldn't believe it was me, but there were my rig pics. Unbelievable. I am shocked that my interest in this endeavour lasted full five days back in 2017.
Anyways, it seems this SACD-R Marantz business works in cycles for me.
Regarding using different ISO files. The DSOTM (or any Pink Floyd SACD) is the main reason I even doing this. There are a few others TELARCs, Linn, MoFi, Marantz, etc), but I am not interested playing SACD's only because they are SACD's. It has got to be the music I like.
If any of you have the Marantz UD5005, can you please check the firmware version? I dont have a lot of time, unfortunately, my brain will automatically reset in 3 short days and I will devote myself to another worthless exercise like playing GameCube games on my iPhone, which is, according to my son, is an actual thing.

 

Yes, I’ve done this several times. Actually just threw out a handful of discs I experimented on from way back. Haven’t done it lately, so my memory is probably foggy on some of the particulars. But I definitely played them back on OPPO BDP-93 and 95 models. I don’t think I even have either of those any longer in order to test with.

 

Several years ago, I was able to successfully make SACD-Rs out of a few of my own SACD's ISOs that I had ripped with a PS3. Yes these played, and were recognized as SACDs on both my Oppo 93 and on my Oppo 103. And both of these players can still play these disks today But this only still works because I deliberately stopped updating the firmware on these players when I read that the newer firmwares removed the ability to play SACD-Rs.

I don't know if Marantz updates the firmware on their BluRay players too. But if they do, then they likely removed this feature long ago much like Oppo did.

 

Thanks. I think I figured out why doesn't work in my Marantz UD5005. Here are some clues.
When I insert the TELARC SACD sampler it doesnt show it as such like in this picture:

The front display on the Marantz says "CD" no matter what I do. That is for an actual purchased SACD, not a cooked up SACD-R. But the real TELARC disk is three things in one: a conventional CD, a stereo SACD and a multi-channel SACD. The Marantz couldn't care less about the last two function, it insists on playing the test TELARC disk as a CD. Now, lets say the UD5005 is so old (it is) they didn't get around to switching the display at the time yet. It only has two options : "BDMV" and "CD". It does switch to BDMV and plays Blurays just fine in surround mode.
But the unit is sold as a BD/SACD/CD player and it looks like the SACD functionality either wasn't available or it is faulty in my unit.
Therefore, here is what I understand is happening. I create a SACD-R on DVD-R. The Marantz only understands two languages: BD or CD. The SACD-R is neither.
But it wasn't a total loss. This rig is a stereo rig. It has a turntable, a tube power amp and so on. There is so much thought went into the digital route as well, it is very good. Now, this tri-yearly SACD-R exercise made me bring a Marantz 5.2 AVR from another bedroom, unused (both the bedroom ad the Marantz). I also brought in and connected a center and surround speakers to the Marantz AVR. So, over the past three days I have been listening to 5.2 surround from a garden variety $400 Marantz AVR instead of 2.2 stereo on choice equipment (the L/R speakers and subs are the same, though). So, even though the SACD-R attempt is proven futile (again!), the difference between bad surround and good stereo sound was striking. It turns out (like you didn't know this, right?) you dont need surround equipment to pull you into the music.

 

Looking through the manual for the UD5005, it appears to be a little bit tricky to get it to play the SACD layer of a hybrid disc. With no disc in the player, press the USB/Disc button on the front panel to select Disc Mode. Then hold in the Sound Mode button on the front panel or the remote for 2 seconds to get it to cycle to the next option, which will be either Multi, Video, or BD. Repeat this process of holding in the button for 2 seconds until you get to Multi. Then (still with no disc in the player) press the Sound Mode button briefly to cycle through 3 more options, which are Multi, Stereo, and CD. If you will just be listening in stereo, choose the Stereo option. Your choice will stay in memory as long as no one accidentally pushes the Sound Mode button in the future. If that still doesn't work, it suggests something has gone wrong with your player.