Can a cheap turntable damage records (MY 1ST POST!)

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dennis1077, Jan 5, 2010.

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  1. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Sweet. I was about to oder cables along with the Pre-amp, never thinking about the possibility that they would be included with the turntable.
     
  2. mrt2

    mrt2 Active Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI, USA
    Yes, but the OP is a newbie who doesn't really know TTs. There was a thread here a couple of months ago posted by someone who went and bought a used TTs and got burned. It takes time to figure out what is a good table and what is not. The ProJect is fairly simple to set up, comes with a warranty, and should work just fine for years before it has any service issues at all. My ProJect is 12 years old and the only thing it has ever needed was a cartridge.

    I argued this same issue last year over at AK, but my opinion was drowned out by all the vintage people over there and the guy wound up with a 30 year old midfi table (I think maybe it was a Sansui) that arrived DOA. For the money this guy spent repairing the table (had some sort of servo motor/electronic control issue), he could have bought himself a ProJect Expression or Rega P2.
     
  3. webbcity

    webbcity Forum Resident

    This confuses me...you're talking about the maintenance that his new table will eventually need, and thinking that a used table is better because it might only need a new belt and a cart? Sorry, I don't get it...this is backwards.

    I used to own an old Dual turntable which, yes, I loved at the time and thought was great for the $150 or so I paid for it, but when I got my Pro-Ject it clearly beat the pants off the Dual. I owned the Dual for a year or so and it needed a new belt and some additional work, then it finally bit the dust. The Pro-Ject (which I have owned for a year and a half at this point) has so far required zero maintenance, and I don't expect any issues for quite a while.
     
  4. Jay F

    Jay F New Member

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    I just bought a Debut III, and I like it very much.

    A few years back, I bought one of your proverbial "reliable, great sounding used turntables" for $150, a Dual 12**, supposedly "renovated" by some clown, and it was a total POS. Not only did it not sound good, I couldn't even walk back to my chair without it skipping. Because it was "vintage," the sale was "As Is," so all I could do was sell it--at a loss.

    I'm sure there really is a "reliable, great sounding used turntable" out there that only needs a new belt and cartridge (and a mother's love). It's probably at one of the three stores in every town where they sell NM UK Beatles albums for $10.
     
  5. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

  6. mrt2

    mrt2 Active Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI, USA
    That is the dream right? A 30 some year old TOTL table that was owned by an older gentleman who died shortly after he purchased the table, passed it on to his kids and sat, unused for all this time. Sort of the TT equivalent of the used car owned by a little old lady who drove it to church on Sundays.
     
  7. webbcity

    webbcity Forum Resident

  8. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

  9. Jay F

    Jay F New Member

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
  10. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Sweet! Still, wouldn't I need a second cable to connect the preamp to the receiver?
     
  11. mrt2

    mrt2 Active Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI, USA
    Dude, you are overthinking this. You can get cheap interconnects anywhere; online, Radio Shack, Best Buy, any fancy audio boutique. Just get up and running and you can play around with interconnects later, if that is your inclination.
     
  12. Mellenhead

    Mellenhead Active Member

    Location:
    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Yes.
     
  13. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    LOL. I do have a tendency to overthink things! I just figured I'd order one at the same time I ordered the pre-amp, sort of save myself a trip later on.
     
  14. attym

    attym Forum Resident

    Location:
    US
    I think my point was missed in terms of regular turntable maintenance which all turntables new, used, cheap or very expensive require (setting tracking force, new belt, align cart...) I'm not saying used is the best route, its just an affordable option when getting into vinyl. While $349 seems like a bargain (and I agree that it is for decent table), to some just getting into vinyl, it could be seen as a bit more then they want to spend on something that could be a passing fad to them. To buy new, anything less than that falls under the "can a cheap turn table hurt your vinyl" category and I feel it does. You could spend $100 or less on a Technics direct drive SL-D2 (just an example), put a new cart on it and be good to go. It won't hurt your vinyl, it will sound decent and you can grow from there.
    Certainly with 30+ year old equipment, it might not be 100% perfect or reliable, that's sort of the trade off. I've always been very lucky with my used equipment.
     
  15. Jay F

    Jay F New Member

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    I don't know. The seller or manufacturer of the preamp will know, though.
     
  16. PhilBiker

    PhilBiker sh.tv member number 666

    Location:
    Northern VA, USA
    What part of the fact that the turntable decision has already been made do you not understand?:)
     
  17. Macman

    Macman Forum Resident

    I have no qualms about buying used, especially if you can find something online in your city and go check it out first. Audiophiles usually take good care of their stuff and are selling it for no other reason than they want to try something else. It's a great way to get a lot more bang for the buck.
     
  18. attym

    attym Forum Resident

    Location:
    US
    "What part of the fact that the turntable decision has already been made do you not understand?"


    ok, end thread, discussion is over.
     
  19. mrt2

    mrt2 Active Member

    Location:
    Milwaukee, WI, USA
    I don't exactly disagree, if the OP could get a quality used table with a warranty. I actually like the notion of fixing up, restoring a quality, older piece of equipment, and I have pursued restoration projects for things like bicycles and watches (and have made a few mistakes along the way as well. Some of my vintage watch restorations have turned out great, and some have broken again within a year or two) The lessons I have gleaned from these watch and bike restorations applies (IMO) to turntables. In other words, it might be worthwhile to go after a vintage high end table, such as a SOTA, Ariston, Thorens or Linn. On the other hand, some of your mid fi tables, good though they were 30 years ago, might not be the best choice for a vintage restoration project, sort of the TT equivalent of buying a beat up old Schwinn Varsity with the hope of turning it into a serious road bike. Said Schwinn might be OK for a college student looking for a cheap beater bike, but not a good choice for someone seriously looking to get into road biking.

    The OP is already out $120 for a junk TT that he bought at a big box store and wants to get moving in the right direction. If the OP already owned a SL-D2, I might agree that he should try to make it work for him until he knows this hobby is for him. But he wants to step up to something halfway decent and after 14 pages, that is what the OP wants to do.
     
  20. mattstrike

    mattstrike New Member

    Dennis - Check yr PMs!
    Sent you a message about thread related thingsā€¦
     
  21. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I was just about to order a Audio Technica PEQ3 Phono Preamp for my eventual purchase of a Pro-Ject Debut 3 turntable. Before I ordered one, I wanted to ensure it was compatable with the Project.

    According to the specs, it is "Designed for turntables using a moving-magnet (MM) type cartridge; not for use with moving-coil (MC) type cartridges."

    Man, I have NO IDEA what that's all about. My Pro-ject comes with a "Fitted cartridge Ortofon OM 5E" Whether it's moving magnet or moving coil.......I certainly don't know.

    Does anyone know if this pre-amp will work with the Pro-ject?
     
  22. PhilBiker

    PhilBiker sh.tv member number 666

    Location:
    Northern VA, USA
    It will be fine.
     
  23. dennis1077

    dennis1077 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Sweet. I'm ordering one NOW! :)
     
  24. Jay F

    Jay F New Member

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    It is an MM cartridge. The preamp should work fine.

    http://ortofon.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=44&Itemid=64
     
  25. jeendicott

    jeendicott Forum Resident

    Piping in here re new versus restored. I've spent the last couple of months looking for a second table for the basement and was intrigued with the idea of restoring a vintage machine. I went through a local dealer and got a Thorens TD165. I liked it, but didn't love it, so I took it back with the intent of upgrading to a TD125 with Audio Technica tonearm. They installed the Grado cart, went to turn it on, and... nothing. Long story short, after about a month installing new parts, it was pronounced DNR (do not resuscitate). Lucky it was still under warranty. That was my one experience with vintage tables. :(

    I ended up ordering a Pro-ject Xpression which I'll hopefully have this weekend. I also ordered a Speed Box and already have a Cambridge Audio 640p. Looking forward to hearing how it stacks up against the Rega P25 in my "A system."

    At risk of getting too off-topic, I've heard mixed things about the Sumika Oyster cart that comes with the Xpression. Is there an alternate cart (Ortofon 2M Red/Blue, Grado Green) that would add major bang for the buck? Or should I just sit tight with the Oyster for now and save up for a Dynavector 10x5 (which sounds fantastic on the Rega)?
     
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