Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by dennis1077, Jan 5, 2010.
Not too dificult.
That WAS easy. Its only $50 more than the AT-PL120. I gotta admit, the Project looks A LOT nicer than the AT. One of the posters expressed concern about having to sort of guess what 1.8 is on the counterweight. That's really my only issue with it at this point. Let's say I get it wrong......I mistakenly set it as 2.2 or some other misguided number. What happens then? Undue wear and tear on my records? Distorted sound? Nothing at all?
No cartridge mouting there.... It took me a LOT longer than two minutes to align my cartridge to the protractors I downloaded. And it was fun!
Probably barely perceptible sound difference, but you'll wreck your records. Tracking force is the most important thing!!!!
I want to see that thing playing a RCA Dynaflex pressing.
It will be very hard to choose the wrong tracking force everything is very clearly labelled. Increased tracking force can lead to distortion and more wear on your records. But like i said just match the tracking force with the cart (this info will be given to u, stock carts on project tables usually track around 2) and your good to go.
That's what has me nervous. Without clear markers on the counterweight I'm reluctant to purchase a turntable.
The markings on the counter weight of project and musichall turntables are very clear.
Sweet! I think I'm going to end up going with the Project. Now, if only that damn W2 would show up in the mail...
You're right, my bad. I was thinking of the Regas, which as I recall have a single white line, which isn't terribly helpful. Haven't see a Music Hall in person but from the photos I don't see any numbers on the counterweight. Having a bunch of lines but no numbers doesn't count.
The Project certainly looks more refined, and I'm sure it's a great choice too.
I used to own a music hall 2.1 they do have the markings, after all their tonearms are pro-ject.
ah well, one out of three isn't bad, unless someone's going to chime and say the Rega's have numbers now too.
Tracking force markings or not on a counterweight, I'd still get the cheap Shure tracking force gauge. The accuracy of those markings without using a gauge to calibrate it are going to rely on how well you "float"/level the arm horizontally when the force is set to zero.
As was suggested before I hope you try a couple different 'tables before you buy.
ALL of these matters of convenience surely come second to a TT's sound quality?
Dennis, I know you want simplicity, convenience, plug and play etc. But don't forget good old fashion sound quality. I little pain for long term gain. I've been down your track only a couple of years ago and after making some blunders.... you get what you pay for. you don't need to be a genius to setup a turntable. a good dealer (Rega/Pro-ject) will help you too.
I'd take sound quality over the 12 second inconvenience of lifting off the platter to change from 33/45.
Yeah, the Pro-Jects are well marked and easy to set. My current table has a Rega tonearm, and it really has nothing on the counter-weight to help you set it. My current combination sounds better than my previous Pro-ject, but the Pro-ject was probably a more appropriate design for a newbie.
I don't necessarily see the two as being mutually exclusive.
No one said that it didn't.
At this price point the sound quality should be pretty close for all the turntables being discussed. So other factors come into play.
Do you want the hassle of removing the platter just to change speeds? (and it's not just for singles, there are lots of LPs cut at 45rpm).
Do you want the added headache/risk of mounting/aligning a cart when you can't detach the headshell in order to do it?
I value good sound overall, but good design is important too.
I hear you. I'm not going to be able to afford another turntable for a LONG time so this has to make me happy for the next 5-6 years.
To be honest, I'm using price to determine my choice here. The Music Hall is going for $449, The Rega $395, while the Project Debut 3 retails for $349. These all look to be the same table and whatever differences there may be, they're sure to be subtle and virtually non-existent to a newbie like myself. Using this reasoning, I'm leaning towards the cheapest.......the Project!
Good point. Now, if I'm not mistaken, this is already mounted intially. You would only have to do this if you wanted to upgrade.....OR......is it part of the initial setup?
Here's the thing bonjo. I am not disrespecting the AT table. Had the OP bought that to begin with, my advice to him would be to stick with it for a year or 2 until he knows whether he wants to seriously get into vinyl, then seriously upgrade to something much better (ProJect perspective, Rega P3, Nottingham Horizon, VPI, or Linn) when he is ready.
But, he did not do that, he bought a cheap table that a lot of folks believe will damage his records. Not bad as a novelty or something for playing really scratched or beat up records but not appropriate for a serious music lover or collector. Now if he goes with the AT, it is at best a stopgap. Might last a year or two, who knows? More important, if the OP is not satisfied with the AT, he will still not know if vinyl is for him, as the AT is not really an audiophile table, more a replica of those 70s and 80s DD tables that guys like me grew up with. It maybe more convenient, but if you are after convenience these days, there are a lot of ways other than vinyl to get your music conveniently.
Something like the ProJect/Rega is a fine sounding table, and the OP would need to consider upgrading the rest of his stereo before getting around to upgrading the table again, so a few bucks more should hold him for the next 7 or 8 years, if not longer. Plus the ProJect is upgradable, as cart, platter, and speedbox upgrades are available. The AT is plug and play, but, to my knowledge there is no upgrade path.
No, the ProJect comes with a cart mounted. That should last your at least a couple of years. I used the cart that came with my table for about 2 years before switching to Grado, and I have used that for the last 10 years. Hopefully if you work with a b & m store, they would show you how to mount a new cart when you need to do that in a few years.
Dennis, go and read the Maybe vinyl isn't for me thread. That guy bought 2 cheaper turntables, and was disappointed. For the same money, he could have had 1 decent (new or used) table.
I guess I should point out that this isn't a fad for me. I live and breathe music, and even with my cheap Pioneer, vinyl has made music SO MUCH more enjoyable to me. I'm certainly here to stay!
I don't understand how you would know with the table you have. I realize you are a musician, so maybe you are attuned to something I am not, but I always hated the sound of vinyl on a cheap turntable, and would take digital any day over the sort of table you have now.
I am in the camp that believes that while vinyl has a certain intangible quality, it doesn't start to get really good until you get into much better turntables than we are talking about here.
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