My main gripe with this type of thing is that it presents itself not so much as opinion but as canonical fact from which these HIP hucksters are deviating in devilish ways. I'm perfectly fine with people preferring non-HIP recordings. They're your ears; do with them what you will. I personally enjoy both HIP and non-HIP interpretations. But to insist that one speaks for a whole community and that one has some kind of omniscience about this music - that's ironically just the kind of arrogance they are ascribing to HIP practitioners and acolytes.
Thank you! I'm pondering whether to go all out and get Bach 333 for Christmas if I get a job offer! YOLO.
Coming back to my question... And what do you think of Alban Berg Quartet box? Maybe the best idea is to get this one? I mean instead of Prażak or Emersons. I don't need many boxes, I would like to get just one.
Hey, what about us Brits? We have The English Concert (founded by Trevor Pinnock) and the English Baroque Soloists, still led by John Eliot Gardiner. Equally good, but less well knows are the Gabrielli Consort led by Paul McCreesh.
There is tons of HIP presence in the US and it's very well taught in the conservatories. It might not be as concentrated as European countries just because of the sheer size of the US but it is very much alive and well. I wouldn't put down to people liking or not liking HIP as a national thing. Some people just don't like it. I would say the main contributor to this is the best HIP performances I have heard are from the 2000s onward (some exceptions like the best AoF or WTC from Leonhardt on DHM) and people might have only been exposed to early HIP or proto HIP. There is literally a quote of Hogwood saying verbatim that his goal in making recordings was to make them sound like a lab environment. When you make recordings like that it's no wonder that HIP gets a bad name. Whereas now we have HIP musicians that can rely on all the past knowledge and research that has been unearthed and play with great feeling as well.
Since I'm new to HIP, I can only say I enjoyed the sound of a Das Alte Werk CD I recently bought and want to hear more. But where does that label fit in with this movement? Is Archiv part of it, too? Thanks.
Das Alte Werk was a series, not a label; it was part of the Teldec label, which is now owned by Warner. Archiv is a subsidiary of the Deutsche Grammophon label, which is owned by Universal.
Archiv was around before the HIP movement took hold. As others have alluded too, early label artists like Karl Richter weren't HIP, but I think they went wholesale HIP arund the 80s (?) To be fair, harpsichords were not great quality before the authenticity movement led to more investment in building better models.
Thought I'd post this in the midst of all this HIP discussion I had a couple of Herreweghe's individual Harmonia Mundi CDs of the cantatas and immediately fell in love with them, they are such warm inviting interpretations but still conveying pathos when the music calls for it. It was 5+ years searching for this box (I didn't want to buy the individual volumes as those were also quite expensive secondhand), but I finally got this and two other hard to find boxes thanks to an old online Headfi friend in Europe. Gardiner's Archiv CDs were the first I heard and they're fine performances, but aside from a couple of cantatas I prefer the SDG performances which are more spontaneous and less academic sounding. And I'll have to disagree with Hurwitz on the Rilling as being something that is incredibly special. They're ok performances. I streamed nearly all of Karl Richter (note I didn't grow up with LPs) and I desperately needed another excuse to buy another cycle but I just didn't find the performances very satisfying and a bit superficial, like everything in a "romantic soup." And I should point out this Amazon reviewer either had a wonky set or might have been mistaken as I have ripped every one of the 27 CDs without issue, each disc only taking a couple of minutes in dbpoweramp. Sold Suzuki - very beautiful and angelic throughout but lacking in pathos when needed, and it was selling for crazy amounts when it went OOP. I have Suzuki in the secular cantatas, they're good if the cantatas themselves aren't up to how great the sacred ones are. If you couldn't tell these are among my most favorite works in the entire classical repertoire. I listen to at least a CD a day, some days many more. I'm not religious but I consider myself spiritual. JSB is food for the soul.
The Herreweghe Bach box is the only one I’ve simply given up looking forward/admitted defeat with. Very happy for you! (And agree about his Bach!) I know what you mean about the Suzuki cantatas. The secular box is the one box of his I still own, too. I think the most surprising cantatas set I own is Kuijken’s. Aside from his individual disc of 21, they never quite live up to anything from Herreweghe. But they always sound more interesting when I paid them with Gardiner. Needless to say, it’s Advent and I have Bach cantatas on my mind.
I received the Westminster box today and will spin a few tonite. Looks like some fabulous material inside (..a good bit of Scherchen….which is always a good thing imho!).
Bernstein Mahler SACD (non-hybrid) box is $143 at Amazon. Sold by Amazon Japan. States free shipping. https://www.amazon.com/Mahler-Compl...ocphy=9004054&hvtargid=pla-525868140441&psc=1
This was complete luck, I kept in contact with several people in other parts of the world and Europe is where most of these hard to find items have come from. I can't believe how good Herreweghe is. Kuijken is a great musician and I have been meaning to hear his recordings of the cantatas. Before it starts to sound like I'm some HIP crazed person, up there with my favorite performances of the B minor mass is Klemperer and Giulini also has a really beautiful one. When it rains it pours, got some other hard to find boxes as part of that package Caetani is basically Kondrashin (he studied with him) but with modern orchestral playing (no rough or ear piercing Soviet brass) and modern recording quality/mastering (would love to hear the Kondrashin mastering that doesn't have the noise reduction of the Melodiya glasses box).
I have the Richter big box. I haven't listened to his Cantatas, but I love his studio version on the Mass in B minor with the oh-so-slow Kyrie. (I find his Brandenburgs suprisingly fast)
Well, my 2€ 61CD Harnoncourt box has shipped! I also managed to find a new Ashkenazy Concertos Decca box for 45€ (so much for not spending any more money this year) Thanks, hvbias for adding two more things to my "ultimate must have, but will probably never find" wishlist.
medimops … they sell through multiple channels, including their own website. I often do random checks to see what they have listed in, for example, Amazon marketplace, eBay, or their own website. In this case I saw they had the Harnoncourt listed for about 75€ in Amazon and eBay, but it was listed at €2.22 on their website, so I snapped it up instantly. In the past, I've seen similarly mis-priced items in their eBay or Amazon listings. If you're registered on their website, you can add items to your wishlist and get notification emails when items become available, but there are often 20-30 other people watching that same item. I've found more bargains through random checks than I have through the notifications. (One exception being an Australian Brandenburg Orchestra disc that I got a notification for was listed for €4 but is now €40-50 on their site, so they corrected it. I hesitated too long on that one!)
I assume you mean this one, released in 2021: https://www.amazon.de/Bach-Collegium-Vocale-Gent/dp/B09QMQCXBZ/ref=sr_1_3?__mk_de_DE=ÅMÅŽÕÑ&crid=7KRIO49WB0U2&keywords=herreweghe+bach+phi&qid=1669918451&sprefix=herreweghe+bach+phi,aps,60&sr=8-3
Update on the Jessye Norman box set Order #305-2795039-6723560 Placed on 3. July 2021 New estimated delivery date: 8. January 2024 - 10. January 2024 I've also received a link to listen to the box on amazon music which unsurprisingly leads... nowhere.
