Collecting Live Yes

the QPR with a good sound would be fine.

 

1972. Fragile tour.

 

Not my clearest post. True.

I am talking about this particular aspect purely from a consumer / vfm point of view. I knew the box would be samey but bought it regardless as I wanted to hear it all. I enjoyed listening to it all. Some of the performances are really good. Some middling. All interesting to hear especially as it pre-dates the point in their history when I could go see them for real.

I was however irritated to pay that much and then see it all on Spotify. Had I known it would all be on streaming services I would probably have just bought the highlights set and played the rest once. Contents of other major artist box sets I have bought in the last few years have been exclusive to the physical realm other than maybe a taster sample. My fault. I should have waited or researched it better. Wont do that again.

Again in terms of value for money, and just referring to the newly mixed Progency source material, I could have happily lived with just having a spruced up Yessongs if that was a) possible and b) all they offered. If that was the product on offer then I wouldn't be holding my breath with anticipation to hear the rest of it. A complete show from that era wouldn't have been top of my wish list because Yessongs already exists.

Until fairly late on it had never occurred to me that Yes had never actually played a show back in the day where the set list was exactly as sequenced on Yessongs. As a kid I just assumed that those six sides were what they did on stage in the first Howe / White / Wakeman era prior to TFTO and the Bruford tracks were picked cos they liked those versions of those songs better. So there is an extent to which listening to Progeny is a little like going back to the first theatrical version of say Blade Runner having spent years watching the director's cut. Have never claimed to be consistent in my tastes.

As for the virtues of Yessongs as a recording, Fragile was my first Yes purchase but Yessongs was where they became my favourite band. Always had a soft spot for it regardless of whatever is supposed to be wrong with it. Obviously it would be nice to have a more pleasing sounding version but that hasn't stopped it being my first choice in terms of a go-to Yes album since 1974. Worth buying for the performances on sides 4 and 6 alone regardless of the audio quality. The performances are out of this world. Have never ever thought of it as one of Yes's many Frankenstein releases. Most of those are studio albums!

I prefer complete shows now, of course. Though generally speaking, one good, well recorded representative set from any given tour (doesn't even have to be every song taken from the same show) would be more than enough for me.

 

Question for the die hards; are any of the live albums / videos post 1991 highly regarded?
Montreux 2003 seems to be mentioned a lot

 

Personally, i don't view Yessongs as "frankensteined" at all. A few overdubs and edits here and there, and the setlist was revamped to fit for vinyl sides, but Kiss Alive! it is not.

 

Of the five (?) 21st century live records / dvds with Anderson, White, Squire and Howe I would imagine that most fans find it hard to identify much daylight between them.

A lot will depend on how the listener feels about The Ladder and Magnification and how much of a Wakeman fan they are.

House of Blues and Symphonic Yes are unique in the catalogue because of the line ups (no Rick / no resident keyboard player at all) but are probably not as popular as Montreux or Tsongas for that reason.

IIRC the Keys albums were really popular on release but I imagine it is the studio tracks that are most highly regarded all these years later.

The five live albums made by Yes and ARW since 2010 will obviously divide the room when strong allegiances come into play. All of them have really fine moments. All have their problems. Doubt any of them would attract a majority of positive reviews from the die hard fans.

 

For all the complaints about Yes not varying their setlists enough, Montreux 2003 has only six songs in common with Tsongas 2004. And some of those were reworked as acoustic numbers for the latter tour.

I like Montreux, but my preference is for Tsongas because it's a broader overview of the catalog. (There's even an ABWH number!) Montreux focuses much more on "Fragile."

Symphonic never quite clicked with me; the orchestra felt out of place. (Howe has expressed similar sentiments.)

I have the live videos and CDs from after the split, but none of them truly feels like Yes; they're more like nostalgic tributes. But Yes is hardly the only band to end up that way.

 

First of all, I didn't mean to be lampooning or taking the p!ss in my reply to your post. It's just that Progeny's release was so random and out-of-the-blue, not typical of Yes or any other rock band from the '60s --> mid '80s that I care about. I'd gladly take a Progeny from every Yes tour through Drama.

I have almost no use for Spotify, but understand where you're coming from.

Yessongs is a stone-cold classic, one of the finest live albums ever. It deserved a remix long ago, but many fans - maybe most - would end up not liking the new one. I don't know, it should sound better, but when I listen to it, I'm not bothered by the sound at all.

 

For a time Yes was doing live recordings/DVD's from every tour, which I believe is why there was so much variation. The real setlist problems happened in the post-Amderson years when they largely froze time at Drama (or Big Genrator in ARW's case).

 

I listened to the whole of Progeny once.
And never will again as much as I love it.

It took me a week (one show a day). I took notes as listened and then I selected my favorite bits of every song and then edited my own YesSongs.

Obviously there was no need for it since there is a single album version with "the best" of each show but I didn't have anything better to do.

 

That would be great, and i wouldn't mind if they would fix the few mistakes, like the out-of-key keyboards, or Moraz messing up the beginning of Yours is No Disgrace. But i seriously doubt they will ever re-release it for a number of reasons. It was originally released by Brian Lane as a Japan-only release, so i guess the negotations might be quite difficult, and secondly, there really is no market for a DVD anymore like there used to be.

 

The worst thing about QPR is how it was mixed. I'm not even sure it was mixed.

 

QPR was on laserdisc only, if I'm not mistaken. No separate audio or VHS release. It's too bad the first part is played in daylight, and the mix for the first 40 minutes is a mess. Only "Sweet Dreams" on Word Is Live has been officially released, so I wonder if they went to the multis in 2005 or took it from an earlier mix.

 

If I remember it well, "Sweet Dreams" is mono on Word Is Live and on QPR, so I assume it's the same mix.

 

The last 2/3rds is balanced. Not sure what that indicates, maybe the first third is so bad because it was actually coming from the board feed, and that's why Jon's rhythm guitar is overwhelming everything at times.

 

The second part of the show was broadcasted by BBC, so it was mixed. The first part has the monitor mix for the film crew. That's why it sounds so bad. The multitracks weren't yet found at that point.

It's the same old mono mix. In fact, nothing on Word Is Live was freshly remixed.

 

Although I agree that the setlists did not alter much, if at all on most tours, I disagree that the performances were "the same". Arrangements are the same for most, but not all, songs. But when looking at a song like "Heart of the Sunrise", the song basically is the arrangement, mess with that and you don't have the song anymore. (For the most part).

Listening to the Progeny box, I hear a big difference night to night on most songs. I'll take "Close to the Edge" as an example. A song that is long and follows the same arrangement night by night has so many different little elements that makes each one interesting to me. Varying tempos, etc. Steve Howe particularly and Rick Wakeman really do change up their approach, even though they have little riffs they often do night to night (as most players do even in the improvisational world).

I know it's not like the Dead (huge fan here on that and I buy all of the releases... so I'm familiar with differing nights by a band). But one of the most appealing things to me about Yes is their catalog. Those songs, those structures and how they put their heart and soul into it each night. - They weren't using click tracks and backing tapes (other than sound effects), so the soul of the music is there night by night and when you're a massive fan, that is totally gratifying. In fact, it's nice to hear the reality of a tour.

Now, if you're not a huge fan, then of course, there is no appeal to having 30 different live versions of "Siberian Khatru", but if it's there, I want to at least hear it.

I'm a huge Yes fan to the end... and yes, the split bothers me, but in different ways than other Yes fans but I don't have some of the problems other fans have with certain members concerning the split.

I've been seeing Yes live regularly since the 80's (well, not so much after the split) and I was a big fan of all the 90's material through Magnification and the tours as well. I agree, I was not crazy about the symphonic tour though. (my least favorite) I enjoyed it while I was at the shows a lot more than I thought I would, but it's not something I turn to as far as listening or watching often. It is a bit cold and a lot unnecessary, although it's a cool experiment I guess.

I was (and am) however a HUGE fan of the 2004 tour (the Tsongas DVD/BD) because of the great mix of songs and being played by the "classic" lineup. How cool was that? It gave me hope for the future. (That did not turn out the way I hoped! ) I also have to say, I do like Igor Khorshev and Billy Sherwood and all the members actually. It didn't have to be Rick on keyboards if he was unwilling or unable. (As much as I love him) I think later Yes had a lot to offer and probably that period of live playing from 1996-2004 has a lot more to offer than most realize. - For example, one of the tracks that didn't make the House of Yes DVD/CD was a version of "Hearts" from 90125 where Billy fills the Trevor Rabin role, but Howe comes in on steel for the choruses and it was a really cool arrangement of an obscure song. I think it was also performed in a different key. There was a lot of that kind of stuff in that time period.

 

The studio tracks from both Keys to Ascension albums are among my top favorites of all Yes tracks. Just something about everything recorded for that really moves me to this day. I love that stuff.

But I will say the live tracks from the first Keys to Ascension album are actually pretty great too. As far as later live versions of classic material. There was a lot of studio fixing on those, but it was worth it. At this point in time I'm sure they'll sound a little dated to most people (anything with Rick's keyboards since 1979 will sound that way I suppose), but the performances are great, I think everything is on that first one. They picked the best of the bunch and the live tracks on the 2nd album (with some exception) are the ones that really didn't come together or they didn't spend as much time editing/mixing/fixing.

The DVD however is lacking. It's got syncing issues and doesn't flow as a whole performance. I suppose some of that has to do with the fixing they did to the tracks in the studio and the video was more like an afterthought? Although I'm not sure about that...

 

Yes, and if you did have expertise into the particulars of this box set, you'd understand why this whole line of discussion is silly.

 

The DVD was straight-up unwatchable. What a disappointment that was.

 

Fair enough, but did you compare *your* "best of" with the official release?
If you made different selections, it was a worthwhile effort on your part.
I tend to give greater weight to better vocal performances. Especially with a band like Yes that had such a great singer.

B

 

Bingo. It's a classic case of false memory, nothing more.

 

Would you mind posting your set list and what shows they were from? I'd like to do the same thing.
I assume it will fit on 2 CDs?

 

Yes, it fits two CDs. But I lost the whole thing, even the notes I took.
Actually, I didn't lost it. It's locked in my external hd with a lot of other things (including the multi-tracks of my own music). I'm waiting for my brother to fix it.

 

I didn't compare them. I couldn't stand listening to Yes when I finished