Cones, stones, bones, and other "audiophile tweaks"

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by GT40sc, Mar 5, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. GT40sc

    GT40sc Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Eugene, Oregon
    Calling all "Tweak-Meisters"...what have you found to be most worthwhile...for the least money?

    At the moment I am most interested in the field of "vibration control," in particular the "cones" made by DH, Black Diamond Racing, and others. Brass, Carbon Fiber, whatever. Low-budget is also fine...of course I have read quite a lot about cutting up superballs---and I may go that way.

    Right now I have a set of vibrapods under a small speaker (Advent 3), with four heavy books on top of it...the improvement is surprising, but I am looking for a little more low-end response...

    Please note that this is for a MONO monitoring setup...I only need 3 or 4 cones, (or whatever)...what can I get for under $100?

    All are welcome, No Idea Too Strange, etc. Have at it...

    TIA,
     
  2. efhjr

    efhjr Idler Wheel Enthusiast

    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    I use RA Design Lab ceramic cones under my SACD player, DVD-A player, and tube amps (for amps: isoblocks -> maple cutting board -> RADL cones -- that's bottom to top).

    Under my turntable I use a combination of Polycrystal cones and RA Design Lab ceramic cones (RADL cones -> maple cutting board -> Polycrystal).

    I did it all on the cheap. The most I paid for any one tweak was $60 the Polycrystal cones. And it works like a charm.

    The RADL cones I got off of eBay, and they're quite inexpensive. Here are some for sale at Audiogon (insert standard disclaimer; I DO NOT KNOW this seller.)
     
  3. Ted Bell

    Ted Bell Forum Dentist

    How mant vibrapods is recommended to use under a 10 lb bookshelf speaker?
     
  4. GT40sc

    GT40sc Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Eugene, Oregon
    Jay,

    I don't know the answer...don't have "Listener" or "Positive Feedback" in front of me at the moment...

    I am using the 4 vibrapods I happen to have...the speaker is on its side, because it is most stable that way. I also mentioned the "books on top" because I have read that such weight can improve sound quality.

    So far I have found this to be true, but now I want to explore the "coupled vs de-coupled" side of the equation. Hence my interest in the cones...

    peace,
     
  5. 7_V

    7_V New Member

    This is a really tricky issue and there are no easy answers. Firstly, the type of floor that you have is of paramount importance. Then the question of how your equipment is itself coupled or isolated from the floor. Finally, there may be different solutions for different speakers.

    In general, speakers that are spiked to a floor will cause vibrations which can be audible in themselves and which can feedback to the equipment. On the other hand, without the spikes the speakers may themselves vibrate, muddying the bass response and compromising the imagery.

    My current thinking is that the whole question of speaker and equipment interface with the floor needs to be looked at afresh with each room/speaker combination.
     
  6. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    I found that the superballs worked better than the Black Diamond Racing Cones.

    But the heavy speakers wobble on the superballs.... so it's gotta be the cones for heavy stuff. Maybe with blue-tack or something.... I've gotta experiment.
     
  7. 7_V

    7_V New Member

    You forgot the doorstops, man. You forgot the doorstops.

    Or, if they wobble, the wobble frequency should be well below the audio spectrum ... unless you're worried about the kids pushing them over.
     
  8. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Naw, it's the cat. Or the W. with a laundry basket. Or me (I'm a klutz). :(

    They don't wobble by themselves! They gotta be physically helped to wobble! :eek:

    It's the superballs themselves that make the "wobble" and I don't think the doorstops will help at all. It's still a great idea, though - but I don't think they'll help my situation at all.

    What really would help.... is a new house with a dedicated listening room! :D
     
  9. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Steve - are those your speakers in your Avatar?
     
  10. 7_V

    7_V New Member

    Yup, those are my babies. Cute picture, eh?
     
  11. Dave

    Dave Esoteric Audio Research Specialistâ„¢

    Location:
    B.C.
    Very nice picture Steve. They look like they would sound nice as well. :)
     
  12. teaser5

    teaser5 Cool Rockin' Daddy

    Location:
    The DMV
    I have the Black Diamond Racing Cones under my Arcam FMJ CD Player.
    I think it sounds marginally better now. It's hard to say.

    I have those Totem Wind speakers that come with the little metal beaks on top.
    There was a big deal when they came out about how the beaks improved the sound.
    I read this study where they did a whole double blind thing with and without the beaks and the so called experts swore the beaks improved the sound...
    I dunno. Sounds good to me.

    Keep Tweekin'
    Best-
    Norm
    :edthumbs:
     
  13. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Don't the birds require their beaks? ;)

    What the heck is a beak?
     
  14. teaser5

    teaser5 Cool Rockin' Daddy

    Location:
    The DMV
    You can read all about the Totem Beak right here
    Scroll down...
    :righton:
    Cheers-
    Norm
     
  15. 7_V

    7_V New Member

    Norm, can you hear any differences with and without the beaks?
     
  16. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Amazing..... :eek:

    Thanks, Teaser5!
     
  17. Randy W

    Randy W Original Member

    In my experience, you want to couple the speakers to the floor with weight and spikes, and isolate the rest of your equipment with vibration absorbing material. Vibrapods, sorbogel feet and the like work well and are inexpensive. Spikes are not quite as effective as isolation devices. Placing absorbing material under a speaker will impact bass response and imaging negatively. You can also try adding weight or magic bricks on top of CD players and amps, which will help in most cases.
     
  18. teaser5

    teaser5 Cool Rockin' Daddy

    Location:
    The DMV
    Yeah I think so. But I also hear a difference if I move them around on top of the speakers or if I move the speaker a few inches one way or the other. It seems to be a constant thing. I will be listening and all of a sudden I will pop out of my chair and move a speaker a couple of inches. I have a big mother hi def TV and a center channel between my speakers which doesn't help matters. For me it's a constant struggle to make the room livable and keep the sound flowing. By putting two systems in one listening room I have managed to free my stereo from my surround system but have cluttered up the listening area.

    Cheers-
    Norm
     
  19. 7_V

    7_V New Member

    Well, that must make music listening a relaxing experience. :)

    Next time you pop out of your chair, maybe you could try moving the speakers a couple of inches further forward relative to your tv. It might help. Having some sort of absorbent cover made for the tv might also be an idea if it's really a problem.

    I'm really fascinated with these beak things. It's probably not worth me trying them with my speakers though as the mini line arrays that I use mean that there's less sound (above the bass region) going up there anyway.
     
  20. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
    This is pretty much what I do, along with room tunes which aren't too expensive either. I have brass spikes under my Thiels and sorbogel under the TT and CD player. My amps are on polycrystal platforms with spikes.
     
  21. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA

    I don't think these beak things would work too well with my Thiels but on my cheaper light weight speakers they might help. $200. is pretty expensive for probably a very small improvement.
     
  22. petermwilson

    petermwilson New Member

    Hi,
    I'm no scientist but I have to concur with Teaser5 regarding the Totem Beakes. The speakers that I use for music in my media room are Totem Model 1's, with the a pair of Signiture L/R and a Signature center. My surround L/R are Bi-Wirable but non signature Model 1's.

    The Tuning beakes are presently placed with a pair over the each woofer (or larger driver) on the center speaker which sits on top of an RPTV which is 27" deep and up against the wall. The other pair are placed (one each with blutak) in the center of each wall mounted surround about 1 1/2" in from the front, with the speakers angled towards the listening position.

    I have 2 other pairs of surrounds (Axiom qs4 dipoles) and (Monitor Bronze effects for the ex and es of so encoded films) which are not used when listening to music. All speakers are incurred when watching film.

    The music I use is from a collection of approx 300 hires dvd-a/sacd discs played on a couple of discontinued mltidisc players and connected to the 2 sets of analogs of my Denon 5800/03.

    I have tried with and without the beakes and I personally feel they very definitely make a difference in my room which is small at 15' X 12" X 8".

    If there are members in this discussion in the Toronto area who are seriously thinking of adding them to an existing very serious system , it might be possible to provide an audition.

    Members already owning Totem speakers or speakers in that quality range or above would probably be best capable of evaluating their effect, (or non effect for that matter).

    Peter m.
     
  23. Gary

    Gary Nauga Gort! Staff

    Location:
    Toronto
    Interesting! I am currently trying spikes with "blue tac" between the speakers and the spikes.

    Have you tried this? Do you think I should compare blue tac vs. no blue tac?
     
  24. Randy W

    Randy W Original Member

    Gary, I have not tried this because of the size and weight of my speakers. Since it doesn't cost anything, try anything you think might work. Then listen objectively for the change. That's the great thing about tweaking - big improvements for little cash outlay. Like Tullman said, don't forget about room treatments. I made up my own panels out of foamcore from Home Depot, covered with discounted fabric and placed at primary and secondary reflection points and room corners behind speakers. Total cash outlay - $200, improvement in sound reproduction - $10,000 worth of upgrades.
     
  25. petermwilson

    petermwilson New Member

    Hi,
    Another inexpensive sound absorber that can also be decorative are vertically hung rectangular area rugs. Places like Walmart sell them in different sizes but their absortive and decorative value can sometimes be as low as $10.00 a rug. If it doesn't do the job you can always take it back.

    Peter m.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine