Dave Brubeck 'Time Out' LP

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by James Glennon, Jan 21, 2014.

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  1. pbuzby

    pbuzby Senior Member

    Location:
    Chicago, IL, US
    Not sure which strange noises you have in mind, but I have noticed that on the original stereo mix of "Strange Meadow Lark" the left and center channels are muted leaving only Brubeck's piano on the right, while in more recent mixes the other channels are left up allowing some studio noise to be heard.
     
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  2. jonstatt

    jonstatt Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    The noises I hear are all from the right speaker. What I hear sounds a bit like someone slapping (gently) the piano cabinetry, or a wedding ring hitting one of the keys, or even noises from putting down and picking up the double bass (except that the bass doesn't come from the right speaker!)...also in a couple of loud moments the piano appears to distort slightly. These noises are particularly apparent in the latter stages of the track (a bit before and during the piano solo at the end). What is the most curious aspect of this, is that these same sounds although not as obvious are identically present on the CD version, but almost entirely removed on the SACD.
     
  3. duggadugdug

    duggadugdug Professional Dilettante

    Location:
    Eastern U.S.
    I'm a huge fan of the classic DBQ, and don't disagree. In fact, once you've listened to a lot of their live concert recordings from 1960 on, it's hard to go back and listen to the studio versions of both "Take Five" and even "Blue Rondo." They sound slow, hesitant, and a bit clunky when compared to the energetic, higher tempo performances that the Quartet fired off in live settings, once those complex tunes and rhythms had become second-nature to them.
     
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  4. The Beave

    The Beave My Wife Is My Life! And don’t I forget it!

    LOL!! sounds like you've got resolution coming out of your ears!! Wow, a wedding ring? How cool is this??? :goodie:
    Time Out and Dave Brubeck-the gift that just keeps on giving!!:shtiphat:
    the beave
     
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  5. jonstatt

    jonstatt Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    LOL! When I was asked "what sounds", I was trying to identify with what I was hearing and that was the closest I could get in my imagination :)

    BTW, to me the AP version is the most exciting to listen to compared to CD and Sony SACD versions. I haven't heard an original 6-eye
     
  6. ShockControl

    ShockControl Bon Vivant and Raconteur!

    Location:
    Lotus Land
    In comparing the mono and stereo versions of Time Out - and other Brubeck albums from that period - I think the balance between the drums and piano tends to be much better on the mono mixes. On the stereo mixes, the drums sometimes overwhelm. I love the stereo mixes, but I often tweak the balance knob slightly to bring down the drums.
     
  7. Daniel Thomas

    Daniel Thomas Forum Resident

    I've had both stereo and mono versions, liked the mono version more, and gave away the stereo to family. I prefer the unified sound, the punchy drums, the weightier sound. Not a very big fan of those wide-pannng stereo LPs from the late 1950s and 1960s. But either one would be a gem in anyone's record collection.
     
  8. dZp

    dZp Forum Resident

    Location:
    Herts, UK
    Anyone care to comment on this Green Corner label release of the Stereo and Mono LPs?
    Dave Brubeck Quartet, Label Green Corner »
    Anything in general about that label?
    I haven't had much luck finding anything half decent in the charity bins around my parts and would love to get a good vinyl copy of the album.
     
  9. dZp

    dZp Forum Resident

    Location:
    Herts, UK
    Help?

    :hide:
     
  10. Mastermold

    Mastermold Well-Known Member

    Location:
    France
    I got it on RSD in France. It's a 1500 limited run. Beautiful packaging. Very good and silent pressing. I can't really comment on sound quality as I only have a 1996 CD to compare. But I really like this release with a slight preference for the mono version.
     
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  11. dZp

    dZp Forum Resident

    Location:
    Herts, UK
    @Mastermold
    Thanks for the reply. I'm still on the fence with this release and hesitate to order it. There doesn't appear to be any info about the Green Corner label on the intarwebz apart from it being from EU with only 2 releases from them: Time Out (Mono/Stereo) and Miles Davis' Kind of Blue (Stereo/Mono). Nothing else I can find… and no reviews either about sources or SQ. :shake:

    I'm still hoping someone else on here could fill me in. Please!
     
  12. englishbob

    englishbob has left the SH Forums...19/05/2023

    Location:
    Kent, England
  13. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

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  14. englishbob

    englishbob has left the SH Forums...19/05/2023

    Location:
    Kent, England
    That's not the same one.
     
  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff

    Am I misunderstanding something? I am implying that the Green Corner 2-LP set that you are asking about is likely sourced from the 2-CD set that I linked. I realize that the LP you linked is not the CD that I linked. I'm saying that somebody likely took the CD that I linked and cut it to lacquers for LP production for the Green Corner LP.
     
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  16. englishbob

    englishbob has left the SH Forums...19/05/2023

    Location:
    Kent, England
  17. beccabear67

    beccabear67 Musical omnivore.

    Location:
    Victoria, Canada
    I think Take Five is that good that you really will want both stereo and mono, but also the 'Take Five Live' collection Viper Records put together.

    It seems to me that 1968 was about the first year where the mono mix started taking a back seat to stereo mix on just about every kind of album. This definitely happened earlier with jazz albums though.
     
  18. weaselriot

    weaselriot Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago, IL

    For US originated titles, the last dedicated mono mixes generally were late spring (end of May) 1968, but there was no US "switch" to fold-downs. Folds of US titles after May 1968 were usually UK releases of same, because UK wanted to continue mono releases but would no longer be able to get a mono tape of US titles after May 1968. UK titles continued in largely dedicated mono mixes with some folds through autumn 1968 before stopping altogether. US exceptions: "Cheap Thrills" was a late (August 1968) dedicated mono mix for some reason, "Bookends" contained some folds even in spring 1968, and Doors "Waiting for the Sun" (July 1968) I also understand to be a fold. Also "Last Time Around" I understand to be a promo only fold or maybe Haeco CSG-processed. For UK, there were also some folds even of UK titles before UK stopped their own mono about December 1968, most notably "Wheels of Fire" (our host himself has insisted no dedicated mono mix was ever made of this title), "Beggar's Banquet", and a few others claimed to be folds. I believe there is even a UK fold of "Let It Bleed" for late 1969.

    It should be noted that the US mono phaseout was announced by RCA and Columbia late May 1967 in Billboard magazine, declaring that after years of being told otherwise, consumers would now be advised that it was safe to play stereo LPs on "modern" mono players without damage, and by raising the price of mono to be the same as for stereo. Most main street retailers couldn't wait to drop mono and did so as soon as they got the word, but mono could still be had by special order and from record clubs, as well as the big super stores. But that only means increasing scarcity for US titles in mono as fewer were purchased by consumers as time went by until the end of May 1968. That means that the US mono titles from spring 1968 bring the biggest bucks on eBay.

    Interestingly, there are also a couple of very late UK dedicated mono mixes from as late as 1969 ("Arthur") and even 1970 (TYA's "Cricklewood Green"). Don't chase down "Arthur" high and low, it's not much of a revelation in mono, and you can get it along with the stereo on the 2 disc deluxe CD if you are curious and don't mind fairly bright mastering.

    SO FOR "RULE OF THUMB", subject to aforementioned exceptions: ANY US TITLE starting June 1968 onward is US release stereo only and UK release stereo and mono folds only (there being no US mono tapes provided); UK TITLES starting June 1968 are US release stereo only, and UK release stereo, with declining dedicated mono, and increasing folds through the end of the year. Thus June through December 1968 is your key phaseout window. BEWARE US origin "mono" released during that window as it is likely a fold of stereo for UK mono release, and even UK origin mono by late autumn 1968. And be VERY suspicious of any claimed "mono" from 1969 onward through the end of the mass produced vinyl era (not counting latter day "vanity" mono releases of newer titles by newer acts).

    DEFINITE post-June 1968 UK dedicated mono, worth seeking out (as UK releases): Beatles "White Album" (obviously, but get the stereo too, neither is "back seat"), Jeff Beck "Truth", "Kinks are the Village Green Preservation Society". Other dedicated mono includes Tull's "This Was" (mono was withdrawn UK) and Procol Harum's "Shine on Brightly" (no great revelation in mono, but you can get it anyway on Esoteric deluxe CD release). Like "Beggar's Banquet", "Traffic" (S/T) is believed to be a fold.

    It should be noted that even some late UK folds are worth a listen if not a hunt, including "Beggar's Banquet" for one. In addition to straight summation, some EQ may have been applied to change the balance to a punchier sound in keeping with mono. As far as "back seat" mix, the artists and producers largely focused on the mono mix and blew off the stereo for all titles until the labels virtually forced them to do otherwise, especially for US titles where the phaseout happened earlier. But for some late UK titles, the stereo and mono both got full attention, most particularly the White Album. Paul McCartney himself has said that the two mixes are almost like two different albums, and it is worth getting both. From this chair I still say the mono wins just the same.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2018
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  19. Tim 2

    Tim 2 MORE MUSIC PLEASE

    Location:
    Alberta Canada
    I heard a good mono version on a great system last weekend, very impressed but too many differences to pick a clear winner over the stereo version.
     
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  20. Fender Relic

    Fender Relic Forum Resident

    Location:
    PennsylBama
    For me,Time Out=mono. I waver sometimes on Kind Of Blue between mono/stereo but TO is an easy mono call to my ears.
     
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  21. MaxxMaxx4

    MaxxMaxx4 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Winnipeg Canada
    There's just too much going on there to not hear it in stereo
     
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  22. Unlike the stereo version of the "Giant Steps" album (which I consider dreadful), I think the stereo mix of "Time Out" is very well balanced.

     
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  23. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident In Memoriam

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    Mono. I also got a Brubeck In Japan album recently in stereo and much prefer the mono on that title.
     
  24. Listening to a 1961 mono pressing of this now, and this is what mono is all about. :D
     
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  25. Tom Daly

    Tom Daly Forum Resident

    Location:
    Missouri
    Actually, Paul Desmond, the composer, re-arranged "Take Five" for the 45 rpm recording because the engineers couldn't edit a piece that was in 5/4 time! Desmond had Joe Morello shorten his drum solo and the quartet got the tune down to 3:00. I rather like the single better than the album version, particularly because there's an obvious splice at 1:53 in the LP version that sticks out like a sore thumb!
     
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