David Bowie - Brilliant Adventure (1992-2001) [Box set #5]

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Ken_McAlinden, Sep 17, 2021.

  1. ralphb

    ralphb "First they came for..."

    Location:
    Brooklyn, New York
    Because of the experimental nature of Outside, it seems to me that it would benefit most from a stand alone box. So many songs, so many variations, so many ways to put it together as a listening experience, it's perfect for the box set treatment. To make it part of Brilliant Adventures wouldn't do it justice.
     
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  2. gomen ne

    gomen ne -

    Location:
    London
    I love the self portrait art - it seems to resurrect the spiky attitude that Bowie had around the time 1995-6, but it has been badly cropped, the colour has been poorly reproduced and I really think the fade between the art and the title graphics has been done really poorly. I hope this lack of care doesn't foreshadow the remastering and compilation. I'm sorry to always be negative but I think Parlophone usually kick the ball into an open goal and miss, like Diana Ross.
     
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  3. gomen ne

    gomen ne -

    Location:
    London
    Soooo right!
     
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  4. scenescof

    scenescof Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bath
    I think out of the two Toy would work on its own as it's quite commercial. An expanded version of Outside however would only be of interest to serious Bowie fans, which is why I think it would work better in box 5. It's more of a curio like The Gouster than a viable standalone release.
     
  5. ralphb

    ralphb "First they came for..."

    Location:
    Brooklyn, New York
    I doubt casual Bowie fans are going to pop for the box. At this point it should be about aiming these releases at the very serious fan base that Bowie has. It's not as if any of these sets is going to spawn a hit or go top twenty.
     
  6. gomen ne

    gomen ne -

    Location:
    London
    I don't think Toy would be commercial if anybody heard it before buying. All the tracks have had the life sucked out of them. As much as I love the 67 album, Toy is the sound of a tired old band going through the motions. Outside on the other hand still sounds fresh and vital. Mind you, I have no understanding of what people enjoy these days.
     
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  7. Vaughan

    Vaughan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Essex, UK
    I don't think there is such a divide with Bowie fans at this point, are there? People either want some Bowie or they don't, and if they've heard anything from this era it will be a track from one of the albums inside the box, so I'd say it would appeal. As for Toy being commercial - I'm not getting that. In what sense? It's not like he's around to promote it, or tour. At this point, is Toy really more commercial?
     
  8. muzzer

    muzzer Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    When, WHEN? did The Man behaving so poorly become just a ‘talk point’? 2000? Sick of it. And no less love for Bowie, OBVS. What a waste of effort. Give me the time to work out a DFW novel ffs
     
  9. falldog

    falldog Calmer Man

    Location:
    England
    I know! It's like I had to move house and I didn't know it was coming. The new place is fine, but I miss the old place.

    Fortunately, the move was premature so we're still speculating! Which is why I think the odd post that harks back to the pointlessness of the golden era of the speculation thread is probably still acceptable.

    Hence this. :D
     
  10. scenescof

    scenescof Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bath
    I think there's a big divide between casual and serious fans, and one of the main indicators is how the audience consumes the music. Casual listeners tend to listen to music predominantly via streaming, serious fans buy physical products. Casual listeners listen to conventional songs, serious fans are more likely to appreciate larger artistic statements that aim to challenge the listener. Toy is infinitely more commercial in the sense that it's packed with conventional songs and not elongated improvised jams, and it is likely to appeal beyond the hardcore fanbase. I don't think Parlophone would sacrifice the potential streams from casual listeners by making Toy a box exclusive, but I can realistically see them choosing an expanded Outside (which would have significantly less appeal among casual listeners) as a prompt for serious fans to invest in the product.
     
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  11. falldog

    falldog Calmer Man

    Location:
    England
    I think the OP used the term "commercial" to mean "accessible" - that is, a collection of 3-4 minute songs with vocals in some sort of verse/chorus structure. Something that Leon is surely not.

    I think it's entirely possible that neither has that much appeal outside of the hardcore fanbase (which is what I think you're saying here), but I know which one would go down better if I just started playing it in a generic room full of people :)

    In fact, it's quite interesting that in this "era" there are two unreleased album-length works that are so polar opposite in their approach to many things (new vs old, traditional structure vs chaos, crafted vs improvised).
     
  12. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    Each one of those were all previously released. (Granted, not necessarily in the time frame of the boxes).
    I was talking about studio stuff.

    Rules of the box sets:
    -Only studio stuff that was issued at the time
    -Each tour has to be represented by a previously released live album
    -Throw in a new remix of one of the album (The Gouster was part remix/part outtakes - the only exception)
    -Put all non-album tracks and special versions on Re:Call albums

    For the moment, all thoses rules were strictly applied.
    For Box 5, there would have been too many new live albums in the box, so they decided to create a separate box set for the live discs.
    Within that logic, previously released BBC should be the only live Lps in box 5.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2021
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  13. scenescof

    scenescof Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bath
    NLMD 2018 was another exception to the rules...

    To be honest, I think it's a mistake to think that there are rules at all. It's likely Bowie sketched out the plan for the boxes, but after he died Parlophone adapted the plan.
     
  14. PastaSource

    PastaSource Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Cambridge
    Isn't the fact that you mentioned The Gouster as being an exception pretty much blow the theory of rules for this series out the window? There has only been four boxes, with only 3/4 of them adhering to your rules. That's a really small sample size to be making such bold assumptions.
     
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  15. PastaSource

    PastaSource Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Cambridge
    Let us not forget that 'A New Career in a New Town" had two versions of Stage and two versions of Lodger, again, breaking the "rules".
     
  16. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    Not at all.
    It was the "new remix" of one of the album. It was the equivalent to Ziggy remix in Box 1, Station to station remix (with new digital drums) in Box 2, and Lodger remix in Box 3.
     
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  17. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    I admit it's not rocket science.
    But I really see a pattern, and a certain coherence to what they are doing.
     
  18. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    "Live" and "Stage" expanded were included because they were previously released (on cds).

    New Lodger was the mandatory "new version" of one of the albums.
     
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  19. PastaSource

    PastaSource Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Cambridge
    Perhaps it's just wishful thinking on my part, but I think the fact that they've decided to do the live albums separately for this boxset shows they're possibly trying to approach this boxset differently. Especially since it has been so long since the last boxset, it's given them a lot of time to work on it.
     
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  20. gomen ne

    gomen ne -

    Location:
    London
    Bowie never seemed to me to be a stickler for rules. He's gone, so we won't ever know, and people with financial interests will say what suits them, and all we can do is take what they say. The way Bowie's music has been handled since his death doesn't seem like Bowie's character to me. I know he did Bowie Bonds, but to me everything seems so capitalistic now. Like the Bowie brand Stylophone and the drink bottles and the frequent limited editions - it's just awful. Everything feels like it is being managed by a massive corporate entity with no love for the art, but a huge love for money, and unfortunately that is what Parlophone and Bowie Inc appear to be. They're great at making money and that's the reason why the Bowie Estate renewed Parlophone's contract.
     
  21. Oogie

    Oogie Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    I think possibly the bbc 2000 show could even be released as part of the toy boxset.
     
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  22. But Glastonbury?Storytellers?
    I don’t think there are any rules but they certainly want to put some box bait in there and for the CD version of this it would need to be something more significant than an Hours remix-although I think that will be part of it.
     
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  23. scenescof

    scenescof Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bath
    But it wasn't a remix, it was a rerecording! It was an entirely new concept for the box sets which broke the 'rules', as the BLA box has broken them for box 5!

    I get that looking for patterns is the natural thing to do, but IMO, the 'rules' we all thought were the case have been broken more times than they've been adhered to! Here's how the boxes compare so far:
    • Box 1: Studio albums and official live recordings from the period, a remixed album and Re:Call
    • Box 2: Studio albums and official live recordings from the period, an unreleased mix of an unreleased album, a remixed album and Re:Call
    • Box 3: Studio albums and official live recordings from the period, an EP as a standalone disc, a previously issued remixed album, a new remixed album, and Re:Call
    • Box 4: Studio albums and official live recordings from the period, a previously unreleased live album, a rerecording of an album, an unreleased remix album and Re:Call
    The only consistent pattern was that the studio albums and official live albums were released, but BLA's already muddied the waters for this... :doh:
     
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  24. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    A partial re-recording !
    Some elements were re-used from the original multitracks, starting with David's vocals :)
    And should I say again that the Station to Station remix in box 3 was also a partial re-recording (the drums were redone with electronic samples).

    You see, it's not all that simple. They're not doing randomless things. They're kind of following a general guideline.

    I bet you that TOY won't appear in box 5. It will be a stand-alone release (maybe that 6-Lp rumour thing).
     
  25. Zongadude

    Zongadude Music is the best

    Location:
    France
    Who knows ? Maybe they'll appear in the forthcoming box sets (I hope not).
     
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